Returning an ebay coin
mumu
Posts: 1,840
I have never returned a coin before until this last one I bought. The seller has given me his return address although he is not too happy about the return. Now the ebay instructions say that when returning an item, I should enter my return tracking info into the resolution center. But it seems the only way to do that is to open a case. I dont want to anger the seler further by opening a case and risk a problem of any kind, but I do want to make sure im covered properly under ebay return rules. If the buyer has *somewhat agreed to take the return is that enough and should I wait his receive/response before doing anything in ebay?
*I say somewhat because after first mentioning the problems the coin he said "NGC certified the coin as such. I didnt grade the coin". But then I said I'd like to return the coin please give me a return address and he just replied with an address. Never actually said the words "I will give you a full refund". His return policy states he will only accept returns if the coin has damage not mentioned in his description and not seen in the pictures. He did not describe the coin at all and had a small scan pic so the damage was not visibile at all.
*I say somewhat because after first mentioning the problems the coin he said "NGC certified the coin as such. I didnt grade the coin". But then I said I'd like to return the coin please give me a return address and he just replied with an address. Never actually said the words "I will give you a full refund". His return policy states he will only accept returns if the coin has damage not mentioned in his description and not seen in the pictures. He did not describe the coin at all and had a small scan pic so the damage was not visibile at all.
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Comments
Russ, NCNE
Velocity, Not Valuation Defines A Bubble.
<< <i>If sending first class or priority and coin is valued over $250 I would purchase signature confirmation. If not over $250 at least purchase delivery confirmation. If sending registered purchase electronic return receipt. If sending express mail no additional confirmation needed, the express tracking number will provide proof of receipt. >>
The value was 150$ and I sent it first class with delivery confirmation no insurance. My concern is a vindictive seller unhappy about the return who claims I sent him a box of rocks.
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<< <i>If sending first class or priority and coin is valued over $250 I would purchase signature confirmation. If not over $250 at least purchase delivery confirmation. If sending registered purchase electronic return receipt. If sending express mail no additional confirmation needed, the express tracking number will provide proof of receipt. >>
The value was 150$ and I sent it first class with delivery confirmation no insurance. My concern is a vindictive seller unhappy about the return who claims I sent him a box of rocks. >>
send the del conf. number to the person through the eBay message system.
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<< <i>If sending first class or priority and coin is valued over $250 I would purchase signature confirmation. If not over $250 at least purchase delivery confirmation. If sending registered purchase electronic return receipt. If sending express mail no additional confirmation needed, the express tracking number will provide proof of receipt. >>
The value was 150$ and I sent it first class with delivery confirmation no insurance. My concern is a vindictive seller unhappy about the return who claims I sent him a box of rocks. >>
send the del conf. number to the person through the eBay message system. >>
Did that too. Thanks.
Check out my current listings: https://ebay.com/sch/khunt/m.html?_ipg=200&_sop=12&_rdc=1
If you send a coin or anything back via USPS and you use delivery confirmation technically its delivered on your end. If the seller claims it was never recieved "lost" it has nothing to do with you. His issue is between the seller and the post office to where things are. When you use delivery confirmation its as good as delivered when you hand the package to the post office.
Im sure if you give paypal the confirmation info you will be covered.
<< <i>He is going to block you from future auctions anway so who cares if he is pissed off. Do what you need to do to protect yourself! >>
Yeah I am expecting he will but surely 1 coin return in over 150 purchases isnt too bad. Of course he will only see 1 return in 1 purchase but oh well. I had to do it. I paid AU money on this coin and it should have gotten EF money at best. The scans hid major damage.
Velocity, Not Valuation Defines A Bubble.
<< <i>Out of the horses mouth:
If you send a coin or anything back via USPS and you use delivery confirmation technically its delivered on your end. If the seller claims it was never recieved "lost" it has nothing to do with you. His issue is between the seller and the post office to where things are. When you use delivery confirmation its as good as delivered when you hand the package to the post office.
