Not a bad error

silverpop · July 13, 2009 8:31AM

Well this 1889o Morgan is one i bought for $12 at a local coin shop, not a bad looking coin and it's got a nice error on it

closeup of the error

ctf_error_coins · July 13, 2009 8:41AM

you could double your money on ebay. nice pick up.

coindeuce · July 13, 2009 8:44AM

Not a minting error in the technical sense of the classification. The die crack on the reverse of your 1899-O Morgan is merely evidence that the reverse die was in a terminal stage of it's life, which is a normal consequence of over extended use in production. A Mint error is produced by an abnormal event in the coining process, i.e. a planchet improperly positioned in the collar producing a partial collar strike.

ctf_error_coins · July 13, 2009 8:54AM

A die crack is an error.

silverpop · July 13, 2009 9:08AM

anyways i've nicknamed the error the T&T error since it starts at a T and ends at a T

GoldenEyeNumismatics · July 13, 2009 9:09AM

<< A die crack is an error. >>

For all practical purposes, a die crack like that is not.

silverpop · July 13, 2009 9:20AM

well then what is it called if not a error and what would grading companies call it?

coinman420 · July 13, 2009 9:25AM

<< well then what is it called if not a error and what would grading companies call it? >>

they call it a die crack.

stinkinlincoln · July 13, 2009 9:29AM

I too wouldnt call this coin an error coin.

I like it though for $12 though. How did you get a Morgan for under melt?

Wheres this shop at?

commoncents05 · July 13, 2009 9:30AM

A die crack is a variety, not an error. An error is a unique coin, where a variety is an attribute of a die, and repeated onto several coins.

-Paul

silverpop · July 13, 2009 9:33AM

thanks

ctf_error_coins · July 13, 2009 10:01AM

A die crack is an error by definition, PERIOD.

tjkillian · July 13, 2009 10:15AM

<< A die crack is an error by definition, PERIOD. >>

No, die cracks are too common to be considered an error. Off-center, lamination, double struck, those are errors, a die crack is not.

Still, it is cool and a grading company will not classify it as an error either.

Congratulations!

CoinSeeker · July 13, 2009 10:16AM

Mine is a 1899 O also. They must have been made about the same time. Very nice find

silverpop · July 13, 2009 10:42AM

the owners retired and they closed the shop

Simple they sold them for melt value and at the time i bought the coin silver was cheap

thanks for all the help guys

WoodenJefferson · July 13, 2009 11:06AM

As per Mr. Fred Weinberg

Most Die Cracks and Filled Dies on all denominations of coins are very common. Don't forget every coin struck from a cracked or filled die will be released from the Mint, as the Mint does not consider these as errors. The Mint doesn't like to make coins with cracks or filled dies, but because of the huge volume they mint each year (about 30 billion total) this is a low priority to the Mint. There are more coins with die cracks than there are collectors!

silverpop · July 13, 2009 11:11AM

thanks for taking the time to explain this to me guys

ctf_error_coins · July 13, 2009 11:29AM

Indeed they are common, but they are still errors. Just because they are common, doesn't mean that they are NOT errors.

So NGC is Lying when they their label says "Mint Error" and "Obverse Die Crack" on my Silver Dollar Little Rock Commemorative.

silverpop · July 13, 2009 12:11PM

well let's just say that opinions differ on this some say it's a error , some say it's not, but whatever it's called it has made a really interesting pickup for my collection

ctf_error_coins · July 13, 2009 12:22PM

Opinions and facts are not the same. You did pick up a very nice coin at a great price.

Meltdown · July 13, 2009 12:24PM

I look for die cracks when buying "melt morgans" simply because I like them.
Here's a coulpe that I think are pretty cool.

abitofthisabitofthat · July 13, 2009 12:26PM

<< A die crack is a variety, not an error. An error is a unique coin, where a variety is an attribute of a die, and repeated onto several coins.

-Paul >>

As long as we are getting technical, I would not use variety either. A die crack is a die state - it will change and grow over the life of the die. There would, likely, be examples of that particular die having no crack, a small crack, a large crack, maybe eventually a cud, etc.

A variety would be some unique feature of the die, and all coins struck from that die would share it.

