The Real 2001 Bowman Chrome Albert Pujols 005/500
eyegide
Posts: 7
OK, here I go with my first post on this or any other message board about this topic. I have followed this board and a few others for several months and have decided that this is where I will get the most knowledgable advise about my issue. I oppened several boxes of 2001 Bowman Chrome Baseball and in one of those boxes I pulled an Albert Pujols Autographed redemption card. The card I recieved is #'D 005/500. I aso had several other very good pulls in these boxes. I watched the Pulols card quite often on ebay to keep up with its current value. I was shocked a little over a year ago when in my ebay search I found a PSA graded 5/500 listed for $15,000.00 and I went...Whats up with this?? I then sent my 005/500 and several other cards to BGS for grading. When my cards arrived I was just as shocked to find that BGS refused to grade the Pujols card and said that they questioned the authenticity because of the 0 or 0's and said they would be glad to grade this at a later date if Topps would authenticate the card. When I contacted Topps and gave them their # off the card and asked for help, I was told they do not keep records back that far. I now have a file at least a 1/2 inch thick of other auctions and message board comments about all the fake cards that have been sold or attempted sales. I have the card locked up along with a copy of the redemption card and the date it was mailed and the date I received the card. I am looking for advise as to how if this had happened to you, you would handle the issue.....Thanks!! and for the skeptics....I am a 60 year old hunting and fishing guide with over 500 ebay trans with perfect feedback and also opened enough boxes of 01 and 02 Topps Heritage Baseball to put (2 ) complete sets of each year together.....and if anyone needs help filling those sets, I'm sure I could help them
hunting/fishing guide/collector
0
Comments
Welcome to the boards.
Who was selling the 5/500 on ebay? Do you have a pic (incl. serial #) of the one on ebay and yours you could post on here?
Unsure if you aware but FCB (Freedom Cardboard) would be another good board to post this on.
Is it 001/500 etc...?Seems like a tough situation..
<< <i>I am at my other work site right now and do not have my file with me...I do have though the last alledged fake...Ebay #25052909494....interesting enough BGS graded 9....5/500 seller movieboxxx >>
ebay completed auctions wont go back that far.
would love to see a scan of the redemption card and date!
I cropped the pictures sent to me to fit as they are now. The dated redemption card is to follow, looking forward to hear everyone's comments!
To recap, there has been at least four graded Pujols RC Chrome Auto's with the serial # of 5, eyegide is saying that his is the (or a) original #5 card and he has owned it since Topps sent to him. The problem is that his card was recently turned away for questionable authenticity when sent in for grading, probably due to the amount of #5's that have hit the market. For those unaware of how the serial number is changed, basically nail polish remover and q-tip will remove the number without harming the card.
5/500 Topps sticker #3040260 PSA 9 PSA serial #40002731
5/500 Topps sticker #3040227 BGS 8
005/500 Topps sticker #3040244 BGS 9.5
005/500 Topps sticker #3040359 PSA 9 O/C serial #30119083
005/500 Topps sticker #3040497
looks like no matter how much you try to prove that its the original one nobody is
going to believe you. It is an awesome card and from what I gather the autograph is legit just not the numbering?
Or thats at least why they (BGS) turned it away?
ON ITS WAY TO NEWPORT BEACH, CA 92658
i have 21/500......the auto matches mine.....
Pujols signed quickly when he got to the end of the pile (high numbered /500's have very clean Auto's)
i have to check the topps sticker number, if it fits sequential to this number, its a match....
so far the auto matches up with a low number auto....
the numbers are sequenced.
ON ITS WAY TO NEWPORT BEACH, CA 92658
<< <i>It looks like 108/500 is numbered 3040349 and 171/500 is numbered 3040285 if that helps. It doesn't look like
the numbers are sequenced. >>
Actually, doesn't that prove they are probably sequenced??
3040349-3040285= 64
171-108= 63
That's only a +/- of 1 over a run of 60 some cards?
<< <i>My thing is that would have been in a holder many many years ago. Sorry you snooze you lose and looks like no matter how much you try to prove that its the original one nobody is going to believe you. It is an awesome card and from what I gather the autograph is legit just not the numbering? Or thats at least why they (BGS) turned it away? >>
I disagree, if evidence shows that "5/500" is numbered differently then the rest of them, it's enough to prove to me that the "005/500" is the real deal. If some kind of sequence in the holograms can be identified, even better. I'm not saying that the "5/500" is a counterfeit, but more likely the first two numbers were erased......maybe 105/500?
This is an iconic card, the history of the card will be available as time goes on. Threads like this will help explain to future hobbyists the
issue with these two cards 5/500 and 005/500. Matter in fact, if the owner of 005/500 would like to sell it, I may be interested in buying it.