Im sure if you give paypal the confirmation info you will be covered. >>
When I use PP shipping to print the label it says I shipped with del. confirm...... BUT.....
It has to be scanned and accepted for the USPS to take responsibility..
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<< <i>He is going to block you from future auctions anway so who cares if he is pissed off. Do what you need to do to protect yourself! >>
Yeah I am expecting he will but surely 1 coin return in over 150 purchases isnt too bad. Of course he will only see 1 return in 1 purchase but oh well. I had to do it. I paid AU money on this coin and it should have gotten EF money at best. The scans hid major damage. >>
If the coin has "major damage", why would you not address that issue with the grading company? After all, their S.O.P.'s dictate that they won't grade a damaged coin. Somehow, your words don't ring true.
"Everything is on its way to somewhere. Everything." - George Malley, Phenomenon
http://www.american-legacy-coins.com
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<< <i>He is going to block you from future auctions anway so who cares if he is pissed off. Do what you need to do to protect yourself! >>
Yeah I am expecting he will but surely 1 coin return in over 150 purchases isnt too bad. Of course he will only see 1 return in 1 purchase but oh well. I had to do it. I paid AU money on this coin and it should have gotten EF money at best. The scans hid major damage. >>
If the coin has "major damage", why would you not address that issue with the grading company? After all, their S.O.P.'s dictate that they won't grade a damaged coin. Somehow, your words don't ring true. >>
What one person thinks of as "major damage" can legitimately differ from what another thinks. And it is generally easier and more practical for a buyer to return a coin, than to have to try to get a grading company to take it off the market.
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<< <i>He is going to block you from future auctions anway so who cares if he is pissed off. Do what you need to do to protect yourself! >>
Yeah I am expecting he will but surely 1 coin return in over 150 purchases isnt too bad. Of course he will only see 1 return in 1 purchase but oh well. I had to do it. I paid AU money on this coin and it should have gotten EF money at best. The scans hid major damage. >>
If the coin has "major damage", why would you not address that issue with the grading company? After all, their S.O.P.'s dictate that they won't grade a damaged coin. Somehow, your words don't ring true. >>
I am not sure what your definition of major damage might be and whether mine is the same or correct. I consider it major within the assigned grade but more importantly is it not my right to return it within the return privelege period instead of taking on the added legwork and guaranteed lost money of going to the TPG instead of the seller?
I am hesitant to post pics because the coin is a darkside coin, and while the world forums here are dead, I still hoped for some general advice. But it seems any mention of darkside coins here guarantees no responses. Sorry if that is kind of kaneiving. Here are pics anyways. I'd rather not link the auction until this situation is resolved:
<< <i>When I use PP shipping to print the label it says I shipped with del. confirm...... BUT.....
It has to be scanned and accepted for the USPS to take responsibility.. >>
Just a "heads up" in case anybody doesn't know this, but electronically purchased DC does not include an acceptance scan as part of the service. Some post offices will do the scans anyway, but they're not required to.
<< <i>What is the assigned grade? I see flaws like those on coins graded up to at least MS63 from time to time. >>
AU 55
Im my opinion you are being a bit picky. Not too bad at all for an AU coin.
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<< <i>What is the assigned grade? I see flaws like those on coins graded up to at least MS63 from time to time. >>
AU 55 >>
In that case, I don't think most people would consider those flaws to be "major damage".
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<< <i>What is the assigned grade? I see flaws like those on coins graded up to at least MS63 from time to time. >>
AU 55 >>
In that case, I don't think most people would consider those flaws to be "major damage". >>
If 2 chunks missing from teh rim and a deep scratch isnt major damage for an au 55 then I guess the AU 58 I referneced is really an MS 67. I noted the 3 major areas that I felt broke the deal for me. The coin has other problem areas not pictured here, that I would call in line with AU55 grading. But the key to these 3 is that they were not visible in the listed scans.
