1909-S IHC recent PCGS submission shows non TrueView image...are these the new Secure Plus™ scanner

Goldbully

I must assume so!!!







PCGS Link

commoncents05

I would assume so. Bravo to PCGS for starting this service!

-Paul

BigE

Looks like it, the video showed a little square picture area just like in those photos-----------BigE

fcloud

I just looked up my 1919-S dime. MS66+. They sure did a crappy one on mine.

adamlaneus

that is the softest strike i have ever seen

fcloud

<< <i>that is the softest strike i have ever seen >>



How about my image of the same coin.

devious

Is this only featured for US coins? Does it appear with the information in the cert. look up database? Curious.

fcloud

Foreign coins, too. When you do a PCGS cert verification on a secure plus coin it shows up. I see images on the few secure plus coins I have. It is there on all of mine.
COIN INFORMATION
Cert Verification #: 18379852
PCGS Coin #: 408286
Date, mintmark: 1959
Denomination: 1/4D
Variety:
Minor Variety:
Mint Error:
Pedigree:
Country: Ireland
Grade: MS65RD
Mintage:
PCGS Price GuideSM Value:
Holder Type: PCGS Secure Plus™
Population: 2

Lakesammman

Interesting........ thanks for the heads up!

illini420

WOW! I don't like this at all... if they were using accurate photos that would be one thing... but that just isn't the case!!! I did a cert lookup of my MS67+RD 1909 VDB and about gagged when I saw this:



I hope I never have to sell this one because if someone did a cert lookup first they'd probably back out of the deal!!! I don't have a great photo of it, but it's more like this in hand:



I would rather PCGS didn't publicly display these misleading photos!!!!!!!!!!!!!

canadanz

Yeah some of those are pretty terrible. Hope they improve the quality!

robkool

Kool...
PCGS MS62...

rlarick

<< <i>WOW! I don't like this at all... if they were using accurate photos that would be one thing... but that just isn't the case!!! I did a cert lookup of my MS67+RD 1909 VDB and about gagged when I saw this >>



Finally, I'm so glad to have real photos rather than your juiced ones. $25 for that coin and thats my last offer!

rlarick

well at least they are consistent.





these are my images;

Tdec1000

Pretty coin!

rlarick

<< <i>Pretty coin! >>



Wonder where that one came from? Thanks man! the uploader is acting silly for the last few days, otherwise I''d send you the real pics of it.

ambro51

Geez if these are the 'advanced' images that will allow diagnostic matchups based on the smallest detail.....HAHAHAHAHAHAHA




about all I can tell is that the coin is round. What are they using for a camera, a 110 instamatic and Rite-Aid film twenty years old?

dbcoin

They haven't announced this yet so I am sure it is in the tweaking phase.

As is it still looks like they can see if a coin has been AT'd or tooled since the last scan

Frankcoins

These are forensic image fingerprints, they are not supposed to be pretty images. It's a bit like an Xray looking a bit under the surfaces of the coin. They should match even if the coin has been messed with, ATed, cleaned, etc.

illini420

<< <i>These are forensic image fingerprints, they are not supposed to be pretty images. It's a bit like an Xray looking a bit under the surfaces of the coin. They should match even if the coin has been messed with, ATed, cleaned, etc. >>




I can appreciate that. But when they publicly post a horrible image of one of my great coins I do not think that is very cool, regardless of what they may use the image for internally.

messydesk

These are likely sufficient to determine that a coin offered in a particular holder is actually the coin that PCGS graded.

Goldbully

These are forensic image fingerprints, they are not supposed to be pretty images. It's a bit like an Xray looking a bit under the surfaces of the coin. They should match even if the coin has been messed with, ATed, cleaned, etc.

I can appreciate that. But when they publicly post a horrible image of one of my great coins I do not think that is very cool, regardless of what they may use the image for internally.

These are likely sufficient to determine that a coin offered in a particular holder is actually the coin that PCGS graded.

Three salient points for sure!!

illini420

Found another one of my coins with SecurePlus images posted in the cert verification... 1909 Matte Proof Lincoln PCGS PR65RB... not quite as bad as the pic of my VDB above:



But clearly isn't even close to being in the same league as the following professional image taken by Brandon Kelley:

adamlaneus

The lack of focus is astounding. It does not even seem to be a flat field. And it seems inconsistent based on the few examples provided here.
I certainly hope that these blurry images are not being used for anything.

robec

Even if you do have a TrueView, you can bring up the unfocused image if you click on the image and then click on the reverse of the larger image that follows. There is also a line under the TrueView image that says "Additional image: Obverse". This may only work on coins that have had TV's done within the past year or so.

Goldbully

<< <i>Even if you do have a TrueView, you can bring up the unfocused image if you click on the image and then click on the reverse of the larger image that follows. There is also a line under the TrueView image that says "Additional image: Obverse". This may only work on coins that have had TV's done within the past year or so. >>




Thanks for the heads up robec........here's my 1834 CBH bought from Mr. Dick Osburn.