<< <i>
<< <i>It looks like 108/500 is numbered 3040349 and 171/500 is numbered 3040285 if that helps. It doesn't look like
the numbers are sequenced. >>
Actually, doesn't that prove they are probably sequenced??
3040349-3040285= 64
171-108= 63
That's only a +/- of 1 over a run of 60 some cards? >>
Ok his is 005/500 and its 3040497 and that is a 44 difference. It doesn't match up
ON ITS WAY TO NEWPORT BEACH, CA 92658
<< <i>[
I disagree, if evidence shows that "5/500" is numbered differently then the rest of them, it's enough to prove to me that the "005/500" is the real deal. If some kind of sequence in the holograms can be identified, even better. I'm not saying that the "5/500" is a counterfeit, but more likely the first two numbers were erased......maybe 105/500?
This is an iconic card, the history of the card will be available as time goes on. Threads like this will help explain to future hobbyists the
issue with these two cards 5/500 and 005/500. Matter in fact, if the owner of 005/500 would like to sell it, I may be interested in buying it. >>
actually, thats not to far off the possibility,, i do know that in nascar collectibles action made limited numbers of cars 2 of 4557, 45 of 4557,, so on , what they did to get around this is added a sticker or 2 to the car and they made it so the limited run started over, not saying this is the way the cards were marked but it is possible you have card 5/500 but there is also a 005/500, anything possible in the collectible world,,, bj
ON ITS WAY TO NEWPORT BEACH, CA 92658
as opposed to being a 005 of 500? Lower number fetch higher dollars?
If not I see no reason why anyone would do such a thing.
Thanks in advance for the answer.
Steve
My Registry Sets
<< <i>I've got no opinion on these cards one way or another, but I find these Pujols card threads fascinating. Which card was the subject on controversy a couple of months back? >>
Steve
<< <i>Ahhhh thanks Doran, I did not realize that.
Steve >>
dont know if your serious
ON ITS WAY TO NEWPORT BEACH, CA 92658
<< <i>the 005/500 has been a source of controversy for a while. There are also problems with fake Fleer Legacy autographed rookie cards as well.
>>
That's the card I was thinking of. There was some debate because some of the cards have autographs and some don't.
Again, thanks to Doran for answering my question.
Steve
Guess I didn't care enough about Pujols to know his jersey number.
This one is when sending this card in to get authenticated/graded would it be possible to send in the
redemption card with it? Wouldn't that help?
Or are these people also counterfeiting/reprinting these as well?
Sorry if this has already been mentioned.
Steve
It sounds like they do. So, we have a slabbed counterfeit/altered card floating around that passes as legit?
This is confusing.
If the Beckett people want Topps to authenticate, shouldn't they have that burden in order to verify? If they hand it back to the customer, the string of possession becomes questionable too.
Also, if there is a 005/500 and a 5/500, that makes no sense. So, there are more than 500 of these cards around? No, that makes no sense. What would be 125/500? You cannot write it 0125/500. That would be silly.
BST: Tennessebanker, Downtown1974, LarkinCollector, nendee
There are more than 1 of the card numbered "5" since all but 1 are fake.
All it takes a wipe off and rewrite to make the card 005/500.
If this is indeed the original 005/500, good luck getting it authenticated.
The scammer who originally sent one in with the 005/500 made the money that you should have.
I'm sorry this happened to you.
<< <i>I find it hard to believe that Topps can't keep digital records from 9 years ago >>
I'm not shocked. I think they only went online with redemptions in the last two years long after Upper Deck and others.
The ink that was used to write the 5/500 should be analyzed. If the card is real, but the digits were erases with nail polish remover, something had to be used to rewrite the digits. That something could not possibly be the same ink used. I know it would take some forensic science to do the test, but it is done all the time.
Beckett and PSA better be worried that there is a slabbed altered card out there.
With thousands of dollars at stake, the Pujols should be brought to the attention of Topps, Beckett and PSA and tell them you will seek an independent investigator to do an ink test. Topps must disclose the type of ink used to the forensics investigator. Sure a sample of ink will be missing from the card, but that is nothing compared to what is at stake here.
BST: Tennessebanker, Downtown1974, LarkinCollector, nendee
Good point. I am surprised they have no records whatsoever. It would help the OP's case if Topps had the mailing list of what addresses they sent out the cards to. Its funny, but data that can often be useful is not saved yet we have such odd things being preserved like Tiger Wood's old text messages to his mistresses, Roger Clemens bloody guaze by MacNamee, etc.....
I mean, we live in an age where data can easily be stored without taking up space. Sometimes we want certain data to be erased from a certain data base like our social security numbers, credit card numbers, text messages, emails, whatever..... A store or former mistress or ex girlfriend should never have those...
BST: Tennessebanker, Downtown1974, LarkinCollector, nendee
IMO, this card was originally #'d 105, 205, 305 or 405/500.
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