Whats going on with this coin?

Hussulo

What do you think is wrong with this coin?



This is what it should look like (1977 Thai 1 Baht)


Here's a different angle of one of the sides. You can just make out the bust detail below:

Hussulo

Forgot to add it has a reeded edge like the normal one, but looks to be on a thinner planchet made of different metal.

lordmarcovan

Yep, it looks like it's struck on an undersized planchet.

The lack of metal to fill the design would cause that "ghosting" effect, too. One often sees it on the Brit large pennies, particularly those of George V, as you know. But those had ghosting due to their design. This is ghosted because of the undersized planchet. Which also caused the less than perfect strike.

Or such is my pet theory.

Very cool find! Probably not worth a whole lot, but worth a good premium over what a normal coin would be worth, I suspect.

newbiecollector

Looks cast to me...........not that I know these coins

theboz11

Could it be a brockage?

Hussulo

I agree with the undersized planchet theory. It might be struck on a wrong planchet as it's not the correct metal.
I just weighed them. The correct one weighs 7.04grams and the "error" weighs 6.75 grams.

I don't think its a brockage as there is no sign of any incuse detail.
It could be cast, but why cast but why does it show underlying details of the bust (obverse)?

This could be a long shot, but it may have been struck on a wrong planchet and then re-struck this time with two reverse dies.
Then again I'm not sure?

Hussulo

Sorry I should have said the first picture is of both sides of the coin.

newbiecollector

My original comment wasn't really very good. It just seemed to me to has a lot of "cast" looking properties in the fields.
I know see what the other more knowlegeable are talking about.

One thing....I sure think it is interesting!

ajaan

Interesting. I doubt it is cast, not worth counterfeiting, it is valued at 2c. What the diameter of the coin? Is it the same size as a regular 1 bath coin?

On a side note, where the heck do you find these 'two-tails' coins?

lordmarcovan

I wondered about a brockage at first, myself, but I don't think so.

I'll stick to my theory about it being an undersized and/or wrong planchet.

ajaan

Also, the one baht coin has a silver look. Yours has a bronze look,

newbiecollector

Never realised it had two tails

ajaan

I'm begining to think it was struck on a 50 satang planchet.

Hussulo

Also, the one baht coin has a silver look. Yours has a bronze look,

Yes its that colour in hand. All though you can see traces of Nickel around one side of the edge.
Maybe they were bronze but plated in nickel?

This is how they should look:
http://cgi.ebay.com.my/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=170203110444

ajaan

The 1977 1 Baht coins are cu-ni I believe. I spent those coins a lot when I lived in Thailand. They have now been replaced by smaller 1 baht coins.

BCNumismatics

Hus,
Your Thai 1 Baht coin is also struck with extremely worn dies as well.There is also metal filling in along the inside edge as well.

Aidan.

ormandh

Fred Weinberg may be able to help you. You may be able to pm him to take a look. -Dan

Hussulo

Thanks I'll try that.

I was thinking if it is a fake.
What kind of a forgery could it be? a cast? I have to admit I don't particularly like the fields, but the edge is nice.

It could be struck using fake dies, but why go to the trouble of making an obverse to then cover it with the reverse design? Unless the forger wasn't happy with the obverse and replaced it with the reverse, but then the next question would be why not just work a new die?

I am not saying the coin is genuine, I just wanted to open a debate and discuss possible theories.

Hussulo

I emailed Fred Weinberg and I'd like to thank him for taking the time out to help.

His opinion:

"Hello,

Thanks for your email.

The coin is a counterfeit, in my opinion, based on what
I can see.

I know that a comment was made "why counterfeit a low denomination
coin?", but that happens all the time.

Hope this info helps a bit.......

Fred"

I guess that settles it then.

I should not have doubted my first instinctive feeling I wasn't really happy with
the look of the coin.
I guess the "but why?" question left to many unanswered questions in
my head, and I wanted to play the devils advocate.

Thanks,
Hus