Ken
Now all this is just banter because my point originally was just making sure I did the return properly. Not to dispute the grade. I may be wrong about the grade I admit. But none of these problems were noted or pictured in the auction. Maybe they are not major, but I certainly think they are noteworthy. I have seen the BIG FISH on this forum talk about returning coins for stuff you can only see under a miscroscope or loupe and they get support because they are big spenders. I cant even imgaine what they would think of these problem areas if they bought a keydate big ticket coin in AU55 only to discover what amounts to 2 big scratches and chunks of rim missing.
All that being said I dont mean to sound combative. I tahnk everyone for their input even if it went slightly off topic. Its all part of a very valuable learning experinece. I got stung on that 1805 draped half ive poted several times and I am not much more careful. Within 30 seconds of looking at this coin I though return. Within 5 minutes I emailed the seller.
Ive added an AU 58 next to it. Are these 2 grades really supose to be THAT far off from each other or am I really just that clueless?:
Sellers only obverse pic:
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<< <i>If sending first class or priority and coin is valued over $250 I would purchase signature confirmation. If not over $250 at least purchase delivery confirmation. If sending registered purchase electronic return receipt. If sending express mail no additional confirmation needed, the express tracking number will provide proof of receipt. >>
The value was 150$ and I sent it first class with delivery confirmation no insurance. My concern is a vindictive seller unhappy about the return who claims I sent him a box of rocks. >>
Too many folks think that D.Conf. somehow takes the place of insurance ; I insure every returned coin for my own protection
all the delivery conf. proves is that it was put in his mail box or P.O. box
I live in a rural area and anyone can take a package from my mailbox
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<< <i>
<< <i>If sending first class or priority and coin is valued over $250 I would purchase signature confirmation. If not over $250 at least purchase delivery confirmation. If sending registered purchase electronic return receipt. If sending express mail no additional confirmation needed, the express tracking number will provide proof of receipt. >>
The value was 150$ and I sent it first class with delivery confirmation no insurance. My concern is a vindictive seller unhappy about the return who claims I sent him a box of rocks. >>
Too many folks think that D.Conf. somehow takes the place of insurance ; I insure every returned coin for my own protection
all the delivery conf. proves is that it was put in his mail box or P.O. box
I live in a rural area and anyone can take a package from my mailbox >>
I would agree with you except there's 2 problems with insurance. #1 for a 150$ item they still only place the item in the mailbox. And if the buyer says he never got it and the post man says he put it in the USPS wont pay out anyway. and #2, the big blue insurance sticker yells out STEAL ME to criminal postal employees. I dont understand why the insurance info cant just go into the computer withjust some kind of additional barcodeing attached to the regular posting sticker without the bright blue steal me sign.
Russ, NCNE
<< <i>I agree with Mark. That is not "major damage" for an AU55 coin.
Russ, NCNE >>
Me three!
"Everything is on its way to somewhere. Everything." - George Malley, Phenomenon
http://www.american-legacy-coins.com
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<< <i>
<< <i>If sending first class or priority and coin is valued over $250 I would purchase signature confirmation. If not over $250 at least purchase delivery confirmation. If sending registered purchase electronic return receipt. If sending express mail no additional confirmation needed, the express tracking number will provide proof of receipt. >>
The value was 150$ and I sent it first class with delivery confirmation no insurance. My concern is a vindictive seller unhappy about the return who claims I sent him a box of rocks. >>
Too many folks think that D.Conf. somehow takes the place of insurance ; I insure every returned coin for my own protection
all the delivery conf. proves is that it was put in his mail box or P.O. box
I live in a rural area and anyone can take a package from my mailbox >>
I did not advise OP to get delivery confirmation to protect himself from loss in the mail. Purpose of the delivery confirmation is to prove to ebay/paypal that the item was delivered/returned to seller. Without it ebay/paypal will side with the original seller when he claims it was not returned. Delivery confirmation is not for filing a postal claim; insurance is required for a postal claim.
Velocity, Not Valuation Defines A Bubble.
