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Trash talk before the game leads to brawl between Reds-Cardinals

MichiganMichigan Posts: 4,942 ✭
in Sports Talk
A bench clearing brawl at the start of the game was preceded by comments by a Reds player about
how much he hated the Cardinals, calling them "whiny little "-------" among other things. The catcher
and hitter got into a war of words over that and then it happened.....

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    BrickBrick Posts: 4,938 ✭✭✭✭✭
    The Reds would do better to run the bases instead of their mouths. No need to motivate your opponents. They better win today or it could trigger a nasty slide down the standings.
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    Ralph

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    GarabaldiGarabaldi Posts: 2,004 ✭✭✭
    Scott Rolen is a monster, I did not know he was that big until they showed him in the dust up.
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    frankhardyfrankhardy Posts: 8,046 ✭✭✭✭✭


    << <i>Scott Rolen is a monster, I did not know he was that big until they showed him in the dust up. >>



    He is definitely huge. My son got his autograph at Busch Stadium in 2007 when he was still with the Cardinals. I wish they still had him.

    Johnny Cueto has some sharp spikes, too.

    Shane

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    BigRedMachineBigRedMachine Posts: 2,563 ✭✭✭
    I agree, Ralph. The Reds aren't playing well against the Cardinals. They would've done better to win a couple games in this series.

    That being said, Chris Carpenter seems like a dick and is my new least favorite player.

    Watching that "fight", it all would've ended a lot more quietly had he not come out and start running his yapper at Dusty Baker.

    Of course, he became my least favorite player the night before when he berated and belittled his own shortstop.
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    cwazzycwazzy Posts: 3,257 ✭


    << <i>Of course, he became my least favorite player the night before when he berated and belittled his own shortstop. >>



    I'm a Cardinal fan and one of my favorite players is Brendan Ryan. That being said, what Carp did the night before was 100% correct. He didn't call him out in front of the team, he called him into a private meeting in a hallway and told what he expected out of him. He may not have helped matters last night but to say that he was in the wrong with Ryan is not the case at all. That's a sign of leadership and is what the Cardinals need to win the Central over a VERY good Reds team.
    Chris
    My small collection
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    mcadamsmcadams Posts: 2,611 ✭✭✭


    << <i>

    << <i>Of course, he became my least favorite player the night before when he berated and belittled his own shortstop. >>



    I'm a Cardinal fan and one of my favorite players is Brendan Ryan. That being said, what Carp did the night before was 100% correct. He didn't call him out in front of the team, he called him into a private meeting in a hallway and told what he expected out of him. He may not have helped matters last night but to say that he was in the wrong with Ryan is not the case at all. That's a sign of leadership and is what the Cardinals need to win the Central over a VERY good Reds team. >>



    I'm going to politely disagree with you on this. Imagine if you were at work and one of your co-workers came over to you and started telling you how to do your job. You'd think "Does this guy think he's my boss or what?" Instructing players is the role of the Manager, not fellow players. Otherwise, you create a two-tiered team where some players feel that they don't have as big of a voice as others. It can't work that way. You're either a player or you're a manager. Carpenter put Ryan in a lose-lose situation. Either Ryan stands up for himself and tells Carpenter to go f**k off OR Ryan just listens to Carpenter berate him and he loses respect from other players for not standing up for himself.
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    cwazzycwazzy Posts: 3,257 ✭


    << <i>

    << <i>

    << <i>Of course, he became my least favorite player the night before when he berated and belittled his own shortstop. >>



    I'm a Cardinal fan and one of my favorite players is Brendan Ryan. That being said, what Carp did the night before was 100% correct. He didn't call him out in front of the team, he called him into a private meeting in a hallway and told what he expected out of him. He may not have helped matters last night but to say that he was in the wrong with Ryan is not the case at all. That's a sign of leadership and is what the Cardinals need to win the Central over a VERY good Reds team. >>



    I'm going to politely disagree with you on this. Imagine if you were at work and one of your co-workers came over to you and started telling you how to do your job. You'd think "Does this guy think he's my boss or what?" Instructing players is the role of the Manager, not fellow players. Otherwise, you create a two-tiered team where some players feel that they don't have as big of a voice as others. It can't work that way. You're either a player or you're a manager. Carpenter put Ryan in a lose-lose situation. Either Ryan stands up for himself and tells Carpenter to go f**k off OR Ryan just listens to Carpenter berate him and he loses respect from other players for not standing up for himself. >>



    I guess we're going to have to agree to disagree here. Players have been policing clubhouse and onfield behavior since the beginning of sports. Had Carpenter stood up in front of everyone and said to Ryan, "You're a POS and that it better not happen again or you will suffer my wrath," then yes, I would 100% agree with you. But he didn't. He took him alone into the hallway to have a private conversation. No one knows what was said but I imagine he told him why it bothered him and explained that he should have taken care of the problem before they took the field. What's the harm in that? There was no yelling, no pushing or fighting. It was a veteran telling a less seasoned player the way things should be. That's the definition of leadership.
    Chris
    My small collection
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    BigRedMachineBigRedMachine Posts: 2,563 ✭✭✭
    Chris, I don't disagree that the way Carpenter tried to go about the whole thing, by pulling him aside in a tunnel, was the correct way to do it.

    I'm confused as to what his problem was??

    If you pull a younger player aside to tell him how to run out a pop up, then fine. Don't belittle a player because he wasted your time finding the right glove.

    What in the world did Ryan do that was so terrible?? Carpenter came across like a self-important dick to me. Maybe I missed the big picture.

    shawn
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    cwazzycwazzy Posts: 3,257 ✭
    First off I just want to say that I really enjoy back in forth like this. Too many times people on this board can't talk about something like this without it becoming a pissing match. So thank you.

