I would like to get started...

Cubby

collecting precious metals. What do you recommend I start buying? What
do I have to be careful of? At this time, I am leaning toward gold. Any advice is
appreciated.

Cladiator

We'd need to know more details before worthwhile advice could be given. Details like what are your purposes for buying...collecting for fun, building a non-cash savings, protecting wealth from inflation, compulsive hoarding, to store stable wealth in preparedness for a SHTF scenario, etc... It's also vital to know what range of finances you are looking to move into metals both in the short term and long term. Do you plan on keeping this metal for an extended period of time (5+ years) or to do the buy/sell thing in an effort to increase your holdings. Do you plan on storing the metal yourself or are you comfortable with buying paper deeds to your metal that is stored by a private company? If you plan on storing yourself, how much room do you have to devote to storage?

These questions may seem invasive and truth be told they are. Regardless, they must be answered for one to accurately decide how they want to dive into the precious metals market. You don't have to share the answers with us if you don't feel comfortable but at least answer them honestly to yourself so you can attack this decision with the best information available. In this way you'll stand a much better chance of deciding on a strategy that really works for you.

cars

Be careful of the fake & Replica gold bars/rounds/coins

MrOrganic

at these prices, market conditions, premiums

10 ounce silver bars, 1 ounce rounds

american silver eagles also if you can find some around 1.50-1.75 over spot

jmski52

I agree with what Cladiator said. Is your intention to build a collection, or to invest in precious metal?

konsole

since he didnt give a guarantee about what precious metal he wants to start with I think its a safe bet to assume hes looking at more of an investment/inflation hedge rather then simply starting a collection.

lathmach

You'd be better off putting your money in stocks.
My IRAs are up 0ver 30% in just the last 3 months.

Ray

Cubby

konsole is correct. I was looking more for a short term investment. (With a
minimal return) I will probably end up just saving cash (with no return) just
so I will be able to sleep. (Too many scams) Even though I might save cash,
it still might be counterfeit.

jmski52

Cubby, you sound like you don't trust anybody with your money. You sound kinda like me, lol.

Ray, my fiancee' is still down about 30% in her state-run retirement account even though her gain in the last 3 months is about 30%. She's really pissed about it. I don't blame her. The administrator of the fund even got a bonus for losing less than expected. Heck, how's your machine shop business? Your business ought to be a fairly good indicator for manufacturing activity and credit markets, but not necessarily a good indicator for the ultimate disposition of US debt and toxic assets and how those things will affect the dollar and the stock markets. I don't see how earnings will stand up to what's coming, period. No earnings means no reason to invest. Already earnings have crashed and P/E's are unreasonably high by historical standards. Your 30% gain in 3 months was not based on any fundamentals, and that's a risky bet, even if you've been fortunate.

What killed it for me with stocks is when Hank Paulson stood in front of the cameras and described all the terrible things that would happen if Congress didn't do exactly what he wanted to the tune of $800 Billion. It's only become worse since then. Note, this is the same Hank Paulson who golden parachuted out of Goldman Sachs with a cool $Half Billion. We haven't even begun to see the impacts that higher taxes will have on businesses. I guess if you are one of the "chosen ones" or Al Gore, your business will do extremely well, but the rest of us are going to get killed.

Now it comes to light in court depositions that a Goldman software developer is under investigation for transferring a copy of Goldman's trading software to a server somewhere in Europe. No big deal except that the software is a rapid-fire program that is designed to manipulate stock prices in order to produce routine gains. The game has been rigged for a long time, but this was the icing on the cake for me. Who you gonna trust? Paulson, Bernake, Geithner, Corleone & Co. or your own instincts? If you think that the dollar or stocks are going to be left standing, have at it. I don't.

If you buy precious metals, you will pay the price of admission in a premium above the melt price. The premium varies with the amount purchased, the denomination and with the market for precious metals. The metals market is manipulated by the big boys, too. OTOH, what I like about precious metals is that you always know how much you have, and you don't have to worry about the monetary system crashing one day because of a few hundred $Trillion in bad bets by the hedge funds and investment bankers being revalued to market when FASB decides to change their standards (again) to reflect the reality of what's on their balance sheets. And that's just for starters, not even considering the resets on home mortgages, consumer credit and the commercial real estate crisis that is brewing.

Sorry if I ran away with this thread, but I don't think that your instincts are all that wrong. Make your own decisions, but know as many of the alternatives that are available as possible, and how they will react if different situations might occur.

ProofCollection

<< <i>konsole is correct. I was looking more for a short term investment. (With a
minimal return) I will probably end up just saving cash (with no return) just
so I will be able to sleep. (Too many scams) Even though I might save cash,
it still might be counterfeit. >>



Physical gold bullion is not good for short term investing because the spread is usually 10% or more. You can minimize the spread if you know what you are doing by buying and selling to private parties, but if you don't know what you are doing it's not a good idea since you may get scammed. For short term PM trading, stick with the ETFs or futures.