<< <i>IMHO that is not a major scratch and everything else shown weren't major either, but it is immaterial as to what I think, you have to be happy with the coin and those areas were impossible to see int he smaller in the slab shots. What is the problem with returning a coin that you are not happy with even though as au55 it may be properly or conservatively graded, bottomline for whatever reason you just don't like the coin and wished to return it. I have returned coins for many issues some you may not agree with either. >>
Alan, what can be wrong with returning such a coin depends upon the terms you agree to when you bid on it. Generally speaking, if the seller did not offer a return privilege, shipped the item that was pictured and did not do anything contrary to Ebay policy, then he shouldn't have to accept a return.
A bunch of low life thugs those postal employees are.
Ken
<< <i>Generally speaking, if the seller did not offer a return privilege, shipped the item that was pictured and did not do anything contrary to Ebay policy, then he shouldn't have to accept a return. >>
I'm going to agree with this. If you (in general- not directed at any individual poster) want a return privelege, you have no business bidding in auctions which specifically state "No Returns".
And yes, eBay does allow sellers to have a "No Returns" policy.
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<< <i>Generally speaking, if the seller did not offer a return privilege, shipped the item that was pictured and did not do anything contrary to Ebay policy, then he shouldn't have to accept a return. >>
I'm going to agree with this. If you (in general- not directed at any individual poster) want a return privelege, you have no business bidding in auctions which specifically state "No Returns".
And yes, eBay does allow sellers to have a "No Returns" policy. >>
And that is why, in those situations, I bid on very few coins on Ebay. And usually bid low, when I do. I want to minimize my downside, in the event that I end up with an undesirable coin, which I wouldn't feel right trying to return.
<< <i>Out of the horses mouth:
If you send a coin or anything back via USPS and you use delivery confirmation technically its delivered on your end. If the seller claims it was never recieved "lost" it has nothing to do with you. His issue is between the seller and the post office to where things are. When you use delivery confirmation its as good as delivered when you hand the package to the post office.
Im sure if you give paypal the confirmation info you will be covered. >>
It still has to show as delivered doesn't it? If it gets lost on the way and can't be scanned at the destination then it can't possibly have been delivered/returned to the seller.
What if he had shipped it to you in the same manner in which you returned it; with del conf and no insurance? If it got lost you'd be crying foul, you owe me a coin or my money back. Since he was nice enough to accept the return, you should at least have had the courtesy to protect his interest.
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<< <i>When you use delivery confirmation its as good as delivered when you hand the package to the post office.
Im sure if you give paypal the confirmation info you will be covered. >>
It still has to show as delivered doesn't it? If it gets lost on the way and can't be scanned at the destination then it can't possibly have been delivered/returned to the seller. >>
This is the correct answer. If you do not have a USPS "delivered" scan, it's the sender's problem, not the recipient's. It's no different than when you're the buyer- if you don't get the package, the fact the shipper paid for DC is irrelevant.
On returns get signature service to the addressee only.
And I do not feel that you had a valid claim for a return. You got a NGC graded AU55 coin just like what you bid on.
<< <i>Delivery Confirmation just says it was delivered to someone in that Zip code.
On returns get signature service to the addressee only.
And I do not feel that you had a valid claim for a return. You got a NGC graded AU55 coin just like what you bid on. >>
Why post any pictures at all in an auction then? Just state the grade and take it or leave it. I buy the coin not the grade. Call me stupid I guess.
<< <i>On returns get signature service to the addressee only. >>
If you specifically need the addressee's signature, you need to also request (and pay for) restricted delivery. Otherwise, the USPS may let someone other than the addressee sign for it.
<< <i>Delivery Confirmation just says it was delivered to someone in that Zip code.
On returns get signature service to the addressee only.
And I do not feel that you had a valid claim for a return. You got a NGC graded AU55 coin just like what you bid on. >>
That is provided it actually gets there.
Also just because NGC graded it doesn't mean that one should like it.
<< <i>Why post any pictures at all in an auction then? Just state the grade and take it or leave it. I buy the coin not the grade. Call me stupid I guess. >>
There's nothing wrong with wanting the ability to return a coin you don't like once you have to see it in hand. Your trouble started here because you bid in an auction where the seller does *not* offer unconditional returns, and specifically not for grading disagreements. You might want to consider skipping over listings with a limited return policy like that in the future.
