Early Netherlands Ducat question

gummibear

Hello,
I got this one a little while ago and have been trying to find out about the lamb privy mark on the obverse. Does anyone have any information on it or know where I might find some. I bought this one because I like the double strike and the lamb seemed interesting to try and track down. I haven't found the lamb on any other dates yet.

Thanks,
Richard

1674, Netherlands, Utrecht. Gold Knight Ducat.

Silvereagle82

gummibear ...
I can't add much more than telling you that according to Delmonte's reference book "Le Benelux D'or' Utrecht ducats minted in 1674 and 1675 had lamb privy marks. Why ?? Rarity is R.1-R.2 . Based upon a R.0 (Common) - R.4 (of the highest rarity ie. 2 or 3 known examples) scale.

Hussulo

Very nice.

"The Agnus Dei or Lamb of God symbol, typically shows a lamb, holding a cross or a flag. The Agnus Dei probably goes back to 5th century Rome. Discs of wax imprinted with the lamb, blessed by the Pope, were used from the ninth century, and probably earlier. "

http://www.jesuswalk.com/lamb/lamb-agnus-dei-artwork.htm

I've seen the Lamb of God on a few coins but can' remember seeing it as a privy mark before.

DennisH

I like these pretty little things!
Mine doesn't have a sheep but it does have an overdate... which as a Morgan dollar VAM guy I just had to have:

Andres

most old dutch golden ducats had no minters mark untill the 1820's
but some did, like the lamb mark.
here's another one with a rose mint mark
both ducats were minted in Utrecht = TRA short for traijectum, the old roman latin name for Utrecht



the more recent struck ducats between 1820-2010 have both a minter's mark and the mintplace
mintplace is always Utrecht , the only mint place left after 1800 , the symbol is the Mercurius staff.
the older ducats have these symbols placed on the top of the coin, the more modern ones
have the symbols at the bottum.

DennisH

Does anyone know what the wording on the reverse says?

Silvereagle82

REVERSE: Legend or motto on tablet. “MONETA ORDINUM PROVINCIARUM FOEDERATARUM BELGII AD LEGEM IMPERII” translates “Coin of the Provinces of the United Netherlands According To The Law of The Empire

DennisH

<< <i>REVERSE: Legend or motto on tablet. “MONETA ORDINUM PROVINCIARUM FOEDERATARUM BELGII AD LEGEM IMPERII” translates “Coin of the Provinces of the United Netherlands According To The Law of The Empire >>

WOW! Thanks so much for the translation. I figured a bunch of the lettering was abbreviation, but I had no idea it was that extensive.

gummibear

<< <i>gummibear ...
I can't add much more than telling you that according to Delmonte's reference book "Le Benelux D'or' Utrecht ducats minted in 1674 and 1675 had lamb privy marks. Why ?? Rarity is R.1-R.2 . Based upon a R.0 (Common) - R.4 (of the highest rarity ie. 2 or 3 known examples) scale. >>



THanks, SE82
That help a lot. Nice to know it is not the most common. Do you think it is worth the effort of grading and does pcgs even grade these?

Thanks also to Hussulo, Dennis and Andres for the information you gave as well. It was helpful and interesting.

Dennis do they not even consider your beautiful piece a double strike? Or is that just so common on this era it is not considered an error or noted?
Thanks,
Richard

DennisH

Richard:

Based upon the other coins I have from the 1500s and 1600s, double-striking seems to have been so common that if I were a TPG I would consider it normal.