Pack Submission ???

fattymacs

I've never subbed any packs, so I thought I would throw out some questions for anyone whom may be in the know.

1. Can raw packs be subbed with crossovers?

2. How does one "pack" the raw packs for shipping to PSA?

3. If you have crossed-over GAI packs (old flip) what have been your results?

daddymc

Can you crossover packs?

fattymacs

<< <i>Can you crossover packs? >>



Dunno, that can be question A1 I guess

grote15

I've had great success crossing over GAI packs in PSA holders, often actually getting a bump in the grade, too.

However, you need to cut the pack out of the GAI holder, as Steve has difficulty evaluating the pack inside the GAI slab, and I do think there is some bias there, too.

I submit my packs by wrapping each one in bubble wrap and submitting them in a sturdy box with peanuts.

leathtech

I sub my packs inside a plastic bag with a top loader behind the pack and then rap in bubble wrap and peanuts. I've had poor results lately subbing packs - packs I've sent in are coming back with small rips that I know where not there when the pack was sent in... I've been wondering how well PSA takes care of the packs after they are sent in. If the packs are sent from us to Steve at the BBCE and then back to PSA to be slabbed - I'm wondering how well the packs are being treated. Personally I think the packs are traveling way to many miles in the grading process.

hotmush

Permission to hijack a thread regarding pack grading criteria?

leathtech

<< <i>Permission to hijack a thread regarding pack grading criteria? >>



Any pack that shows signs of wear or small rips will be a 7 sometimes 6 depending on severity of rips.

Most packs I've found become 8's if there are no rips.

If the pack looks great and case fresh probably a 9.

10's are very hard to get I've subbed over 60 packs and have only gotten a 10 (3 or 4 times).

Mickey71

Just my opinion----but a guy who heavily buys and sells packs is also grading them. I do not agree with this at all. I don't care if he's the most respected pack guy in the hobby. That is crazy and reeks of conflict of interest.

mikelowell25

mickey--steve doesnt grade the packs, he merely authenticates them (ie he says if they're authentic or not); after he says yea or nay they get sent back to psa where they're assigned a grade by the graders (but only the ones he deems authentic, of course).

fattymacs

Thanks for the replies, I'll report back in a few months when they come home.

leathtech

<< <i>Thanks for the replies, I'll report back in a few months when they come home. >>



It does normally take them a full 2 months to get packs graded!

summerof68

Excellent reply given by Grote15. He mentions that he ships his packs in a sturdy box (with peanuts). It is critical that you ship your wax packs using peanuts.

I spoke with my post office and they said it is common at the main sorting centers for small packages to be tossed by sorters as far as 10 feet into the appropriate hoppers.

So in this scenerio you want your packs to have a little room to move within the peanuts and absorb the impact and keeping the gum stable within the wrapper.

But if you pack your packs tightly with no room to move then upon impact the packs will not move causing the effects of inertia to thrust forward the gum--and we know what happens then--torn wrappers.

Just keep in mind that your valuable packs will be flying in the air as much as 10 feet and slamming down against others boxes so by all means use the peanuts!

flatfoot816

yes packs can be crossed over. Grote is correct that it is difficult for Steve to see thru the GAI holders, and as such some packs come back as "cannot determine". In my case, all of my GAI packs were bought many moons ago...ie...when they had legit and top notch graders handling them. Thus I am confident that they are legit. If it is a high grade pack, I ask for a minimum grade.

Since I am sure that they are legit, I am hesitant to remove them from the GAI holder before shipping. I would prefer to have a high grade GAI pack that I know is legit, than having it removed and PSA not grading it. I think in the long run, a high grade GAI holder with the old flips is better than having a raw pack.

Mickey71

Flatfoot,
Did you use Legit and GAI in the same paragraph multiple times. I do beg to differ with you. Recent history is showing us that at no time was the grading at GAI on the up and up. I just looked at Kepplers GAI inventory and he has a ton of 9's on tough cards for a huge discount compared to PSA.----The reason is that they are either overgraded or trimmed. Most have the old flips too. I have witnessed on these boards and at shows what GAI did to damage this hobby. They, in my honest opinion started the true fear about trimmed cards in holders. The reason being is that collectors and major dealers for about 2 years saw them as PSA's equal and they nailed everyone.

mojorob

Does PSA ever run specials on 1950's-60's pack grading?

flatfoot816

yes there are many legit packs graded by GAI. The recent probelms (last 2 years) have soured people. But before PSA grading packs, GAI was the only place. Many respected and knowledgable pack collectors had their packs graded (me included). This is what I was referring to. It would be foolish to think that GAI NEVER graded authentic packs. Over graded? Perhaps. But overgarded does not mean they are not legit.

leathtech

<< <i>Does PSA ever run specials on 1950's-60's pack grading? >>



I've never seen specials that go that old... I think 1972 is the latest they have gone. I've only been around a few years now and I think there has only been 2 pack specials. I think the reason they stop at '72 is the fact most packs older than that are high price collectables and even the monthly specials have a max value.

fattymacs

To adress the GAI graded pack issue, 2 of the packs I want to send are GAI old flip examples. One looks nice for the grade and the other looks to be one of the best packs I've seen. I have no issues with buying old-issue GAI packs.

packCollector

<< <i>I sub my packs inside a plastic bag with a top loader behind the pack and then rap in bubble wrap and peanuts. I've had poor results lately subbing packs - packs I've sent in are coming back with small rips that I know where not there when the pack was sent in... I've been wondering how well PSA takes care of the packs after they are sent in. If the packs are sent from us to Steve at the BBCE and then back to PSA to be slabbed - I'm wondering how well the packs are being treated. Personally I think the packs are traveling way to many miles in the grading process.
>>



the issue is not how they are treated before slabbing , the issue is the slab does not protect the pack from the gum after slabbing

Buccaneer

<< <i>
the issue is not how they are treated before slabbing , the issue is the slab does not protect the pack from the gum after slabbing >>



Very true. Numerous stories of how the gums rips a hole within the slabs, including one of mine. Supposedly, PSA is working on correcting this.

grote15

Flatfoot is absolutely correct. Virtually all of my GAI unopened packs are in first generation holders and they are 100% legit. In fact, I have not yet had a single pack yet come back rejected from PSA when I submitted them here, and I've also opened my fair share of GAI graded packs and have pulled many high grade cards. Are there bad GAI packs out there? Yes, but long-time collectors know which ones to avoid in the old holders ("grocery" cellos, bad 1958 cellos). There are also a large number of bad wax packs with the new flip which were fabricated from rolls of wrappers (1977, 1978)...when GAI first arrived on the scene and launched their pack grading service, they had very reputable graders doing the work. I have never bought any GAI graded cards, so I can't speak to that part of their business, but there are many 100% authentic GAI graded packs in the marketplace (though personally I'm reluctant to buy anything they've graded the last few years, unless I know the source).

flatfoot816

not sure how PSA can correct the gum moving issue. I subbed a beautiful '68 BB wax pack. Came back a PSA-9...with a huge piece of gum sticking thru 1 side.

Obviosuly happened after grading and in transit back to me.