<< <i>But the question was "THE GREATEST BASEBALL PLAYER OF ALL TIME". >>
If you honestly think that then Ruth should be eliminated based on his fielding stats that wouldn't even rank in the top 55 OFs in 2009 Here's Ruth's attrocious fielding statsbaberuth.com >>
You want to compare fielding stats of a person who wore this glove:
to a person who wears a glove like this?
YA THINK IT MIGHT BE JUST A LITTLE EASIER TO CATCH A BALL TODAY THAN IT WAS 80+YEARS AGO? THAT, MY FRIEND, IS NOT A VERY FAIR COMPARISON! DON'T YOU AGREE?
INTERESTING STAT: When Babe Ruth hit 60 home runs in 1927, he hit 14% of all home runs in his league that year. For a player to hit 14% of all home runs today, he would have to hit over 300 home runs in one season.
STAY HEALTHY!
Doug
Liquidating my collection for the 3rd and final time. Time for others to enjoy what I have enjoyed over the last several decades. Money could be put to better use.
<< <i>Babe Ruth was the greatest, but the better debate is the 2nd best. I say Cobb. To add to what the above poster said, I think about only 20 players have hit above .367 in a season let alone their career since Cobb retired. That is remarkable. >>
I agree with that and I think the top 4 are clear.
1. Ruth 2. Cobb 3. Williams 4. Mays
In my view #5 is a blanket around a number of possibilities, but if I had to make a choice I gotta go with Barry Bonds (unfortunately).
<< <i>Greatest hitter : Ted Williams Greatest all around player: Willie Mays Player you would want to build your team around: Babe Ruth Greatest Pitcher: depends on the day you ask me (Johnson, Mathewson, Young, Paige, and Maddux are the first 5 to come to mind). >>
9. Mantle 8. Musial 7. Aaron 6. Bonds* 5. Cobb 4. Honus Wagner 3. T. Williams 2. Mays 1. Ruth
if you're asking
best pure hitter - Williams best power hitter - Ruth best all around positional player - Mays best pitcher - too difficult to compare eras in pitching...no sliders, cutters, splitters, changeups in the Johnson/Mathewson days. Those guys then were mainly 2 pitch pitchers. That's why I think guys like Brett and Gwynn are supremely underrated when it comes to all-time fanfare given that today's hitters are faced with much wider arrays of pitches. Even going back to the 60's I doubt there were many SPs who had more than 2 or 3 pitches tops. No splitters, cutters, most had no change-up etc.
<< <i>Babe Ruth was the greatest, but the better debate is the 2nd best. I say Cobb. To add to what the above poster said, I think about only 20 players have hit above .367 in a season let alone their career since Cobb retired. That is remarkable. >>
Nah, dozens upon dozens of guys have hit .367 in a season. Heck, there's been 28 seasons of .400 or better in MLB history by roughly 20 different guys. Someone hitting .3665 for a season (.367 when rounded) would only be in a tie for the 179th best season average of all-time. In fact, since 1990, an average of .367 or better has been done nine times by seven different guys (Tony Gwynn did it three times - everybody else once). Remember Todd Helton and Larry Walker hitting .370? Or Andres Gallaraga? OK, forget the Coors Field guys, how about Nomar? Or Ichiro?
Still, all those guys did it once. Cobb did it over a period of 24 seasons.
It is the actual person of one George Herman Ruth.
It's because his offensive statistics, when compared to others of the same era, are outstanding. Well then what about pitchers? A hitter and pitcher use very different tools. He pitched well too, which brings closure to that angle of the debate.
Sheesh, just look at all the nicknames, "The Babe", "The Bambino", "The Sultan Of Swat". Babe Ruth is the Greatest Baseball Player ever.
Perhaps, a somewhat different approach to demonstrate Ruth's greatness. Instead of focusing on what Ruth did, imagine what a player would have to do supplant Ruth as the greatest.
A .400 career batting average? 1000 career home runs? 3000 career RBIs? A 1.500 career OPS? I don't any player will accomplish these career numbers. But even if he did, the argument could still be made that Ruth is the greatest. I think that is a testament to the greatness of Babe Ruth.
/s/ JackWESQ
P.S. On second thought, if someone came along and actually broke Cy Young's record of 511 career wins, I think that player would supplant Ruth as the greatest.
collecting RAW Topps baseball cards 1952 Highs to 1972. looking for collector grade (somewhere between psa 4-7 condition). let me know what you have, I'll take it, I want to finish sets, I must have something you can use for trade.
looking for Topps 71-72 hi's-62-53-54-55-59, I have these sets started
<< <i>Perhaps, a somewhat different approach to demonstrate Ruth's greatness. Instead of focusing on what Ruth did, imagine what a player would have to do supplant Ruth as the greatest.
