Are high quality copies acceptable for your collection?

laurentyvan

Coins you can never afford
are out there in great number.
Are copies for your collection suitable
or is that a facile blunder?

OchoReales

In a word, NO!

Silvereagle82

not for me

Hyperion

Nah, I can still admire things I can't snag. Heck, I get as much enjoyment from the posts on this board as I do some of the coins in my own collection.

FilamCoins

No, can't get excited about reproductions.

lordmarcovan

I usually try to map out a collection that is actually achievable for myself.

Sometimes when one goes with a theme, however, a couple of unattainable pieces unavoidably become part of the list. Usually I would prefer to just skip them, as I have chosen to do with the Aussie half-sovereigns for my daughter's 1901 Victorian set. The Aussie half-sovereigns of 1901 were struck in proof only, have five-figure pricetags, and probably seldom hit the market, meaning they are completely unattainable for a mortal like myself and probably really tough for anyone else.

There have been a couple times, however, when I've been tempted to add replicas as "filler" coins. One is with the US large cent date set on the back of my Holey Coin Vest. It lacks only the cents from 1793, 1795, 1799, and 1804. Even if you consider I only need one of each date and I wouldn't have to have a 1793 Chain cent (I could choose the "cheaper" 1793 Wreath type instead), those are some tough coins, particularly to find with holes in them. (Rare pieces with holes often get repaired.) So I thought maybe I could buy some of those Gallery Mint replicas, if they were available for all of those dates, and then artificially wear the coins down to lower grade, darken them so they wouldn't stick out like a sore thumb, and drill holes in them. This wouldn't be a dishonesty since I'd be leaving the "COPY" stamps on the reverses of the coins- it would be merely to make them "match" the rest of the set.

But that sounds like a helluva lot of trouble, and even those nice replicas ain't cheap.

The only other time I have been tempted to do replicas was with my Roman Imperial collection. I was collecting by ruler, and there were some emperors and empresses whose coins are just impossibly rare. (In many cases, unknown outside of museum collections.) There was somebody on eBay selling high quality replica gold aureii from some of the tougher rulers- not claiming the coins were real, but rather that these replica aureii were struck of good gold and not just plated. That made them desirable in their own right- they could fill space for some tougher emperors in a collection, and they'd be bullion, too. But of course these gold replicas had three-figure pricetags, and there were still plenty of real coins I needed for the collection that I could afford for three figures, without dropping a fortune on pricey replicas.

So there it is. I've been tempted twice, but in neither instance was it feasible to go with copies.

I can see how somebody who is doing a display and desires the display to be "complete" might wish to include some replicas, openly labeling them as such. But then there is the argument that mixing copies in with the real thing cheapens the collection as a whole, and I can see some of the truth in that, too, I suppose.

JCMhouston

Not for me.

ajaan

No

TwoKopeiki

Only if the copies are contemporary.

In fact, I have a side collection of contemporary counterfeited 8 Reales. Still paying strong money for Riddell's "Monograph of the Silver Dollar" if anyone has a copy.

canadacolornut

Kind of pointless really.

Like framing and hanging a mass produced lithograph of the Mona Lisa...

savoyspecial

i would purchase some of the Bolen pieces (Higley coppers, 1804 dollar, etc) if given the chance

SwK

not for me thanks

www.petitioncrown.com

RobP

A moot point which is better phrased "At which point in time do copies become acceptable?" Clearly the Taylor restrikes of Soho & other pieces are now accepted and collectable as are the Dutch copies of Cromwell's portrait pieces. Tanner's Cromwell crown was new dies and so not strictly a copy but would presumably still come within this remit. Pricewise, the Taylor pieces now fetch as much as the original Soho pieces, and the Cromwell copies more than the originals as a reflection of their rarity. In all probability the modern copies will eventually become accepted by a few people (voluminous output not withstanding), but personally I don't like them and wouldn't buy any.

