Population One Coins
Higashiyama
Posts: 2,192 ✭✭✭✭✭
How many population one coins are there, and what do you think is the largest number owned by any single collector?
Higashiyama
0
Comments
Thanks,
Tim
Oh - I forgot - you probably only count sets currently registered - that makes my collection a non-entity. Darn those "Phantom Cameos"!
Obscurum per obscurius
There is absolutely no good business reason to inflate the Eliasberg grades and add the "Phantom Cameo" designation to his proof trade dollars. I can only conclude that PCGS has an agenda on this issue. The result is that several leading Registry sets are poised to switch to NGC. It is disappointing to face the fact that a highly respected public company would put petty politics ahead of shareholder value.
Pop.1 coins are fun to have, but much more fun to "make" - kinda like Jiffy Pop.
PS. Full Steps, I love your icon.
In TDN's case, I'm not sure that is true. His coins surpass the next nearest grades sometimes by 2 grades. And even then, the pop in the nearest grade is usually really small. My bet is that on some of these coins, it might be some time before they are met or exceeded. I hate to say never.....thats about as close as I come.
keoj
In God We Trust.... all others pay in Gold and Silver!
I have a pop1 coin and it means a lot to me.
Registry 1909-1958 Proof Lincolns
In God We Trust.... all others pay in Gold and Silver!
peacockcoins
DAN
My first tassa slap 3/3/04
My shiny cents
Spooly: are sour grapes in season again?
You have likely owned more imporant "pop 1" 20th Century rarities in the past 5 years than anyone out there- period. Your "pop 1" coins are not the "boring" type Spooly yawns over. Your pop 1 coins are what many collectors dream of owning and have "begged" you to part with and when you did let them go become the "centerpieces" of those collectors' #1 sets.
I don't own the "pop 1" 1932(d) quarter in MS66 in my quarter set (I do own the pop 1 1932(p) though) and my "defense mechanism" also says to me "boring, blah, who needs that coin". Probably a week doesn't go by where I don't convince myself that my MS65 1932(d) is just fine and that MS66 coin is simply overrated! Truth is that kind of talk (to myself) gets more through the day
Those who don't have these coins assume that they are accumulated only with wads of money. They don't realize that some pop.1 coins aren't sold at "hostage" prices, and available to anyone.
Those coins, though, go to special customers that gain the respect of the dealers, like TDN.
Although I point it out, I gladly accept all the "sour grape" comments, as it shows that those making negative remarks have a greater animosity, than a positive sense of our community.
In God We Trust.... all others pay in Gold and Silver!
"Sour grapes" have nothing to do with your comments?...Really.
Now, if you actually saw the coin(s), or admitted that you have not seen the coins, that would be different.
I stand by my comments, and think that your remarks are devisive, and unfounded.
In God We Trust.... all others pay in Gold and Silver!
I'm going to hazard a guess and say the real pop 1 king is the proud owner of the Childs 1804 dollar. From what I understand, his early collection is simply superb. I believe he doesn't retain any of the slabs, but I'm certain his overall quality cannot be disputed.
I'm also going to hazard a guess and predict that eventually very few 20th century coins will remain a pop 1 with none finer. There were simply too many uncirculated/proof coins retained of every date and mintmark - the odds are against one coin being significantly finer than every other coin produced and saved. I would have to agree with Spooly on this century's coinage.
For the 18th and 19th centuries I would think there are plenty of examples where one coin is head and shoulders above the others and will forever remain a pop 1 with none finer. Certainly there can be examples where a pop 1 coin is not significantly finer than those below it because of grading transitions, stretching on a grade, etc. But the wonder coins of yesterday are the wonder coins of today are the wonder coins of tomorrow - a coin that is acknowledged by experts in the field to be head and shoulders above the other examples of that date and mintmark is to be admired by all!!!!
" I guess that depends on what you call "great"."
That's my point! People think "POP1" means a great coin........ it doesn't.
In God We Trust.... all others pay in Gold and Silver!
In God We Trust.... all others pay in Gold and Silver!
1. Spooly: For the love of God, tell us all already what this "crummy" "pop 1" coin you own is!!
2. TDN: You view that, essentially, only the 18th and 19th century coins are great rarities, but that the 20th century "pop 1" coins are not is nothing but utter ELITIST BS imho!! If I wanted to take the time, I could show you that a coin as simple as a 1963(d) Memorial penny in merely MS67RD grade is rarer than many of your trade dollar "rarities". But, why bother - you wouldn't believe me anyway
Wondercoin.
P.S. Do you realize that "you" have probably sold my "big customer" more dollars in coins than I have
There you go, putting unfounded words in people's mouths. Now, its AU 1873CC trade dollars. Glad we write these things down or you would be insisting I said that.
P.S. Do you realize that "you" have probably sold my "big customer" more dollars in coins than I have Boy is that childish
Why don't you stop the name calling and maybe we can learn from each other
Wondercoin: I have sold nothing to your big customer although I have only respect for him. It's your obvious pandering and hype for which I have no respect. In viewing your threads over the past year, it's pretty apparent how you work - a little dig here, a little hype there, a reverse hype here and a backhand swipe there. All just to keep the subject up at the top of the threads. You are the number one guy who fosters the "modern vs classic" war on this chatroom and, in my opinion, it's all done for your personal benefit.