Just a thought...
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<< <i>If sending first class or priority and coin is valued over $250 I would purchase signature confirmation. If not over $250 at least purchase delivery confirmation. If sending registered purchase electronic return receipt. If sending express mail no additional confirmation needed, the express tracking number will provide proof of receipt. >>
The value was 150$ and I sent it first class with delivery confirmation no insurance. My concern is a vindictive seller unhappy about the return who claims I sent him a box of rocks. >>
Too many folks think that D.Conf. somehow takes the place of insurance ; I insure every returned coin for my own protection
all the delivery conf. proves is that it was put in his mail box or P.O. box
I live in a rural area and anyone can take a package from my mailbox >>
I would agree with you except there's 2 problems with insurance. #1 for a 150$ item they still only place the item in the mailbox. And if the buyer says he never got it and the post man says he put it in the USPS wont pay out anyway. and #2, the big blue insurance sticker yells out STEAL ME to criminal postal employees. I dont understand why the insurance info cant just go into the computer withjust some kind of additional barcodeing attached to the regular posting sticker without the bright blue steal me sign. >>
It also would have been wise of you to enquire about the security of the address to which the item was being returned.
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<< <i>Why post any pictures at all in an auction then? Just state the grade and take it or leave it. I buy the coin not the grade. Call me stupid I guess. >>
There's nothing wrong with wanting the ability to return a coin you don't like once you have to see it in hand. Your trouble started here because you bid in an auction where the seller does *not* offer unconditional returns, and specifically not for grading disagreements. You might want to consider skipping over listings with a limited return policy like that in the future.
Just a thought... >>
Im not sure I ever said the buyer didnt accept returns. He does have a return policy, and I believe pretty surely that I stayed within it.
<< <i>Im not sure I ever said the buyer didnt accept returns. >>
I didn't say that you said that. I'm sorry if you got that impression.
<< <i>He does have a return policy, and I believe pretty surely that I stayed within it. >>
Here's the relevant part of his return policy:
"Returns are accepted ONLY IF I omit mentioning damage that CANNOT be seen in the scan .. DO NOT email me with grading or cleaning as an UNLISTED reason for returning a coin"
I understand you consider the marks on the coin to be damage, but as can be seen from other posts in this thread, that's definitely debatable. That being the case (along with his grudging acceptance of the return), it isn't completely clear that you stayed within the bounds of his policy.
Not trying to give you a hard time- just how it looks from what I can see.
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<< <i>Im not sure I ever said the buyer didnt accept returns. >>
I didn't say that you said that. I'm sorry if you got that impression.
<< <i>He does have a return policy, and I believe pretty surely that I stayed within it. >>
Here's the relevant part of his return policy:
"Returns are accepted ONLY IF I omit mentioning damage that CANNOT be seen in the scan .. DO NOT email me with grading or cleaning as an UNLISTED reason for returning a coin"
I understand you consider the marks on the coin to be damage, but as can be seen from other posts in this thread, that's definitely debatable. That being the case (along with his grudging acceptance of the return), it isn't completely clear that you stayed within the bounds of his policy.
Not trying to give you a hard time- just how it looks from what I can see. >>
Heres the million dollar question then. Or in this case the 150$ question. What then might constitute an example of damage not seen in the scan? Because by the suggestion of those suporting the no return on this, what NGC says on the label is the word of god no matter what. Therefore ANY damage at all, if inside the NGC holder would have been determined to be ok by NGC and therefore the NGC is god argument would be the same regardless of what shape the coin was in.
This thread has really confused me because you see the quote "Buy the coin not the holder" so much then a thread like this brings out so many people saying you got an NGC 55 which is what you were buying and you got what you were buying. I could unsdestand the arguments in a buyers remorse scenario but this is my first return in 150 purchases, i simply feel that strongly about this coin. Its too bad because the color is better than expected.
