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Stewart Blay #1 Flying Eagle...How?

MarkBenMarkBen Posts: 154
in PCGS Set Registry Forum
Congratulations to Stewart Blay, who re-claimed the #1 spot today for Flying Eagle Circulation strikes, major varieties. ("The Best" collection)

So Stewart, can you tell us how you did it? Did you obtain one of the 1856s in MS66?

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    BWRCBWRC Posts: 1,447 ✭✭✭

    Here is your answer,

    The 1856 MS66 population has increased from 2 to 3, Congrats to Stewart!!
    Brian Wagner Rare Coins, Specializing in PCGS graded, Shield, Liberty and Buffalo Nickels varieties.
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    MarkBenMarkBen Posts: 154
    When I checked the population reports, I noticed that there is now one 1856 that is graded 65+. So, I'm taking a guess that Stewart sent in his 1856 and got it "re-upgraded" to 65+. There are still two that are graded MS66.
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    BWRCBWRC Posts: 1,447 ✭✭✭


    << <i>When I checked the population reports, I noticed that there is now one 1856 that is graded 65+. So, I'm taking a guess that Stewart sent in his 1856 and got it "re-upgraded" to 65+. There are still two that are graded MS66. >>



    Sorry, I jumped the gun.

    I stand corrected, Stewart's 1856 S-3 MS65 has been upgraded to MS 65+.
    Brian Wagner Rare Coins, Specializing in PCGS graded, Shield, Liberty and Buffalo Nickels varieties.
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    HdHunterHdHunter Posts: 133
    Stewart:
    Congratulations on reclaiming the lead, but remember what you once told me "you never stop upgrading your collection". Those MS66's still loom large out there....
    Jonathan
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    illini420illini420 Posts: 11,466 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Very cool. image

    However, I thought I remembered hearing that PCGS will now only grade the 1856 as a Proof and not as an MS coin. I searched the PCGS website to confirm, but couldn't find anything... was I just imagining that??? Seems so if they just graded one an MS65+.

    Michael Kittle Rare Coins --- 1908-S Indian Head Cent Grading Set --- No. 1 1909 Mint Set --- Kittlecoins on Facebook --- Long Beach Table 448

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    STEWARTBLAYNUMISSTEWARTBLAYNUMIS Posts: 2,697 ✭✭✭✭
    Jonathan - One of the two 1856 Flying Eagles in MS 66 is an S-9 and looks Proof to every knowledgeable Numismatist. It is a very nice coin but IMO should have been called a Proof. The other MS 66 was originally in the Alan Epstein collection and then in the Gorell collection before it was bought by Jay Parino. I personally like my 1856 more. I tried my coin several times for a MS 66. It finally upgraded to MS 65+ but if I can bring my coin and the ex Alan Epstein coin together I feel I could convince PCGS to upgrade my coin to MS 66. At this juncture I feel 65+ is OK because the only other MS 65 coin that is close to my coin is the ex Dr. Larson coin.

    Illini 420 - Proof is a method of manufacture. A mint state coin is also a method of manufacture. I don't think any 1856 was made to be circulated but some have been made as mint state coins. I believe PCGS will call mint state coins as such if they look like mint state coins and Proof coins such if they were made as such. I would advise collectors to buy only PCGS coins gRaded ms 64+ or better if they want to own a mint state example.I would also recommend the coin to be shown to Brian Wagner, Rick Snow or myself for an opinion.

    Stewart Blay
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    BochimanBochiman Posts: 25,305 ✭✭✭✭✭


    << <i>.....I would also recommend the coin to be shown to Brian Wagner, Rick Snow or myself for an opinion.

    Stewart Blay >>



    So, Stewie.....are you going to have your own sticker too? image

    I've been told I tolerate fools poorly...that may explain things if I have a problem with you. Current ebay items - Nothing at the moment

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    HdHunterHdHunter Posts: 133
    Stewart,
    As always, thanks for the illuminating clarification. Brian Wagner also reminded me of this. I also understand your staying with the coin that you “like more”, irrespective of the grade. I also have passed on coins in higher grade that do not match my personal liking. As has been said many times before, "buy the coin, not the holder".
    Take care,

    Jonathan
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    ProofCentsProofCents Posts: 1,656
    Stewart,

    Can you post a pic?

