<< <i>As to the cc issue - do you want to give up 2% of your income? I did tell people I'd be happy to take one of the checks they got from their credit card companies. One interesting point is when explaining to people why I didn't want to take a cc was that 80-90% had NO idea that it cost me money to accept it, they all assumed the cc companies made their money from those carrying a balance >>
It's way more than 2% of your income. If your gross margin on a coin is 10%, 2 percentage points is 20% of your income. If your gross margin is 20%, 2 percentage points is 10% of your income. Unless you obtained the coin for free or someone paid you to take it, 2 percentage points is always more than 2% of income. >>
Isn't the CC fee just a cost of doing business? How much business does a dealer lose when he refuses credit cards?
Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
<< <i>Isn't the CC fee just a cost of doing business? >>
Lots of things are costs of doing business. And after all of them are subtracted from the money generated by the business, there has to be some money left over, or there isn't a business. And yet, if you even just hint that maybe a buyer's choice of how they pay for their purchases should somehow be correlated with how much they pay, some of them will go absolutely apesh*t.
<< <i>I have no problem with businesses that do not take credit cards. The credit card company charges somewhere between 2 to 3% of the total as their fee. I've always wondered why retailers eat that cost, probably because their margin is large enough.
Cash and checks are fine with me. Some dealers don't like to take checks if there is no prior business relationship, especially at a show, and I don't have a problem with that either.
In fact, anything that prevents the free flow of money out of my account seems to work to my benefit, as it prevents me from going broke. >>
the fees are higher than that and depends on the card being used. but, i need it for my business(not coin related), people just don't use cash like they use to.
side note: i hate american express , the biggest rip off there ever was !!!
I had a B&M(millers mint NY) reneg on a price when they forund out I wanted to pay with a credit card, thing was I was a cold call from 3 states away after finding a coin online. When I told them I wouldn't pay the 10$ higher price on a 550$ dollar coin they called me a cheep poor ba$tard. They still have the coin listed 8 months later
I view them as a cost of doing business and a convenience factor for the customer, nothwithstanding how they cut into a dealer's already razor-thin margin. All of that should be taken into account in the price of the coin.
Always took candy from strangers Didn't wanna get me no trade Never want to be like papa Working for the boss every night and day --"Happy", by the Rolling Stones (1972)
<< <i>I view them as a cost of doing business and a convenience factor for the customer, nothwithstanding how they cut into a dealer's already razor-thin margin. All of that should be taken into account in the price of the coin. >>
And when a dealer does that (takes into account the cc fees he's charged for his customer's convenience), how do his customers (well, some of them, anyway) react? See the post above yours for the answer.
<< <i>I view them as a cost of doing business and a convenience factor for the customer, nothwithstanding how they cut into a dealer's already razor-thin margin. All of that should be taken into account in the price of the coin. >>
And when a dealer does that (takes into account the cc fees he's charged for his customer's convenience), how do his customers (well, some of them, anyway) react? See the post above yours for the answer. >>
Personally, I think the dealers get into too much information when they say to a customer, "the coin is $x if cash, and $x + 1 if credit card". The price should be the price, and the dealers should have their costs already factored in. The dealers are running a professional operation, and should not be getting their hands dirty squabbling with a collector over whether the 2% should be in or out.
Always took candy from strangers Didn't wanna get me no trade Never want to be like papa Working for the boss every night and day --"Happy", by the Rolling Stones (1972)
Man....talk about going for the simplest answer rather than the real answer. Credit cards are not a curse. It's the people. It's the people that incorrectly use them. It's the people that want to make more and more from people that use them (the banking system and their fees). It's the politicians that allow both things to happen.
I used credit cards to help put myself through college. I also had student loans, a GIBill (I did my time in the US Army back in the 80s), and worked 3 jobs in between classes (daytime and nighttime jobs), all the while taking full credits (15-18 credits per quarter).
It took me awhile to pay those bills, but I did. I've been debt free (except the house) for 5 years. I had most of the credit cards paid off years before that even. It's a great feeling, but, I will admit, I needed those credit cards then. They helped me buy the books for school. They helped me buy clothes (if you have ever seen me (I know you haven't), you would know that not a lot of my funds go to clothes...I'm not a snappy dresser like RYK) when I needed.
It's not the credit cards that are evil or a burden, it's the people using them or making a killing off of them. Find a way to get people to be more responsible and there won't be a problem.