Lancastercoin

Yes, but not as a replacement for a genuine piece. I handle a lot of China material, and while I destroy the modern crap copies I have several old fakes in silver that are kind of neat. I also have a counterfeit Wells Fargo so-called dollar, a 1934 UK Crown, a micro-O Morgan dollar, and a Honan 10 cash (in our host's 64RB holder) that are all interesting for various reasons. A friend of mine has about ten medium to low value China pieces in N and P holders that he's keeping as a "these are the experts, huh?" kind of set. High-quality fakes make an interesting topic for a dealer to keep, since we generally can't really have much of a collection of genuine saleable material because it tends to become inventory. I used to have a $1, $2.50, and $3 gold US type set in counterfeit, but after melting approximately my 100th one I got bored of them and melted mine too.

pendragon1998

I'm not interested in fakes.

spoon

I could be tempted by interesting contemporaries, but fakes produced for collectors? Nah, I can do without.

Well, I do have one, just 'cause it was cheap and pretty and I was on a roll mindlessly pulling stuff from that junk box

OchoReales

Overwhelmingly, the No's have spoken! Contemporary counterfeits seem to 'make the grade'.

TwoKopeiki

Hmm, fakes made specifically for collectors? I would be ok with some mint state Novodel's

Hussulo

I'm okay with Contemporary counterfeits from an interest point of view although I don't actively seek them nor own any but I have no time for the modern forgeries or the people trying to pass them off as genuine.

Bjorn

Modern Fakes? Not as part of my collection, although I may keep any I come across for diagnostic purposes.

Contemporary fakes are a different story though...

farthing

Conder tokens are rife with contemporary counterfeits which are catalogued and collected just as their originals.

Beyond these, not so much. But I do have 1 Victorian crown to remind me that in getting greedy on eBay and thinking I'm getting a rip, sometimes you are the one being ripped. I got 5 "crowns" in the lot - all fakes, sent the other 4 out to members here who have collections of fakes for their education value.

I have one other fake that I got from a member here who was similarly burned on eBay.

coachleonard

I too love contemporary fakes! Saw someone on ebay selling a contemporary counterfeit brass HALF reale--the first one I have ever seen. Even at $49 starting price, more people should have been jumping on a rarity like that!

ormandh

I say that you are fooling yourself if you settle for a modern forgery or copy. What is the point! Unless it it is the case that you collect modern copies! 0-Dan

wybrit

Copies? No thanks.

Aethelred

I can't think of any circumstance where I would rather have a copy than nothing at all.

TwoKopeiki

I still would not mind having these fakes in my collection:

Lancastercoin

Anything from a hand-fabricated set of dies is cool. Transfer die products rarely are.

cacheman

I purchase "aftercasts", counterfeits. and downright fugly "copies" that I will use for instruction in the many ways scammers will go to make a buck. Hopefully the examples will alert potential collectors to the pitfalls of Goetz collecting...not that Goetz examples are swimming in forgeries, but there are certain medals (Lusitania, Black Shame, WWII) where the copies are focused.

otherwise.....no way, it defeats my reason for collecting.

spoon

Those novodels are definitely cool, Roman. I don't think I'd have a problem with them if I could afford them
Afterall, there is some historical significance attached to them, they do have a recognized place in the study of numismatics.

I just wouldn't want to encourage the Isle of Man or Somalia (or the US mint for that matter!) to try reviving the practice on anyone's behalf.

StubbyMcNumbthumbs

Modern copies, a definite NO. Although, I do have a contemporary copy of a 1775 farthing and another which I think is probably one also. Even though it was purchased as being authentic, I am still happy with it as it is a nice example and the price was right.

500Bay

I would never buy a copy. The 'realness' is a big part of the fun.

I do have a modern copy of the Brutus EID MAR Denarius that I received with a book I bought. I do like that coin.

SwK

If u do not mind copies there are a few great one in Spinks MARCH Circular, some spectacular, see early listing http://www.petitioncrown.com/SPINK_CIRCULAR.html
interesting they do not appear very ofton.

SWK
www.petitioncrown.com