Manny hitting 403 Dodgers take over 1st pl. Can he garner some MVP votes?

WinPitcher · September 7, 2008 12:45AM

With around 20 games left, and if Manny continues hitting at a .400 clip, and the Dodgers win the division I
wonder if Manny might get some MVP votes?

Pujols appears to be the front runner but his team looks like it
probably will be playing golf when the Post Season starts.

Should a player with 1/3 of a season be considered for the MVP?

Steve

kuhlmann · September 7, 2008 12:47AM

if mets win the division. delgado is gonna get some votes. he has carried the team on his back since that yankee game when he had 9 rbis.

WinPitcher · September 7, 2008 12:49AM

Hi Kuhl! Now answer the damn question!

LTNS buddy.

Steve

edited to add: You mean WHEN the Mets win the division?

yawie99 · September 7, 2008 12:50AM

If I had a vote, I'd probably go with CC, so, yes, I think it's definitely fair to consider players who haven't been in the league all year. The way Manny and the Dodgers are playing, one could certainly make a strong case that he has been the player most important to his team's success.

Bottom9th · September 7, 2008 12:50AM

Amazing what a change of scenery did for Manny. It's very obvious to anyone that he wasn't giving a 100% for the Sox any more. Good riddance.

PROMETHIUS88 · September 7, 2008 2:28AM

1/2 the season.... sure. This late into the season...no. Doesn't matter if he hits .500, two months doesn't make a season.

WinPitcher · September 7, 2008 2:48AM

The question is will he garner some MVP votes, not win the MVP.

The yr Ted Williams played in 37 games and hit 400+ he got 1 vote.

While I don't think he will win the award I do feel he will get some votes.

Steve

TheVon · September 7, 2008 3:04AM

I wouldn't be at all surprised to see him get some votes, but I would be willing to bet that he won't get anything higher than 3rd place votes.

TheVon · September 7, 2008 3:23AM

If the Dodgers and the Brewers make the playoffs only because they acquired Manny and CC, that makes those players more valuable to their respective teams. Just like with hall of "fame" voting, the term "valuable" leaves some wiggle room for the voters to decide what they think makes a player valuable.

TheVon · September 7, 2008 3:47AM

.500 can win the NL West.

Anyways, guys like Manny and CC can make the rest of their teammates better. Jeff Kent won't admit it, but Andre Eithier has already come out and said that he's getting more pitches to hit since Manny came on board. And CC going 9 innings every time out definitely helps the bullpen and that helps the other starters too because it means their bullpen help is more apt to hold games for them.

TheVon · September 7, 2008 4:58AM

Apparently you don't pay attention to what happens in the real world. The lineup in Boston didn't suffer when Manny left because when Manny was in Boston, he was purposely dogging it. Now he's playing for Boras' commission and the hopes of a 4-year deal.

Barndog · September 7, 2008 5:00AM

<< Apparently you don't pay attention to what happens in the real world. The lineup in Boston didn't suffer when Manny left because when Manny was in Boston, he was purposely dogging it. Now he's playing for Boras' commission and the hopes of a 4-year deal. >>

true, I watch just about all the Sox games and it was easy to see Manny "mailing it in" -- ever since watching three straight strikes from Rivera in NY...that was ugly

BobaFett72 · September 7, 2008 7:12AM

hey will get votes, just as Im sure that CC will get votes. There is no doubt that without Manny the dodgers are NOT in first. Without CC the Brewers might not be the wild card. There is not a better pitcher in the NL right now than CC.

FanOf390 · September 7, 2008 7:48AM

Can Manny garner some MVP votes? The answer should be NO.
Can CC garner some Cy Young votes? The answer should be NO.

Here's why. The Batting Champion (highest batting average) must have at least 500 plate appearances in that league to qualify for the Batting Title -- no IFs, ANDs, or BUTs about it. That is the rule -- period.

Likewise, there should be analogous "at least" limits to enable a player to receive an MVP vote or a Cy Young vote. That would eliminate all of this crap about whether a player should or should not be in the running for an award. If such "at least" limits were established and were consistent with the "at least 500 plate appearances" rule that I've stated above, then I'm certain that the limits would eliminate Manny and CC from any post-season NL awards.

Charlie

WinPitcher · September 7, 2008 8:22AM

Here's why. The Batting Champion (highest batting average) must have at least 500 plate appearances in that league to qualify for the Batting Title -- no IFs, ANDs, or BUTs about it. That is the rule -- period.

Actually that is incorrect, it is 3.1 plate appearances per games played by the team. So if a team played 159 games he could win the titke with 492 PA

Also, and it has happened, they have pro rated a guys average if it was high enough and he would have won
even if he went zero for whatever amount of at bats.