Too many people blame a tool instead of "THE TOOL" using a tool.
<< <i>Personally, I think the dealers get into too much information when they say to a customer, "the coin is $x if cash, and $x + 1 if credit card". The price should be the price, and the dealers should have their costs already factored in. >>
Until you know how a buyer is paying, how can you factor that cost in?
Coin collectors are known to be a thrifty lot- I imagine at least some of them would be unhappy to know that the price they paid included the dealer's pre-calculated cc fee when they paid cash. Do you suppose some of those cash buyers might have been happier with their purchase had it included a 3% price reduction for paying with cash? Should people who pay with cash be charged for those cc fees nonetheless, just so that buyers who pay with plastic don't have to think about them?
<< <i>Personally, I think the dealers get into too much information when they say to a customer, "the coin is $x if cash, and $x + 1 if credit card". The price should be the price, and the dealers should have their costs already factored in. >>
Until you know how a buyer is paying, how can you factor that cost in?
Coin collectors are known to be a thrifty lot- I imagine at least some of them would be unhappy to know that the price they paid included the dealer's pre-calculated cc fee when they paid cash. Do you suppose some of those cash buyers might have been happier with their purchase had it included a 3% price reduction for paying with cash? Should people who pay with cash be charged for those cc fees nonetheless, just so that buyers who pay with plastic don't have to think about them? >>
In no other business do I run into this issue other than the coin dealing business. When I go to a restaurant (another business with razor thin margins like coin dealers), they don't recalculate the bill if I decide to pay with a credit card. I guess the point I'm trying to make is that it sullies the professionalism of the coin dealer when he has to get into a debate with a collector over credit card fees.
Always took candy from strangers Didn't wanna get me no trade Never want to be like papa Working for the boss every night and day --"Happy", by the Rolling Stones (1972)
<< <i>Personally, I think the dealers get into too much information when they say to a customer, "the coin is $x if cash, and $x + 1 if credit card". The price should be the price, and the dealers should have their costs already factored in. >>
Until you know how a buyer is paying, how can you factor that cost in?
Coin collectors are known to be a thrifty lot- I imagine at least some of them would be unhappy to know that the price they paid included the dealer's pre-calculated cc fee when they paid cash. Do you suppose some of those cash buyers might have been happier with their purchase had it included a 3% price reduction for paying with cash? Should people who pay with cash be charged for those cc fees nonetheless, just so that buyers who pay with plastic don't have to think about them? >>
In no other business do I run into this issue other than the coin dealing business. When I go to a restaurant (another business with razor thin margins like coin dealers), they don't recalculate the bill if I decide to pay with a credit card. I guess the point I'm trying to make is that it sullies the professionalism of the coin dealer when he has to get into a debate with a collector over credit card fees. >>
That's because restaurants are scrutinized a bit more than the coin collecting hobby. If dealers were reported on, and scrutinized as much, it would likely change. Also, hot dog vendors and "roach coaches" aside, becoming a "coin dealer" is a lot easier to do. No health inspections, etc.
I've taken CC since I started my business 16 years ago, I just tell bullion purchases add 3% with CC purchase. I do way to much Business because I take CC, and any business that doesn't is losing out.
<< <i>In no other business do I run into this issue other than the coin dealing business. When I go to a restaurant (another business with razor thin margins like coin dealers), they don't recalculate the bill if I decide to pay with a credit card. >>
And so the people who pay by cash/check end up being charged for and paying a fee for a service they didn't use. Is that about right?
<< <i>I guess the point I'm trying to make is that it sullies the professionalism of the coin dealer when he has to get into a debate with a collector over credit card fees. >>
I guess the point I'm trying to make is it's a shame when a coin dealer gets criticized for trying to allow for a collector to save some money on a purchase.
It's the dealers right to not accept Credit Cards.
Unfortunately many consumers use this now just about everywhere as a normal method to pay for things. Heck I even use it at McDonalds and have stopped carrying cash.
Lucky for me the dealers I deal with most have no problem accepting credit cards from me and have built in enough buffer in their pricing to not lose money. I pay by check when I can but sometimes a special coin comes at a time when money is not around.