A .400 career batting average? 1000 career home runs? 3000 career RBIs? A 1.500 career OPS? I don't any player will accomplish these career numbers. But even if he did, the argument could still be made that Ruth is the greatest. I think that is a testament to the greatness of Babe Ruth.
/s/ JackWESQ
P.S. On second thought, if someone came along and actually broke Cy Young's record of 511 career wins, I think that player would supplant Ruth as the greatest. >>
And let's not forget that Ruth would've made the Hall of Fame as a pitcher had he not abandoned that to become one of the greatest hitters in the history of the Major Leagues.
1. Cobb 2. Ruth 3. Mays 4. T. Williams 5. Honus Wagner
Cobb had more guts in his pinky than 90% of modern players. Ruth just misses the number one slot for me due to the fact that I personally would have enjoyed seeing the violent mayhem of Cobb on the basepaths over seeing Ruth's continuous homer blasts. One never know what Cobb would do next , thus he kept people on the edges of their seats. With Ruth you just knew what was most likely coming. To me Mays is the best all around , five tool player. I seriously have no doubt that he probably could have been one hell of a pitcher if he wanted to. Williams comes in second to Cobb as the best pure hitter. The lost war years may very well have cost him the number one slot on my list. Wagner comes in fifth as the greatest combined offensive and defensive force. If he wasn't of the deadball era I have no doubt that he would be number three on my list instead of Mays.
You play to win the game. I don't think anyone can reasonably argue against that. And when it comes to winning, there is no bigger winner in baseball than Lawrence "Yogi" Berra, who won ten (10) World Series. Perhaps he is the greatest baseball player ever. He did win three (3) AL MVP awards and finished second twice, third once and fourth once. Plus, of the four (4) World Series that he lost, three (3) of them were in seven games. So he could have easily won thirteen (13) World Series. How crazy is that?!
If Chuck Norris grew up in the pre-war era he'd blast homers with one handed swings, Babe Ruth would be his bat boy. If Ty Cobb attempted to slide and spike Chuck Norris he'd get a flying knee to the noggin and Chuck would still turn the double play.
Caramelcollector is right. Don't quite your day job. I haven't tried some of that fine tavern fare yet, to wit:
1. Scotch Eggs; 2. Maryland Crab Soup; 3. The Diamond Burger w/ Side of Hand-Cut French Fries; 4. Fish & Chips; 5. Side of Sage Andouille Stuffing; and 6. Coca-Cola (Couple glasses would be good).
I didn't see a dessert menu. I will assume that is an oversight on your part, because no dessert is unacceptable.
Ya, CD, don't quit your day job. I for one think Albert Pujols is better than Gary Roenicke. Really if you look at what Pujols has done the first 8 years of his career... I don't think Gary Roenicke could even sniff Albert's jock! Do your homework CD!
dont know who fandengo is but i like maryland crab soup...maybe i should try it? as long as there are no flies in it...what is the name of that restaurant anyway?
Caramelcollector- You ask if Ted Williams is the greatest ever. Do you really think he is better than Albert Pujols? Really? I don't see how you could think that. Support your case please.
He's the guy you're talking to in this thread about Caramel cards. Amazing you guys write the same, collect the same semi-oddball pre-war sets that almost nobody else on here collects, and have the same negative disposition towards me (even though I've never said two words to "caramelcollector"). The funny thing is you've accused me multiple times of having alts and talking to myself in threads (neither are true), yet there you are doing the same. Time well spent my friend, congrats on wasting your life.
um CD, that is the first thing i ever dirrected at you and it was because you post was just not funny...gary roenike? are we 8 years old? you try to be a comic judgeing by all your "wise -crack" comments, but they come across as lame...nothing personal
edited:since when is 1915 cracker jack ODD BALL? thats a good one
It is a little know fact that Albert Pujols actually owns Ted Williams' head. He got the idea from Futurama.
The key to Pujols success is the gene splicing that he had done with Ted Williams' DNA. Ted Williams dies in 2002 just when Pujols career starts to take off. So Pujols stats should actually count for Ted Williams.
If you think Pujols is good now, just wait until Hank Aaron dies.