<< <i>Heres the million dollar question then. Or in this case the 150$ question. What then might constitute an example of damage not seen in the scan? >>
I have absolutely no idea where that line might be crossed. Which is an excellent reason to not bid in auctions with return policies like the one in question.
<< <i>Because by the suggestion of those suporting the no return on this, what NGC says on the label is the word of god no matter what. Therefore ANY damage at all, if inside the NGC holder would have been determined to be ok by NGC and therefore the NGC is god argument would be the same regardless of what shape the coin was in. >>
Not necessarily. The seller also includes this in his return policy:
"So any problems concerning cleaning or grading WILL ONLY be refunded on IF an EBAY RECOGNIZED grading authority returns the coin to you WITH THE PROBLEM STATED ."
So, according to the return policy in the auction, if you send the coin in to NGG (or presumably, PCGS) and it comes back with some sort of notation of damage (such as on a bodybag), you are within the terms of the auction in expecting to be able to return the coin. Sounds like a lot of trouble (not to mention the "7 days after the buyer receives it" part), if you're expecting to be able to return a problem coin, doesn't it? Another reason to not bid in auctions with return policies like the one in question, I'd think.
<< <i>This thread has really confused me because you see the quote "Buy the coin not the holder" so much then a thread like this brings out so many people saying you got an NGC 55 which is what you were buying and you got what you were buying. >>
I think you're getting several issues wrapped up into one here. "Buy the coin, not the holder" does not preclude the possibility that all coins of a certain grade are not that same- in fact, it's actually addressing this issue head on. You bid on a 55 and got one- just not the one you wanted. That's where an unconditional return policy is your friend.
<< <i>I could unsdestand the arguments in a buyers remorse scenario but this is my first return in 150 purchases, i simply feel that strongly about this coin. Its too bad because the color is better than expected. >>
It's probably not the first return in 150 purchases from this seller, though, is it? Please remember now- I'm not jumping on you here, but from the seller's point of view (which is just as valid as yours), he's the one who's being accomodating here by agreeing to accept a return when (in his opinion, anyway) your request does not fall within the bounds of his return policy.
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<< <i>Heres the million dollar question then. Or in this case the 150$ question. What then might constitute an example of damage not seen in the scan? >>
I have absolutely no idea where that line might be crossed. Which is an excellent reason to not bid in auctions with return policies like the one in question.
<< <i>Because by the suggestion of those suporting the no return on this, what NGC says on the label is the word of god no matter what. Therefore ANY damage at all, if inside the NGC holder would have been determined to be ok by NGC and therefore the NGC is god argument would be the same regardless of what shape the coin was in. >>
Not necessarily. The seller also includes this in his return policy:
"So any problems concerning cleaning or grading WILL ONLY be refunded on IF an EBAY RECOGNIZED grading authority returns the coin to you WITH THE PROBLEM STATED ."
So, according to the return policy in the auction, if you send the coin in to NGG (or presumably, PCGS) and it comes back with some sort of notation of damage (such as on a bodybag), you are within the terms of the auction in expecting to be able to return the coin. Sounds like a lot of trouble (not to mention the "7 days after the buyer receives it" part), if you're expecting to be able to return a problem coin, doesn't it? Another reason to not bid in auctions with return policies like the one in question, I'd think.
<< <i>This thread has really confused me because you see the quote "Buy the coin not the holder" so much then a thread like this brings out so many people saying you got an NGC 55 which is what you were buying and you got what you were buying. >>
I think you're getting several issues wrapped up into one here. "Buy the coin, not the holder" does not preclude the possibility that all coins of a certain grade are not that same- in fact, it's actually addressing this issue head on. You bid on a 55 and got one- just not the one you wanted. That's where an unconditional return policy is your friend.
