Dwyane Wade 2003 Ultra Sig PSA 10 - Seller states no RETURN

GoDodgersFan

I have an issue and I would like some feedback before I proceed.

As a Christmas gift for me, I purchased a 2003 Ultra Signatures Dwyane Wade PSA 10 on ebay for 100.00 and change.
Seller states no return in the auction and upon closer inspection, this card is overgraded with multiple sticker residue
marks from the manufacturing/production process. This is PSA 9 quality at best and perhaps an 8. Also, when
it comes to autograph cards, is the grade for the autograph only? I am not sure.

Am I out of luck here? The picture in the auction could of been a lot better so there's no way for a buyer to notice the
defect. I think the seller knew the issue. Seller does have great feedback. You can tell when you flip the holder at an agle
and see all the residue stuff on the card.

I haven't contacted the buyer yet. What is my recourse with paypal here?

Thanks for your assistance.

Tom

Mphilking

Tom,
Sorry about the bad luck. I don't think you have much recourse. If it's a PSA 10, it's a PSA 10. I have some undergraded cards and some overgraded ones that are slabbed. GOOF OFF works great on that gooey kind of stuff. If there is a crack in the case anywhere don't use it though it will soak right through.
MIchael

dizzle

<< <i>Tom,
Sorry about the bad luck. I don't think you have much recourse. If it's a PSA 10, it's a PSA 10. I have some undergraded cards and some overgraded ones that are slabbed. GOOF OFF works great on that gooey kind of stuff. If there is a crack in the case anywhere don't use it though it will soak right through.
MIchael >>



The residue is on the card..not the slab..

Mphilking

Thanks for the clarity. Do you think the card has been resealed in a phony holder?

mikeschmidt

did you pay by Paypal...?

PoppaJ

Hi Tom,

Is THIS the card to which you are referring?

If yes, I doubt if your PayPal claim would be successful.

The guy comes off as somewhat of a jackass, but I don't see where he was trying to deceive anyone. Yeah, his pic could have been better, but you could have asked for a better photo prior to bidding.

The PSA 10 grade is for the card, not the autograph. Since the card was professionally graded by one of the leaders of the industry, I don't see how you could hold him in error.

I'm not sure about the residue part of the problem.

Sorry this happened to you, but this is just another example of a lesson learned the eBay way.

JMHO,

PoppaJ

Dboneesq

Tom,

This REALLY sucks that it happened to you. HOWEVER, I do not think that you have any recourse. As POPPA J stated, yes, he could have had a better picture, but you could have also asked for a better/larger pic as well. You probably thought, as I would, why would you need a better pic if it is in a PSA holder? Along the same line, the seller may have been thinking "It's in a PSA holder, what more wuld buyers expect of me"?

Again, I think it sucks if you are certain the card does not deserve to be in a "10" holder. But I guess that's the chance we take when we buy a card that was graded by an "EXPERT".

fur72

Indeed from the picture it looks great. No matter how you slice it you have a PSA 10 auto rookie of Wade for $100. Good deal IMO.

storm888

"...What is my recourse with paypal here?..."

////////////////////////////////////////

The PayPal bots will sometimes find for the buyer in a SNAD-claim on a TPG-item.

ANY honest seller with an ounce of gumption can have such a decision quickly reversed on appeal.

The desires of buyers to substitute their own grading standards for those of the TPG
do not, in a legal sense, rise to SNAD in the PPUA or the credit-card companies' UAs.

Buyers are further disadvantaged by EBAY's naming of certain TPGs and applying a de facto
"approval" to such TPGs. Also, the EBAY SYIF clearly states that sellers may decline returns
and refunds provided the item " must be accurately described." EBAY is not eager to litigate
either of these elements against militant sellers.

In the instant case, there could be an argument made by the buyer that the "staging
of the photos was purposely deceptive, and designed to conceal significant defects
that had they been known to the buyer would have precluded the purchase." If I
was deciding, I would likely disallow the argument as made in bad-faith and as a mere
element of buyer's remorse. PP might see it another way.

NOTE: I am not saying the seller did anything wrong, and I am not saying the buyer
is intentionally harming the seller by "changing his mind." Just pointing out possible
paths and speculating about outcomes.


It is REALLY important for buyers to understand that their judgement on grades needs
to be put aside, if they are going to buy TPGd cards without first physically examining
such cards.

While we all know that "all PSA 10s are not created equal," for purposes of commerce
on the internet all such cards are, absent fraud, "equal."

///////////

Edit Add:

By late-summer, ALL sellers will very likely be required to accept returns on any
items sold on EBAY.

That policy will limit selections for buyers, and cause little sellers to go elsewhere.

Ironmanfan

This is one of the reason's that "independent" third party grading was formed...You bought a PSA 10 card, you got that PSA 10 card (you're done)

GoDodgersFan

Thanks for all the feedback guys. I sort of knew and just wanted confirmation from fellow members.

I will take it as a lessons learned. Need to pay attention to return policy and ask for larger scans in the future.

Hey, it happens and I out some $$ here.

Happy New Year to all.

Tom

PoppaJ

<< <i>Thanks for all the feedback guys. I sort of knew and just wanted confirmation from fellow members.

I will take it as a lessons learned. Need to pay attention to return policy and ask for larger scans in the future.

Hey, it happens and I out some $$ here.

Happy New Year to all.

Tom >>



////////////////////

Tom,

My father used to always say:

"C'è solo una cosa più dolorosa esperienza di apprendimento, e che non è da esperienze di apprendimento!"

which means:

"There is only one thing more painful than learning from experience, and that is not learning from experience!"

Thanks for sharing a very important learning experience of yours from which we all can learn!

Happy New Year to you and your family,

PoppaJ

bman90278

Hang in there Tom. I wouldn't consider it a complete loss. I'm sure you can still resell it one days as it is really in a PSA 10 holder and you should be able to recoup most of your loss. Please consider it a good lesson and always insist on good sized scans when purchasing from an unknown seller. Any good seller will be more than happy to show you what you need.

Brian

bcwcardz

Psa 10 is psa 10. The seller sold you that product which you wanted.Done. If all the people that thought the card they bought was overgraded there would be a 75% return rate.Thats why we have graders so you know what you are buying.

digicat

If you truly feel that the card was graded incorrectly, contact PSA on the phone, tell them your situation, and they'll ask you to send the card in for a free review. I did that earlier this year with some cards I had bougtht that were all overgraded. The review-grader agreed with me and re-graded the cards with more accurate grades and gave me my origional purchase price in grading vouchers (my request). So, you are by no means SOL.