I reiterate my opinion: The coins you hype as rarities are "pop 1 disasters" waiting to happen. For the most part, there are thousands and thousands of uncirculated specimens that are sitting in rolls or bags. Simple mathmatics dictates that equal specimens are present in those areas. I made no statements about the disirability of those coins - I am certain there is a segment of the collecting public that doesn't care if their MS67 1963d Lincoln cent is a pop 1 or a pop 100. My statement was that the odds of them remaining pop 1 coins was mathmatically infintesimal. The odds of another great trade dollar rarity appearing are not zero, but are near zero when the compared to the odds of your modern coin remaining a pop 1.
And by the way, an AU 73CC trade dollar is not a rarity - if you knew anything about the series you'd know it was fairly common.
My point is that, though original bags aren't common in such cared for condition, they are not unheard of. I wouldn't be surprised to hear of a bag of '63 cents showing up. On the other hand, I would be very surprised if an original bag of trade dollars did show up. We've heard about the hoard of 50 or so '78-S's that turned up, so it's not entirely impossible. It's much more likely that rolls and bags of more recent coins will show up.
Putting a Memorial cent and a trade dollar on the same level of rarity seems really bizarre.
Obscurum per obscurius
Wondercoin.
Well, coming from someone so "highly respected", I would also love to hear an answer to pop1's question. I've surely been in those trenches, just like pop 1 has. My knowledge is from pure experience, not "anti-hype"
Wondercoin.
Hello Pot, meet Mr. Kettle.
Well said Greg. Pot calling the kettle black! At least there is a point to the Eliasberg coins.
All that matters is it's a POP1.. Super Coin!... THE VERY BEST! It's the Greatest Coin Ever for it's type! Because it's a PCGS POP1! And it's a 1800's coin too boot!
In God We Trust.... all others pay in Gold and Silver!
Obscurum per obscurius
If you get a 1963D Lincoln in ms67rd, I'd sure like to look at it; and if satisfactory, I'd pay top dollar (no pun intended, TDN). Someone has looked through hundreds of coins of that issue for me trying to get a 67 and hasn't even come close.
It’s also of some comfort to me to have TDN’s prediction that eventually very few 20th century coins will remain a pop 1 with none finer. Now, that’s a really safe prediction since, of course, eventually we are all dead and no one will be left to call TDN on his prediction.
However, before I were to go, if anyone matches these pop 1 Lincolns, I’d probably pay top dollar: 1909VDB in 68, 1911 in 68, 1911D in 67, 1913S in 66, 1915 in 68, 1917S in 66, 1918 in 68, 1918D in 67, 1919 in 69, 1919D in 67, 1919S in 66, 1923 in 68, 1924D in 66, 1925D in 66, 1926D in 66, 1931D in 67 – RDs only. Also, I'd like a 1926S in 65 - only a 65 - it should be easy.
This list should be sufficiently large that TDN or someone else can probably dig up one or two of these Lincolns for me in the next couple of months. If I'm not available, please let Mitch know – I’ll trust him to handle it for me.
Please note that in this post I haven't said anything negative about what other people collect, or how easy it is to get them.
Ill pay more than TDN will for a PCGS MS65 1873-CC Trade $
Re-elect Bush in 2004... Dont let the Socialists brainwash you.
Bush 2004
Jeb 2008
KK 2016
Sean: The only thing "getting old" is the fact that the serious buy offers on these 20th Century "rarities" are not getting filled.
As Gerry correctly points out, imho, one day folks will discuss the 1926(s) Lincoln in say MS66RD as a great, great rarity. Far rarer than MOST (PERHAPS NEARLY 90+% OF) 19th century coins in MS66 grade. A few years after that, folks may point to the 1963(d) Lincoln in MS68RD as a GREAT RARITY, with MS67RD grade being very scarce. Maybe the 13 year old members of our great board will be around to recall the great debates on these coins, but perhaps myself, Gerry, pop 1 and TDN won't be at that point. I'm not "hyping" these Lincolns - I hardly even sell them and rarely ever buy them these days. I'm just educating the uninformed based upon my firsthand knowledge of these coins obtained through 4-15 years of agressive searches for certain coins. What is offensive is the "modern coin bashing".
Thank you, Wondercoin, for admitting I was right that your handpicked modern super rarity in all likelyhood is not even the finest out there let alone a coin that will remain pop 1.
Since we all are treated to your incessant posts without even an issue, I am quite certain that if PCGS was pulling the same political crap in a series that you cared about we would hear about it at least as much as I am bringing it up.
I am really confused??? When did I ever say this coin "will remain pop 1" or for that matter be a "pop anything". I haven't even answered my own hypothetical yet - for all you know I may have picked the Trade Dollar
My bottom line here is that it is always perfectly fine for folks to post pictures of their "great 19th century rarities" and the pictures are always met with praise and positive comments. Yet, when "modern" coins are discussed, even when the posters have no clue about what they are writing about (like in the case of the rarity of a 1963(d) Lincoln cent) there is always" bashing", "fingerpointing" and ridicule. IMHO, it's time the "classic dinosaurs" open their minds to the possibility that what others collect is their business and that respect is shown to all fellow collectors
Maybe because those classic coins look stunning, but that MS67 1963-D 1¢ looks just like half a billion other 1963-D cents, but this one is in a slab and has a few less marks (maybe).
Greg: Don't you realize how rediculous you sound to anyone that understands Lincolns from the 1960s?