I then clicked on Additional image: Obverse


PCGS Certification

smokincoin

For those of you who have received a "+" graded coin... does the Pcgs pop shown on this Cert. Veri. include the non-plused coins? In other words... I do not, currently, have access to the Pcgs pop page, but I can look up the cert. veri. and when I go to look up your plused coin's cert. veri. I'm seeing lot's of coins.

edited to add: For example... fcloud's 1919-S dime MS66+. What's the pop of this coin compared to the pop listed on the coin's cert. veri. page?

illini420

<< <i>For those of you who have received a "+" graded coin... does the Pcgs pop shown on this Cert. Veri. include the non-plused coins? In other words... I do not, currently, have access to the Pcgs pop page, but I can look up the cert. veri. and when I go to look up your plused coin's cert. veri. I'm seeing lot's of coins.

edited to add: For example... fcloud's 1919-S dime MS66+. What's the pop of this coin compared to the pop listed on the coin's cert. veri. page? >>



interesting. the 1909 VDB in MS67+RD is currently a pop 1 coin w/ 1 MS68RD grading higher. There are 205 PCGS MS67RD examples out there. When I bring up the cert no. for my 67+RD, I get 205 as the population which is the 67RD pop and NOT the 67+RD pop.

smokincoin

<< <i>

<< <i>For those of you who have received a "+" graded coin... does the Pcgs pop shown on this Cert. Veri. include the non-plused coins? In other words... I do not, currently, have access to the Pcgs pop page, but I can look up the cert. veri. and when I go to look up your plused coin's cert. veri. I'm seeing lot's of coins.

edited to add: For example... fcloud's 1919-S dime MS66+. What's the pop of this coin compared to the pop listed on the coin's cert. veri. page? >>



interesting. the 1909 VDB in MS67+RD is currently a pop 1 coin w/ 1 MS68RD grading higher. There are 205 PCGS MS67RD examples out there. When I bring up the cert no. for my 67+RD, I get 205 as the population which is the 67RD pop and NOT the 67+RD pop. >>


Thanks! I hope they get this corrected!

fcloud

My 1919-S shows as pop 1/2. The two higher coins are both MS67.

smokincoin

<< <i>My 1919-S shows as pop 1/2. The two higher coins are both MS67. >>


What does the cert. veri. page show?

fcloud

COIN INFORMATION
Cert Verification #: XXXXXXXX
PCGS Coin #: 4926
Date, mintmark: 1919-S
Denomination: 10C
Variety:
Minor Variety:
Mint Error:
Pedigree: A. R. S. Collection
Country: The United States of America
Grade: MS66+
Mintage: 8,850,000
PCGS Price GuideSM Value: $2,000
Holder Type: PCGS Secure Plus™
Population: 14

smokincoin

Thanks!

fcloud

You're welcome. They must be lumping plus and non-plus coins to for the pop on the cert veri.

smokincoin

Yea, I just wanted to expose what I thought to be a flaw in the system. I think if it's a "+" coin, then the "+" pop should be shown when looking up a cert.
btw... That's a nice dime!

tjc2120

These images must have a use or why do them. They look like they have all been done with a particular technique that, as has been posted, creates a forensic image that can be compared to future images (taken with the same technique) to highlight changes that are diagnostic for, or at least suspicious for, certain kinds of doctoring.

Very cool. I hope we get the technical explanation at some point. Maybe some kind of x ray scatter or infrared.

smokincoin

tjc2120, Have you seen the video?

BillyGoatsGruff

<< <i>Interesting........ thanks for the heads up!




>>




Lakesammman - I really like that Oregon!

magikbilly

Hi,

Does it strike anyone else that the 1909 VDB image make the coin look "that pink"?

Eric

adamlaneus

For the purposes of coin identification, I don't think absolute color matters as much as patterns and contrast does.
These scan images do not appear to be for human eyes, but for image analysis.

[edited to be more accurate in what I meant]

Justacommeman

Please note that this is not a real picture of the Mona Lisa. MJ

magikbilly

...

rlarick

This forum is very active, I am surprised that knowledgeable answers to questions like this come so slow.

Goldbully

MJ, you are one funny man!!!!


The other five of my Secure+ TrueViews for your observation.......................

magikbilly

Hmmm. You know, I don't think I would be very keen on letting some people photograph my rare collectibles without my express permission to assemble a database that generates revenue without paying me a....... fee.

ERIC

relicsncoins

Here is another Merc. Graded 66FB.

PCGS secure photo.



Here is my photo.

clackamas

yeh this is wierd. here is the Pic of my condition census 45-S Jefferson's secure plus cert verification photo --- eeegads:

Here is the pic that is used in coin facts on the coin:

Frankcoins

Relax, folks..It's similar to comparing a photograph to an infrared image. It's supposed to show things that do not show in a regular photo.

Goldbully

<< <i>Relax, folks..It's similar to comparing a photograph to an infrared image. It's supposed to show things that do not show in a regular photo.

>>



Nice analogy, Frank!!!

rlarick

<< <i>Relax, folks..It's similar to comparing a photograph to an infrared image. It's supposed to show things that do not show in a regular photo >>




Okaaaaaay if you say so. It's obviously not an infrared image, so what kind of image is it? At least an infrared image is identifiable by inverse colors and thermal differences. These images are blurry. I contend that these are not any thing like an infrared image since there is so much loss of detail. Why hasn't anyone answered knowledgeably of what these images are? Are there no PCGS peeps monitoring this board or is that normal?



For example this is a 1909 Lincoln Cent with inverted colors, reduced to 64 colors, then bent spherically, animated with 10 frames right to left on a endless loop. Are there no techies here? I'd like to think I know a little bit bout sumthin and I can't figure out how those images can be read.

CoinRaritiesOnline

ttt

Interesting thread.

My guess those images were done with a $39 flatbed scanner, and are not some super-scientific images that magically see inside the soul of a coin.

Just a guess, of course.