Bochiman, did you even look at the Frontline page I linked here? Watch the show. It's a business run by thieves, who base their opertion in North Dakota and other friendly locations, so that they have NO law with which to abide, and can charge interest rates as high as they wish, on any pretext. Miss one payment on anything, and all your credit card interest rates instantly go to the Moon.
And everyone, even those who do not put themselves in debt forever by using the damn things, pay extra at every cash register or gas pump, because every merchant must pass on every cost to every customer, or go out of business.
Good deals with: goldman86 mkman123 Wingsrule wondercoin segoja Tccuga OKCC LindeDad and others.
<< <i>While they may not advertise it, many national dealers who take credit cards on mail order purchases, do offer a better price when you pay by cash. >>
Per their agreement with visa/mc they are allowed to offer a discount for paying cash but are not allowed to charge more for using a card. They'll lose their account if they get enough complaints.
<< <i>Bochiman, did you even look at the Frontline page I linked here? Watch the show. It's a business run by thieves, who base their opertion in North Dakota and other friendly locations, so that they have NO law with which to abide, and can charge interest rates as high as they wish, on any pretext. Miss one payment on anything, and all your credit card interest rates instantly go to the Moon.
And everyone, even those who do not put themselves in debt forever by using the damn things, pay extra at every cash register or gas pump, because every merchant must pass on every cost to every customer, or go out of business. >>
I remember a life before credit cards. I remember people bouncing checks. I remember people losing money if they lost their wallet or cash fell out of their pocket. I remember people getting incorrect change. I remember people buying things and having no protection and companies disappearing or people taking off with the cash.
I'll take the credit card and the benefits that come with it, thank you.
That said, when people take advantage of others, to the degree some of these companies do, then the ones in charge need to be dragged out and shot. I actually feel that way.
Around here the local dealers will take a credit card. If you pay by credit card you get a invoice and sales tax added. You pay with cash you just get the coin.
Mark NGC registry V-Nickel proof #6!!!! working on proof shield nickels # 8 with a bullet!!!!
Comments
<< <i>
<< <i>As to the cc issue - do you want to give up 2% of your income? I did tell people I'd be happy to take one of the checks they got from their credit card companies. One interesting point is when explaining to people why I didn't want to take a cc was that 80-90% had NO idea that it cost me money to accept it, they all assumed the cc companies made their money from those carrying a balance >>
It's way more than 2% of your income. If your gross margin on a coin is 10%, 2 percentage points is 20% of your income. If your gross margin is 20%, 2 percentage points is 10% of your income. Unless you obtained the coin for free or someone paid you to take it, 2 percentage points is always more than 2% of income. >>
Isn't the CC fee just a cost of doing business? How much business does a dealer lose when he refuses credit cards?
Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
<< <i>Isn't the CC fee just a cost of doing business? >>
Lots of things are costs of doing business. And after all of them are subtracted from the money generated by the business, there has to be some money left over, or there isn't a business. And yet, if you even just hint that maybe a buyer's choice of how they pay for their purchases should somehow be correlated with how much they pay, some of them will go absolutely apesh*t.
<< <i>I actually hope all businesses stop taking credit cards. They are a curse on our society. >>
I agree. The proof of that is right here:
FRONTLINE
my early American coins & currency: -- http://yankeedoodlecoins.com/
<< <i>I have no problem with businesses that do not take credit cards. The credit card company charges somewhere between 2 to 3% of the total as their fee. I've always wondered why retailers eat that cost, probably because their margin is large enough.
Cash and checks are fine with me. Some dealers don't like to take checks if there is no prior business relationship, especially at a show, and I don't have a problem with that either.
In fact, anything that prevents the free flow of money out of my account seems to work to my benefit, as it prevents me from going broke. >>
the fees are higher than that and depends on the card being used.
but, i need it for my business(not coin related), people just don't use cash like they use to.
side note: i hate american express , the biggest rip off there ever was !!!
Didn't wanna get me no trade
Never want to be like papa
Working for the boss every night and day
--"Happy", by the Rolling Stones (1972)
<< <i>I view them as a cost of doing business and a convenience factor for the customer, nothwithstanding how they cut into a dealer's already razor-thin margin. All of that should be taken into account in the price of the coin. >>
And when a dealer does that (takes into account the cc fees he's charged for his customer's convenience), how do his customers (well, some of them, anyway) react? See the post above yours for the answer.