<< <i>I could unsdestand the arguments in a buyers remorse scenario but this is my first return in 150 purchases, i simply feel that strongly about this coin. Its too bad because the color is better than expected. >>
It's probably not the first return in 150 purchases from this seller, though, is it? Please remember now- I'm not jumping on you here, but from the seller's point of view (which is just as valid as yours), he's the one who's being accomodating here by agreeing to accept a return when (in his opinion, anyway) your request does not fall within the bounds of his return policy. >>
I agree, and mentioned the same point about the 150 in 1 in an earlier post. However the question remains what is an example of an acceptable return in this case? Why is this damage that has turned me off to the coin, that was not evident in the pictures, not a qualifier? And what would be a qualifer if afterall ANYTHING in the NGC plastic would have been deemed to be NGC 55? What would it take for this coin to be returnable?
<< <i>Why is this damage that has turned me off to the coin, that was not evident in the pictures, not a qualifier? >>
I think you're expecting too much. There's no reason you *can't* consider the coin damaged, but you need to consider that other people get to make their own determinations, too. And just from this thread, you can see that not everybody agrees that the coin is damaged.
<< <i>And what would be a qualifer if afterall ANYTHING in the NGC plastic would have been deemed to be NGC 55? >>
Since it's possible to send coins in for regrade and have them come back with a different designation the second time around, I think it's incorrect to make this claim: "if afterall ANYTHING in the NGC plastic would have been deemed to be NGC 55?"
<< <i>What would it take for this coin to be returnable? >>
According to the auction listing, this:
"So any problems concerning cleaning or grading WILL ONLY be refunded on IF an EBAY RECOGNIZED grading authority returns the coin to you WITH THE PROBLEM STATED ."
Collecting 1970s Topps baseball wax, rack and cello packs, as well as PCGS graded Half Cents, Large Cents, Two Cent pieces and Three Cent Silver pieces.
if the major problems you describe are evident in auction pics, what are your reasons for returning?
and it sounds like you disagree with NGCs grading standards, because they allowed that major problem coin in a slab
ps, that coin looks like it could have very nice toning (which I like)
and regrettably, I predict in our lifetime, that will be legal tender in the USA
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<< <i>Why is this damage that has turned me off to the coin, that was not evident in the pictures, not a qualifier? >>
I think you're expecting too much. There's no reason you *can't* consider the coin damaged, but you need to consider that other people get to make their own determinations, too. And just from this thread, you can see that not everybody agrees that the coin is damaged.
<< <i>And what would be a qualifer if afterall ANYTHING in the NGC plastic would have been deemed to be NGC 55? >>
Since it's possible to send coins in for regrade and have them come back with a different designation the second time around, I think it's incorrect to make this claim: "if afterall ANYTHING in the NGC plastic would have been deemed to be NGC 55?"
<< <i>What would it take for this coin to be returnable? >>
According to the auction listing, this:
"So any problems concerning cleaning or grading WILL ONLY be refunded on IF an EBAY RECOGNIZED grading authority returns the coin to you WITH THE PROBLEM STATED ." >>
I am only pressing this issue because I sell on ebay too. And while I think the majority in this thread is that I have the right to return the coin, I am trying to see both side of the...wait for it.....coin. I offer a return priv with my ebay listings because I think its the right thing to do. Pictures can be deceiving and do not replace seeing a coin in hand. Here is what it comes down to for me. There are 3 areas of "damage" on this coin, that were not visibile in the scan, that I consider noteworthy and unexpected enough that a return iss justifed. There are coins in similar grades without as many as 1 area of damage as noteworthy as this, and had they been apparent in the pictures I would have skipped over this coin. What does that say about the perception of this grade(au55) if i can find as many as 5 other coins listed right now, one of which I bought, that do not have any problems as severe as these 3 I pictured for this coin yet some people think nothing of them, when if these same defects were seen in mid MS grades they would mean the differnece of thousands of dollars? Is Au 55-AU58 not as important as Ms 65-ms66 ? For many collectors the lower grades are where we must seek our joys of collecting. Does that mean I lose the right to want to know what the problems are on a coin?
I will concede and accept that this is not severe damage as I have describe it in the other post(but only for the sake of debate). However it is definelty damage, mild damage at least, no? If we agree that it is damage, and I do not know what else to call it, then the return policy states "unmentioned damage or damage not in the pictures" both of which of those are qualified in this auction.