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    STEWARTBLAYNUMISSTEWARTBLAYNUMIS Posts: 2,697 ✭✭✭✭

    Proof Cents - I opened my set up and you can view my 1856.

    Stewart
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    ProofCentsProofCents Posts: 1,656
    image

    What a Coin!!!!
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    illini420illini420 Posts: 11,466 ✭✭✭✭✭
    very beautiful and doesn't seem to be much if anything wrong with it... hard to believe that is maxed out at 65+ image

    Michael Kittle Rare Coins --- 1908-S Indian Head Cent Grading Set --- No. 1 1909 Mint Set --- Kittlecoins on Facebook --- Long Beach Table 448

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    blu62vetteblu62vette Posts: 11,901 ✭✭✭✭✭
    This is a great coin. Congrads Stewart!!
    http://www.bluccphotos.com" target="new">BluCC Photos Shows for onsite imaging: Nov Baltimore, FUN, Long Beach http://www.facebook.com/bluccphotos" target="new">BluCC on Facebook
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    BigRickBigRick Posts: 1,334
    The '56 looks like a cameo. WOW!
    My Sets
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    DAMDAM Posts: 2,410 ✭✭
    Thanks for showing Stewart. Very nice!
    Dan
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    MarkBenMarkBen Posts: 154
    Thanks for showing us, Stewart. I really appreciate your efforts to educate other collectors....
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    bolivarshagnastybolivarshagnasty Posts: 7,350 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Stewart, Not knowing either one of you, I would assume that your comment's on Tom Bender's set is tongue in cheek????
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    BWRCBWRC Posts: 1,447 ✭✭✭

    Here is a picture of the coin that Stewart mentions in this thread. Once owned by Dr Tim Larson.


    imageimage
    Brian Wagner Rare Coins, Specializing in PCGS graded, Shield, Liberty and Buffalo Nickels varieties.
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    DAMDAM Posts: 2,410 ✭✭
    I'd love to see them together in person. I think Stewart might have a good case for an upgrade, based on image comparison.
    Dan
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    BGBG Posts: 1,762 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Based on the images alone, the Dr. Larsen example looks better struck but Stewarts coin has better color and lustre.
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    zepzep Posts: 81 ✭✭
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    STEWARTBLAYNUMISSTEWARTBLAYNUMIS Posts: 2,697 ✭✭✭✭

    Good observations Dan ! Perhaps someone can post the 1856 S-3 MS 66 from the Joseph Gorell sale during the January 2003 Heritage FUN sale.

    My observation would persuade one to believe that both the ex. Dr. Larsen coin and my coin should also grade MS 66.

    Stewart Blay
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    zepzep Posts: 81 ✭✭
    Stewart: The 1856 FE that you describe as S-9 is actually the S-5 die variety. It is featured on the cover of the June 2000 Superior auction catalog where the dot under the U is obvious. The second edition Snow book, which contained important revised information, does not mention proof when describing this variety. Also, PCGS has seen the coin several times and has confirmed its mint state grade.
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    BWRCBWRC Posts: 1,447 ✭✭✭


    << <i>Stewart: The 1856 FE that you describe as S-9 is actually the S-5 die variety. It is featured on the cover of the June 2000 Superior auction catalog where the dot under the U is obvious. The second edition Snow book, which contained important revised information, does not mention proof when describing this variety. Also, PCGS has seen the coin several times and has confirmed its mint state grade. >>



    Zep,

    Your are correct.

    Alan Epsteins 1856 is the S-5 variety, graded MS66 by PCGS. The other PCGS MS66 is the S-3 variety.

    The story on the 1856 S-3 PCGS MS 66 is:
    Eagle Eye Rare coins (Rick Snow and Brian Wagner) purchased this coin from Heritage for about $18,500 in 1996. We then sold it to Joe Gorrell.