<< <i>
<< <i>I view them as a cost of doing business and a convenience factor for the customer, nothwithstanding how they cut into a dealer's already razor-thin margin. All of that should be taken into account in the price of the coin. >>
And when a dealer does that (takes into account the cc fees he's charged for his customer's convenience), how do his customers (well, some of them, anyway) react? See the post above yours for the answer.
Personally, I think the dealers get into too much information when they say to a customer, "the coin is $x if cash, and $x + 1 if credit card". The price should be the price, and the dealers should have their costs already factored in. The dealers are running a professional operation, and should not be getting their hands dirty squabbling with a collector over whether the 2% should be in or out.
Didn't wanna get me no trade
Never want to be like papa
Working for the boss every night and day
--"Happy", by the Rolling Stones (1972)
<< <i>
<< <i>I actually hope all businesses stop taking credit cards. They are a curse on our society. >>
I agree. The proof of that is right here:
FRONTLINE >>
Man....talk about going for the simplest answer rather than the real answer. Credit cards are not a curse. It's the people. It's the people that incorrectly use them. It's the people that want to make more and more from people that use them (the banking system and their fees). It's the politicians that allow both things to happen.
I used credit cards to help put myself through college. I also had student loans, a GIBill (I did my time in the US Army back in the 80s), and worked 3 jobs in between classes (daytime and nighttime jobs), all the while taking full credits (15-18 credits per quarter).
It took me awhile to pay those bills, but I did. I've been debt free (except the house) for 5 years. I had most of the credit cards paid off years before that even. It's a great feeling, but, I will admit, I needed those credit cards then. They helped me buy the books for school. They helped me buy clothes (if you have ever seen me (I know you haven't), you would know that not a lot of my funds go to clothes...I'm not a snappy dresser like RYK) when I needed.
It's not the credit cards that are evil or a burden, it's the people using them or making a killing off of them. Find a way to get people to be more responsible and there won't be a problem.
Too many people blame a tool instead of "THE TOOL" using a tool.
I've been told I tolerate fools poorly...that may explain things if I have a problem with you. Current ebay items - Nothing at the moment
<< <i>Personally, I think the dealers get into too much information when they say to a customer, "the coin is $x if cash, and $x + 1 if credit card". The price should be the price, and the dealers should have their costs already factored in. >>
Until you know how a buyer is paying, how can you factor that cost in?
Coin collectors are known to be a thrifty lot- I imagine at least some of them would be unhappy to know that the price they paid included the dealer's pre-calculated cc fee when they paid cash. Do you suppose some of those cash buyers might have been happier with their purchase had it included a 3% price reduction for paying with cash? Should people who pay with cash be charged for those cc fees nonetheless, just so that buyers who pay with plastic don't have to think about them?
<< <i>
<< <i>Personally, I think the dealers get into too much information when they say to a customer, "the coin is $x if cash, and $x + 1 if credit card". The price should be the price, and the dealers should have their costs already factored in. >>
Until you know how a buyer is paying, how can you factor that cost in?
Coin collectors are known to be a thrifty lot- I imagine at least some of them would be unhappy to know that the price they paid included the dealer's pre-calculated cc fee when they paid cash. Do you suppose some of those cash buyers might have been happier with their purchase had it included a 3% price reduction for paying with cash? Should people who pay with cash be charged for those cc fees nonetheless, just so that buyers who pay with plastic don't have to think about them? >>
In no other business do I run into this issue other than the coin dealing business. When I go to a restaurant (another business with razor thin margins like coin dealers), they don't recalculate the bill if I decide to pay with a credit card. I guess the point I'm trying to make is that it sullies the professionalism of the coin dealer when he has to get into a debate with a collector over credit card fees.
Didn't wanna get me no trade
Never want to be like papa
Working for the boss every night and day
--"Happy", by the Rolling Stones (1972)
<< <i>
<< <i>
<< <i>Personally, I think the dealers get into too much information when they say to a customer, "the coin is $x if cash, and $x + 1 if credit card". The price should be the price, and the dealers should have their costs already factored in. >>
Until you know how a buyer is paying, how can you factor that cost in?