Norseman88

<< <i>Cubby, you sound like you don't trust anybody with your money. You sound kinda like me, lol.

Ray, my fiancee' is still down about 30% in her state-run retirement account even though her gain in the last 3 months is about 30%. She's really pissed about it. I don't blame her. The administrator of the fund even got a bonus for losing less than expected. Heck, how's your machine shop business? Your business ought to be a fairly good indicator for manufacturing activity and credit markets, but not necessarily a good indicator for the ultimate disposition of US debt and toxic assets and how those things will affect the dollar and the stock markets. I don't see how earnings will stand up to what's coming, period. No earnings means no reason to invest. Already earnings have crashed and P/E's are unreasonably high by historical standards. Your 30% gain in 3 months was not based on any fundamentals, and that's a risky bet, even if you've been fortunate.

What killed it for me with stocks is when Hank Paulson stood in front of the cameras and described all the terrible things that would happen if Congress didn't do exactly what he wanted to the tune of $800 Billion. It's only become worse since then. Note, this is the same Hank Paulson who golden parachuted out of Goldman Sachs with a cool $Half Billion. We haven't even begun to see the impacts that higher taxes will have on businesses. I guess if you are one of the "chosen ones" or Al Gore, your business will do extremely well, but the rest of us are going to get killed.

Now it comes to light in court depositions that a Goldman software developer is under investigation for transferring a copy of Goldman's trading software to a server somewhere in Europe. No big deal except that the software is a rapid-fire program that is designed to manipulate stock prices in order to produce routine gains. The game has been rigged for a long time, but this was the icing on the cake for me. Who you gonna trust? Paulson, Bernake, Geithner, Corleone & Co. or your own instincts? If you think that the dollar or stocks are going to be left standing, have at it. I don't.

If you buy precious metals, you will pay the price of admission in a premium above the melt price. The premium varies with the amount purchased, the denomination and with the market for precious metals. The metals market is manipulated by the big boys, too. OTOH, what I like about precious metals is that you always know how much you have, and you don't have to worry about the monetary system crashing one day because of a few hundred $Trillion in bad bets by the hedge funds and investment bankers being revalued to market when FASB decides to change their standards (again) to reflect the reality of what's on their balance sheets. And that's just for starters, not even considering the resets on home mortgages, consumer credit and the commercial real estate crisis that is brewing.

Sorry if I ran away with this thread, but I don't think that your instincts are all that wrong. Make your own decisions, but know as many of the alternatives that are available as possible, and how they will react if different situations might occur. >>



I agree with much of what you said however it's ironic that you mentioned Hank Paulson and GS.
Because of the trading software and money from the Fed Goldman Sachs along with JP Morgan Chase can deploy money from the Fed to speculate in the stock market thus helping to prop up stocks.
Eventually this scheme will not work, the money center banks will be touting stocks enticing the Lemmings while liqidating their positions and most likely entering short positions but until this happens stocks will probably keep going up.

jmski52

it's ironic that you mentioned Hank Paulson and GS.
Because of the trading software and money from the Fed Goldman Sachs along with JP Morgan Chase can deploy money from the Fed to speculate in the stock market thus helping to prop up stocks.
Eventually this scheme will not work, the money center banks will be touting stocks enticing the Lemmings while liqidating their positions and most likely entering short positions but until this happens stocks will probably keep going up.

I mentioned that, not to be ironic but to demonstrate what killed my enthusiasm for any type of stock investment. The market has always been rigged in various ways, but now it is rigged from head to toe, and corruption permeates the order execution system,
the regulators, the investment banks, the hedge funds, the media reporting, and the government stats. Why play that game?

And bonds - just remember that all precedents have been violated as far as bondholders are concerned. The Autoworkers have been given priority over bondholders in the Chrysler workout, which is a direct assault on property rights and contract law. If they can trash contract law on corporate bonds, what's the difference when it comes to T-Bills? The Fed is buying T-Bills (with imaginary money) in order to prop up prices, and the Treasury is manufacturing T-Bills as fast as they can issue them to anyone who will bid for them (a dwindling group, by the way). Why trust these guys? They are all scammers, and they just happen to be running the financial system. Does that make them legit? NO WAY.

yellowkid

<< <i>You'd be better off putting your money in stocks.
My IRAs are up 0ver 30% in just the last 3 months.

Ray >>



After you have your savings and retiremnet portfolios set up, then if you want to keep a little gold as a hedge or because you enjoy it, fine. If however, you're saving it to spend at the corner store after the apocalypse, then you will probably end up leaving it to your heirs when you die. There is a reason they call gold a non producing asset.

derryb

modern gold eagles. plentiful, not a lot over spot, and always strong resell. plenty of sizes and flavors to keep you busy building a collection. and when you get bored with it you can always get your money back with a profit.

If you take the earlier advice on stocks, I would focus on gold an silver producers. stay away from PM ETFs, nothing but paper metal that will someday burst.