Comments
<< <i>
<< <i>But the question was "THE GREATEST BASEBALL PLAYER OF ALL TIME". >>
If you honestly think that then Ruth should be eliminated based on his fielding stats that wouldn't even rank in the top 55 OFs in 2009
Here's Ruth's attrocious fielding statsbaberuth.com >>
You want to compare fielding stats of a person who wore this glove:
to a person who wears a glove like this?
YA THINK IT MIGHT BE JUST A LITTLE EASIER TO CATCH A BALL TODAY THAN IT WAS 80+YEARS AGO? THAT, MY FRIEND, IS NOT A VERY FAIR COMPARISON! DON'T YOU AGREE?
INTERESTING STAT: When Babe Ruth hit 60 home runs in 1927, he hit 14% of all home runs in his league that year. For a player to hit 14% of all home runs today, he would have to hit over 300 home runs in one season.
Doug
Liquidating my collection for the 3rd and final time. Time for others to enjoy what I have enjoyed over the last several decades. Money could be put to better use.
Leaves Ruth. 714 is a magic number when compared to his contemporaries.
<< <i>Babe Ruth was the greatest, but the better debate is the 2nd best. I say Cobb. To add to what the above poster said, I think about only 20 players have hit above .367 in a season let alone their career since Cobb retired. That is remarkable. >>
I agree with that and I think the top 4 are clear.
1. Ruth
2. Cobb
3. Williams
4. Mays
In my view #5 is a blanket around a number of possibilities, but if I had to make a choice I gotta go with Barry Bonds (unfortunately).
<< <i>Greatest hitter : Ted Williams
Greatest all around player: Willie Mays
Player you would want to build your team around: Babe Ruth
Greatest Pitcher: depends on the day you ask me (Johnson, Mathewson, Young, Paige, and Maddux are the first 5 to come to mind). >>
Give me a break..... Babe Ruth period. chaz
9. Mantle
8. Musial
7. Aaron
6. Bonds*
5. Cobb
4. Honus Wagner
3. T. Williams
2. Mays
1. Ruth
if you're asking
best pure hitter - Williams
best power hitter - Ruth
best all around positional player - Mays
best pitcher - too difficult to compare eras in pitching...no sliders, cutters, splitters, changeups in the Johnson/Mathewson days. Those guys then were mainly 2 pitch pitchers. That's why I think guys like Brett and Gwynn are supremely underrated when it comes to all-time fanfare given that today's hitters are faced with much wider arrays of pitches. Even going back to the 60's I doubt there were many SPs who had more than 2 or 3 pitches tops. No splitters, cutters, most had no change-up etc.
<< <i>I can't believe that Rogers Hornsby hasn't seen more love in this debate. The best right handed hitter of all-time. His stats are amazing!!! >>
Agreed the best righty ever, but not the best player.
I wish I had HBO, I'm dying to see the Ted Williams documentary.
<< <i>Babe Ruth was the greatest, but the better debate is the 2nd best. I say Cobb. To add to what the above poster said, I think about only 20 players have hit above .367 in a season let alone their career since Cobb retired. That is remarkable. >>
Nah, dozens upon dozens of guys have hit .367 in a season. Heck, there's been 28 seasons of .400 or better in MLB history by roughly 20 different guys. Someone hitting .3665 for a season (.367 when rounded) would only be in a tie for the 179th best season average of all-time. In fact, since 1990, an average of .367 or better has been done nine times by seven different guys (Tony Gwynn did it three times - everybody else once). Remember Todd Helton and Larry Walker hitting .370? Or Andres Gallaraga? OK, forget the Coors Field guys, how about Nomar? Or Ichiro?
Still, all those guys did it once. Cobb did it over a period of 24 seasons.
Tabe
Barry Bonds because he was the best player I've ever seen in person.
Babe Ruth because that's what the majority of historians say, and best stats.
Dale Murphy and Don Mattingly because they were my favorites growing up.
Greg Maddux - best pitcher
It's because his offensive statistics, when compared to others of the same era, are outstanding. Well then what about pitchers? A hitter and pitcher use very different tools. He pitched well too, which brings closure to that angle of the debate.
Sheesh, just look at all the nicknames, "The Babe", "The Bambino", "The Sultan Of Swat". Babe Ruth is the Greatest Baseball Player ever.
A .400 career batting average? 1000 career home runs? 3000 career RBIs? A 1.500 career OPS? I don't any player will accomplish these career numbers. But even if he did, the argument could still be made that Ruth is the greatest. I think that is a testament to the greatness of Babe Ruth.