Admittedly, these terms are used somewhat loosely in the marketplace.

ctf_error_coins · July 13, 2009 12:33PM

<< 
There would, likely, be examples of that particular die having no crack, a small crack, a large crack, maybe eventually a cud, etc.

>>

If you had all of those examples on multiple coins from one die, well then you would have an extremely collectable set that would be worth quite a bit and very educational.

coindeuce · July 13, 2009 12:46PM

<< A die crack is an error. >>

Define mint error.

ctf_error_coins · July 13, 2009 1:00PM

<< 

<< A die crack is an error. >>

Define mint error. >>

good one

I'll give it a try without looking it up

in my own words.

A mint error is simply a coin that is not what the mint intended. Say if they used a proof hub for the 2000 P cents, then they intended to do it so it would be a variety. The mint did not intend the die crack in the design, thus the error. A three Legged Buffalo is a Die Polish Error and many insist it is a variety which it is also I guess. I believe all errors are varieties, but not all varieties are errors.

I go back to my NGC coin that SAYS "Die Crack" and "Mint Error" on the Label, are they wrong?

CoinSeeker · July 20, 2009 9:20AM

Does anyone else own one of these Morgan's with this ___________ ? (place whatever here you think it is)

coindeuce · July 20, 2009 9:48AM

<< 

<< 

<< A die crack is an error. >>

Define mint error. >>

good one

I'll give it a try without looking it up

in my own words.

A mint error is simply a coin that is not what the mint intended. Say if they used a proof hub for the 2000 P cents, then they intended to do it so it would be a variety. The mint did not intend the die crack in the design, thus the error. A three Legged Buffalo is a Die Polish Error and many insist it is a variety which it is also I guess. I believe all errors are varieties, but not all varieties are errors.

I go back to my NGC coin that SAYS "Die Crack" and "Mint Error" on the Label, are they wrong? >>

YES, NGC is WRONG to use the Error nomenclature in the case of your modern Commem dollar. Wouldn't be the first time they made such a GLARING ERROR. Go back and read my first post, and then read what WoodenJefferson quoted from Weinberg. You're putting all your faith in a clerical ERROR by NGC. A die crack is never an unintended event on a coin. Once again, it is an inevitable consequence of the minting process which by the economics of the process simply occurs from overusage of dies. No die is or has ever been considered indispensable. They all fail eventually from practical use for their intended purpose. That is the law of physics.

kranky · July 20, 2009 10:40AM

I agree that a die crack is not an error but a variety.

That being said, they are very cool and add a lot of character to a coin.

commoncents05 · July 20, 2009 10:44AM

Error or variety?

Answer: Variety

-Paul

coindeuce · July 20, 2009 10:51AM

P.M.D. !

stinkinlincoln · July 20, 2009 10:51AM

Post death portrait?

commoncents05 · July 20, 2009 10:55AM

coindeuce, that is a 100% authentic cud, one of the largest known.

-Paul

frnklnlvr · July 20, 2009 6:52PM

PCGS used to use "Mint Error" for RPMs and doubled dies but they now recognize these as varieties which is what they are.

Wardhaines · July 21, 2009 2:08AM

The 71 d is a really neat planchet error. It wend into the press missing 1/4 of it. That is why the reverse didn't strike up.

Raybob15239 · July 21, 2009 2:39AM

Nice coin. I love die breaks. Your coin exhibits heavy cracks with breaks between the ED and wing. A crack becomes a break when there is displacement.

Your coin is a VAM 11A. The VAM 11A used to be VAM 18A, but it was changed to VAM11A after an MS63 specimen (my coin) turned up. VAM designation is a way to identify die varieties (not errors). Check out VAMWorld.

Aegis3 · July 21, 2009 3:54AM

<< The 71 d is a really neat planchet error. It wend into the press missing 1/4 of it. That is why the reverse didn't strike up. >>

No. It's the obverse die that had almost half of it missing. And with no die present in that half of the coin, there was no pressure to strike up that part of the reverse also.

commoncents05 · July 21, 2009 3:57AM

<< No. It's the obverse die that had almost half of it missing. And with no die present in that half of the coin, there was no pressure to strike up that part of the reverse also. >>

Correct.

-Paul

JupitarCoins · July 21, 2009 4:13AM

<< Error or variety?

Answer: Variety

-Paul >>

Is that what Lincolns head looked like after he was shot.

Not a bad error

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