    Joe Gorrell's entire collection was sold in January 2003 at the Heritage FUN auction. Jay Parino bought the coin out of that auction for $103,500. The next year at the same show, the coins sells again, this time for $172,500!
    Brian Wagner Rare Coins, Specializing in PCGS graded, Shield, Liberty and Buffalo Nickels varieties.
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    STEWARTBLAYNUMISSTEWARTBLAYNUMIS Posts: 2,697 ✭✭✭✭
    Zep - You are correct ! It is an S-5. It is certified by PCGS as an MS 66 and not a Proof. However myself and several other numismatists who viewed the coin believe it was struck as a proof. It is a gorgeous coin but does not have mint state(cartwheel) luster and the surfaces are highly reflective.

    Stewart
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    BWRCBWRC Posts: 1,447 ✭✭✭


    << <i>Zep - You are correct ! It is an S-5. It is certified by PCGS as an MS 66 and not a Proof. However myself and several other numismatists who viewed the coin believe it was struck as a proof. It is a gorgeous coin but does not have mint state(cartwheel) luster and the surfaces are highly reflective.

    Stewart >>



    I believe Rick Snow considers the S-5 variety a proof striking.

    Click the link below, It will take you to the Heritage archive where you can view the 1856 S-3 PCGS MS66 coin,

    1856 S-3 PCGS MS66 Fly Eagle Cent
    Brian Wagner Rare Coins, Specializing in PCGS graded, Shield, Liberty and Buffalo Nickels varieties.
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    MarkBenMarkBen Posts: 154
    Well, Stewart, the pictures of that 1856 are amazing. That's quite a set, although I think I have the best 1858/7.

    At any rate, since we are drooling over your pictures, how about a peak at the Princess? (1877).
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    BWRCBWRC Posts: 1,447 ✭✭✭


    << <i>Well, Stewart, the pictures of that 1856 are amazing. That's quite a set, although I think I have the best 1858/7.

    At any rate, since we are drooling over your pictures, how about a peak at the Princess? (1877). >>



    I have owned your 1858/7 and have seen 2 others. I would agree with you, image
    Brian Wagner Rare Coins, Specializing in PCGS graded, Shield, Liberty and Buffalo Nickels varieties.
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    BWRCBWRC Posts: 1,447 ✭✭✭

    Here is Stewart's 1877! the best!

    Stewart, how about trying for the + on this one?

    image
    Brian Wagner Rare Coins, Specializing in PCGS graded, Shield, Liberty and Buffalo Nickels varieties.
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    STEWARTBLAYNUMISSTEWARTBLAYNUMIS Posts: 2,697 ✭✭✭✭
    Hi Brian,

    Do you think either my 1856 or my 1877 should upgrade instead of just a plus ?

    MarkBen - I will agree with you that you probably have the nicest 1858/7. I will also say I rate mine ahead of Tom Benders.

    Stewart
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    BWRCBWRC Posts: 1,447 ✭✭✭


    << <i>Hi Brian,

    Do you think either my 1856 or my 1877 should upgrade instead of just a plus ?

    MarkBen - I will agree with you that you probably have the nicest 1858/7. I will also say I rate mine ahead of Tom Benders.

    Stewart >>



    If I was in the position to call the grades of your two coins. I would give each of them a full point upgrade.
    Brian Wagner Rare Coins, Specializing in PCGS graded, Shield, Liberty and Buffalo Nickels varieties.
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    MarkBenMarkBen Posts: 154
    Really impressive, Stewart. I don't know what else to say.
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    DuaneDuane Posts: 645
    Stewart,

    Well done. That is an impressive 1856! Imagine if that coin could talk.

    Duane
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    DMWJRDMWJR Posts: 5,975 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Stewart, I haven't been on the boards much and missed this thread! looks like that baby got at least part of the credit it is due!
    Doug
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    OchoRealesOchoReales Posts: 1,500 ✭
    I would also recommend the coin to be shown to Brian Wagner, Rick Snow or myself for an opinion.

    Stewart, how is Dino's acumen with regards to these?

    Lurker since '02. Got the seven year itch!

    Gary
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    STEWARTBLAYNUMISSTEWARTBLAYNUMIS Posts: 2,697 ✭✭✭✭

    Dino is pretty darn good. He showed me the 1858/7 MS 65 after he made it .I was impressed ! I would like to see his variety collection . It is suppose to be the Best !

    Stewart
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