    The way I see it is this. Carpenter was ready to pitch. He'd gotten in the mindset to go after the hitter and when Ryan called time it could have gotten him off of his game. I guess I would compare it to someone talking in your backswing in golf. I realize that Carp gets paid millions of dollars to be ready to throw but I can see where it could throw him out of rhythm. He's a fast moving, very delibrate pitcher and I would imagine delays can be killer for players like that.
    Chris
    My small collection
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    frankhardyfrankhardy Posts: 8,046 ✭✭✭✭✭


    << <i>Chris, I don't disagree that the way Carpenter tried to go about the whole thing, by pulling him aside in a tunnel, was the correct way to do it.

    I'm confused as to what his problem was??

    If you pull a younger player aside to tell him how to run out a pop up, then fine. Don't belittle a player because he wasted your time finding the right glove.

    What in the world did Ryan do that was so terrible?? Carpenter came across like a self-important dick to me. Maybe I missed the big picture.

    shawn >>





    What happened was in the top of the first inning, while the top of the Cardinals order was up, Brendan Ryan was in the batting cages getting some extra swings in. When it was time to go to the field, Brendan Ryan was late. Carpenter, who is intensely competitive was ready to go after his warmup pitches. Brendan Ryan finally comes out on the field and then realizes that he has Aaron Miles' glove, so he has to go to the dugout to get his glove.

    Carpenter did exactly what he should have done. He called him off to the side and did what a leader should do. Brendan Ryan has always had a problem being on time. In this situation, Brendan Ryan also responded correctly. I'm sure he was embarrassed and probably burning up inside while Carpenter was chewing him out, but he held his cool and took it like a man.

    Shane

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    BigRedMachineBigRedMachine Posts: 2,563 ✭✭✭


    << <i>First off I just want to say that I really enjoy back in forth like this. Too many times people on this board can't talk about something like this without it becoming a pissing match. So thank you. >>



    First off, I agree with the above quote.

    Secondly, this is the sports talk forum, so I don't think we're suppose to talk this way. So here goes................

    Chris. You're obviously full of $hit. image

    No, really. I still see what you're saying and I still don't agree. I'll admit after the whipping the Reds took this week it doesn't take much for me to dislike the Cardinals, but I'm still not impressed by Carpenter. The kid had the wrong glove?? Great. Let it go. No need for the Sister Holier than Thou routine Carpenter pulled. "I'm ready to pitch, don't bother me !!!"

    Going back to that game, he also threw a tantrum at Ryan when the Reds finally scored. It seems he was upset with Ryan over where he was playing in the field, like that was his fault and not the coach's??

    Gimme a break. I don't like him, and you can't make me. image

    shawn
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    cwazzycwazzy Posts: 3,257 ✭
    I think it's going to be a great rest of the season. I think both teams are fairly evenly matched and this should go down to the wire.

    As for Carp: I don't know. Maybe his wife has been holding out on him and he just lost. Lord knows I've been there before. LOL
    Chris
    My small collection
    Want List:
    '61 Topps Roy Campanella in PSA 5-7
    Cardinal T206 cards
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    EstilEstil Posts: 6,919 ✭✭✭✭
    Geez, these guys need to learn to play nice! Think of all the Little Leaguers that might be watching...
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    onefasttalononefasttalon Posts: 1,208 ✭✭✭
    The 3-game series was hard to watch (as a Reds fan.) It's obvious the Reds weren't up to the challenge... I sure hope they are next time.
    I don't completely understand Phillips' NEED to comment about how much he hates a team to the media.
    Being a professional athlete has it's short comings, allbeit not many!... but EVERYTHING you say to the media will be smeared all over place.
    What ensued in the 1st of the second game was the result, and, the Reds were not able to compete emotionally afterwords.

    I love the Reds, and Brandon is the man! ...but... I sure hope he learned a lesson. I'm sure the fines and suspensions coming will hurt both teams.


    ALWAYS Looking for Chris Sabo cards!

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    frankhardyfrankhardy Posts: 8,046 ✭✭✭✭✭


    << <i>

    Going back to that game, he also threw a tantrum at Ryan when the Reds finally scored. It seems he was upset with Ryan over where he was playing in the field, like that was his fault and not the coach's??

    shawn >>




    Shawn,

    It was first thought that Carpenter was mad at Ryan for his placement in the field. He was interviewed afterward and he was very adamant that he was mad at himself for giving up the hit and not mad at Ryan for his placement in the field.

    Shane

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    alnavmanalnavman Posts: 4,129 ✭✭✭
    what happened in the game is why I still like baseball #1. There are still rivals for teams and some still "hate" each other....not like some of the other sports, especially basketball with the love fests that go on before and after games......
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    BrickBrick Posts: 4,938 ✭✭✭✭✭
    I can't wait for the love fest when the Heat come to Cleveland.
    Collecting 1960 Topps Baseball in PSA 8
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    Ralph

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    jeffcbayjeffcbay Posts: 8,948 ✭✭✭✭


    << <i>I can't wait for the love fest when the Heat come to Cleveland. >>



    Absolutely... a friend of mine is a season ticket holder, and he sold his pair of tickets for $400 each! They are upper deck corner seats! Screw that...
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    alnavmanalnavman Posts: 4,129 ✭✭✭


    << <i>I can't wait for the love fest when the Heat come to Cleveland. >>

    it's months away and even though the fans will be up in arms you won't be able to tell by the players. my guess is they all do the normal kiss and hug before and after the game and that's my point, the fans will be up in arms but the players, especially in basketball really don't take the rivalry stuff to heart like they do in baseball. Unless they put a team of fans together for the game and let them go against the heat....then there would definitely be action
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