/s/ JackWESQ
P.S. On second thought, if someone came along and actually broke Cy Young's record of 511 career wins, I think that player would supplant Ruth as the greatest.
great cobbs
collecting RAW Topps baseball cards 1952 Highs to 1972. looking for collector grade (somewhere between psa 4-7 condition). let me know what you have, I'll take it, I want to finish sets, I must have something you can use for trade.
looking for Topps 71-72 hi's-62-53-54-55-59, I have these sets started
<< <i>Perhaps, a somewhat different approach to demonstrate Ruth's greatness. Instead of focusing on what Ruth did, imagine what a player would have to do supplant Ruth as the greatest.
A .400 career batting average? 1000 career home runs? 3000 career RBIs? A 1.500 career OPS? I don't any player will accomplish these career numbers. But even if he did, the argument could still be made that Ruth is the greatest. I think that is a testament to the greatness of Babe Ruth.
/s/ JackWESQ
P.S. On second thought, if someone came along and actually broke Cy Young's record of 511 career wins, I think that player would supplant Ruth as the greatest. >>
And let's not forget that Ruth would've made the Hall of Fame as a pitcher had he not abandoned that to become one of the greatest hitters in the history of the Major Leagues.
<< <i>onebamafan
great cobbs >>
Thanks........
/s/ JackWESQ
1. Cobb
2. Ruth
3. Mays
4. T. Williams
5. Honus Wagner
Cobb had more guts in his pinky than 90% of modern players. Ruth just misses the number one slot for me due to the fact that I personally would have enjoyed seeing the violent mayhem of Cobb on the basepaths over seeing Ruth's continuous homer blasts. One never know what Cobb would do next , thus he kept people on the edges of their seats. With Ruth you just knew what was most likely coming. To me Mays is the best all around , five tool player. I seriously have no doubt that he probably could have been one hell of a pitcher if he wanted to. Williams comes in second to Cobb as the best pure hitter. The lost war years may very well have cost him the number one slot on my list. Wagner comes in fifth as the greatest combined offensive and defensive force. If he wasn't of the deadball era I have no doubt that he would be number three on my list instead of Mays.
All you need to do is look at the 1920 season.
In 1920 Ruth out homered every single team in baseball except 1 (Philadelphia NL)
he also broke the career HR record something like 500 times, plus he was the best Lefty Pitcher in the teens, etc., etc.
Babe Ruth!
/s/ JackWESQ
yogi?
sure he won a lot, so did the rest of the team.
If Ty Cobb attempted to slide and spike Chuck Norris he'd get a flying knee to the noggin and Chuck would still turn the double play.
I say Chuck Norris by default.
CU Ancient Members badge member.
Collection: https://flickr.com/photos/185200668@N06/albums
<< <i>Gary Roenicke. >>
dont quit your day job "mr comedian".
<< <i>dont quit your day job "mr comedian". >>
Lee,
Caramelcollector is right. Don't quite your day job. I haven't tried some of that fine tavern fare yet, to wit:
1. Scotch Eggs;
2. Maryland Crab Soup;
3. The Diamond Burger w/ Side of Hand-Cut French Fries;
4. Fish & Chips;
5. Side of Sage Andouille Stuffing; and
6. Coca-Cola (Couple glasses would be good).
I didn't see a dessert menu. I will assume that is an oversight on your part, because no dessert is unacceptable.
/s/ JackWESQ
P.S. No corkage fee, for me ... Right?
<< <i>Gary Roenicke. >>
However, he cannot be mentioned without bringing up John Lowenstein.
<< <i>There is no best player. >>
Interesting. Perk, elaborate a bit.
Don't quit licking Pujols' jock fandango.
You ask if Ted Williams is the greatest ever. Do you really think he is better than Albert Pujols? Really? I don't see how you could think that. Support your case please.
He's the guy you're talking to in this thread about Caramel cards. Amazing you guys write the same, collect the same semi-oddball pre-war sets that almost nobody else on here collects, and have the same negative disposition towards me (even though I've never said two words to "caramelcollector"). The funny thing is you've accused me multiple times of having alts and talking to myself in threads (neither are true), yet there you are doing the same. Time well spent my friend, congrats on wasting your life.
edited:since when is 1915 cracker jack ODD BALL? thats a good one
The key to Pujols success is the gene splicing that he had done with Ted Williams' DNA. Ted Williams dies in 2002 just when Pujols career starts to take off. So Pujols stats should actually count for Ted Williams.
If you think Pujols is good now, just wait until Hank Aaron dies.
We have found the answer!