Coin collectors are known to be a thrifty lot- I imagine at least some of them would be unhappy to know that the price they paid included the dealer's pre-calculated cc fee when they paid cash. Do you suppose some of those cash buyers might have been happier with their purchase had it included a 3% price reduction for paying with cash? Should people who pay with cash be charged for those cc fees nonetheless, just so that buyers who pay with plastic don't have to think about them? >>
In no other business do I run into this issue other than the coin dealing business. When I go to a restaurant (another business with razor thin margins like coin dealers), they don't recalculate the bill if I decide to pay with a credit card. I guess the point I'm trying to make is that it sullies the professionalism of the coin dealer when he has to get into a debate with a collector over credit card fees. >>
That's because restaurants are scrutinized a bit more than the coin collecting hobby. If dealers were reported on, and scrutinized as much, it would likely change.
Also, hot dog vendors and "roach coaches" aside, becoming a "coin dealer" is a lot easier to do. No health inspections, etc.
I've been told I tolerate fools poorly...that may explain things if I have a problem with you. Current ebay items - Nothing at the moment
I do way to much Business because I take CC, and any business that doesn't is losing out.
<< <i>In no other business do I run into this issue other than the coin dealing business. When I go to a restaurant (another business with razor thin margins like coin dealers), they don't recalculate the bill if I decide to pay with a credit card. >>
And so the people who pay by cash/check end up being charged for and paying a fee for a service they didn't use. Is that about right?
<< <i>I guess the point I'm trying to make is that it sullies the professionalism of the coin dealer when he has to get into a debate with a collector over credit card fees. >>
I guess the point I'm trying to make is it's a shame when a coin dealer gets criticized for trying to allow for a collector to save some money on a purchase.
Unfortunately many consumers use this now just about everywhere as a normal method to pay for things. Heck I even use it at McDonalds and have stopped carrying cash.
Lucky for me the dealers I deal with most have no problem accepting credit cards from me and have built in enough buffer in their pricing to not lose money. I pay by check when I can but sometimes a special coin comes at a time when money is not around.
And everyone, even those who do not put themselves in debt forever by using the damn things, pay extra at every cash register or gas pump, because every merchant must pass on every cost to every customer, or go out of business.
my early American coins & currency: -- http://yankeedoodlecoins.com/
<< <i>While they may not advertise it, many national dealers who take credit cards on mail order purchases, do offer a better price when you pay by cash. >>
Per their agreement with visa/mc they are allowed to offer a discount for paying cash but are not allowed to charge more for using a card. They'll lose their account if they get enough complaints.
<< <i>I wonder how much of that cash is actually declared for tax purposes.
That was going to be my question!
JT
I collect all 20th century series except gold including those series that ended there.
<< <i>Bochiman, did you even look at the Frontline page I linked here? Watch the show. It's a business run by thieves, who base their opertion in North Dakota and other friendly locations, so that they have NO law with which to abide, and can charge interest rates as high as they wish, on any pretext. Miss one payment on anything, and all your credit card interest rates instantly go to the Moon.
And everyone, even those who do not put themselves in debt forever by using the damn things, pay extra at every cash register or gas pump, because every merchant must pass on every cost to every customer, or go out of business. >>
I remember a life before credit cards. I remember people bouncing checks. I remember people losing money if they lost their wallet or cash fell out of their pocket.
I remember people getting incorrect change.
I remember people buying things and having no protection and companies disappearing or people taking off with the cash.
I'll take the credit card and the benefits that come with it, thank you.
That said, when people take advantage of others, to the degree some of these companies do, then the ones in charge need to be dragged out and shot. I actually feel that way.
I've been told I tolerate fools poorly...that may explain things if I have a problem with you. Current ebay items - Nothing at the moment
NGC registry V-Nickel proof #6!!!!
working on proof shield nickels # 8 with a bullet!!!!
RIP "BEAR"
<< <i>I wonder how much of that cash is actually declared for tax purposes.
I have the same thoughts about restaurants that take cash only. I know in NYC many of these establishments are money laundering fronts.
60 years into this hobby and I'm still working on my Lincoln set!
<< <i>
<< <i>I wonder how much of that cash is actually declared for tax purposes.
I have the same thoughts about restaurants that take cash only. I know in NYC many of these establishments are money laundering fronts. >>
Bellieve it or not, many small businesses can only survive because a percentage of their total revenue is on a 'cash' basis.
It isn't right, but it's reality.
"“Those who sacrifice liberty for security/safety deserve neither.“(Benjamin Franklin)
"I only golf on days that end in 'Y'" (DE59)