Steve

and, before I am asked to produce when it happened I think it happened in the late 90's and Tony Gwynn wom with less then 3.1 PA per teams total games.

WinPitcher · September 7, 2008 8:25AM

Guys have come up halfway through the season had a great season and have received ROY votes.

Steve

FanOf390 · September 7, 2008 9:09AM

Steve said: "Actually that is incorrect, it is 3.1 plate appearances per games played by the team. So if a team played 159 games he could win the titke with 492 PA"

Yes, I know that Steve. And since I was a Math major, I could have made that calculation in my head! For this forum, I'm generalizing -- and it is usually the case that a team plays 162 games and a player therefore needs 502 plate appearances.

However, you kinda missed the whole point. The point is that there's a minimum number of plate appearances required to win the batting title. Likewise, there should be a minimum number of games played/pitched in a league to win an MVP/CyYoung award.

Charlie

WinPitcher · September 7, 2008 9:26AM

Here's why. The Batting Champion (highest batting average) must have at least 500 plate appearances in that league to qualify for the Batting Title -- no IFs, ANDs, or BUTs about it. That is the rule -- period.
////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////

Really?
No IFs, ands or buts about it? I showed you 1 if and 1 but.

fwiw in 1996 Tony Gwynn won the title WITHOUT the required PA.

So it is not as cut and dried as you tried to make it out to be.

And yes I got your point, did you get mine?

Steve

bman90278 · September 8, 2008 12:22AM

Manny has certainly been a big time difference for the Dodgers since they got him and he is the Team MVP so far. He has really helped the other hitters get better at bats and everyone has seemed to raise their game. It would be interesting if the Dodgers win the division and how the MVP voting goes. Also, without Jeff Kent the Dodgers seem to be a better team. I know he's a future HOF but something must not be right when he's in the lineup.

larryallen73 · September 8, 2008 1:22AM

Love the Dodgers but I do not see Manny getting any MVP votes. Just not long enough.

CC really could win the cy young... and maybe get some MVP votes too!

Connecticoin · September 8, 2008 2:55AM

How about some AL "LVP" votes?

softparade · September 8, 2008 12:06PM

some interesting and obviously bitter comments from Sox fans in this thread. They all say "good riddance" right now but they will NEVER see another right handed hitter like that come through Fenway for a LONG LONG time. Perhaps well beyond our lifetimes.

Manny was THAT good. Why else put up with his crap all those years? I don't blame the Sox for putting up with it.... Manny was and still is THAT GOOD.But "good riddance" ? HA!
we will see about that

The MVP debate, plate appearances, stats, bla bla bla bla. NONE of that means ANYTHING. Manny Ramirez is at least the great equalizer on the offensive end. I for one can give a rats rear end about minimum plate appearances and more of that put me to sleep argument. If the Dodgers go on to win it will have more to do with Manny Ramirez then his stupid MINIMUM PLATE APPEARANCES

JackWESQ · September 8, 2008 12:17PM

<< How about some AL "LVP" votes? >>

I don't know about the AL, but Andruw Jones is the runaway winner of the NL LVP.

So potentially, the Dodgers have the NL MVP and the NL LVP on their roster.

/s/ JackWESQ

TheVon · September 8, 2008 2:01PM

<< some interesting and obviously bitter comments from Sox fans in this thread. They all say "good riddance" right now but they will NEVER see another right handed hitter like that come through Fenway for a LONG LONG time. Perhaps well beyond our lifetimes. >>

NEVER for a LONG LONG time, Dan? How long is that, exactly? Regardless of how long it is, you're probably right. Manny was definitely an amazing hitter and it's too bad that he's not in Boston anymore. But he needed to go because he gave up. What would your reaction be if A-Rod just started not playing games or just went up to the plate with no intention of swinging during crucial games? I think you'd have to agree that you can't have that on your team and have a healthy, productive team. He'd have to go even though he's a talent that can't be replaced.

Connecticoin · September 8, 2008 11:02PM

<< some interesting and obviously bitter comments from Sox fans in this thread. They all say "good riddance" right now but they will NEVER see another right handed hitter like that come through Fenway for a LONG LONG time. Perhaps well beyond our lifetimes.

Manny was THAT good. Why else put up with his crap all those years? I don't blame the Sox for putting up with it.... Manny was and still is THAT GOOD.But "good riddance" ? HA!
we will see about that

The MVP debate, plate appearances, stats, bla bla bla bla. NONE of that means ANYTHING. Manny Ramirez is at least the great equalizer on the offensive end. I for one can give a rats rear end about minimum plate appearances and more of that put me to sleep argument. If the Dodgers go on to win it will have more to do with Manny Ramirez then his stupid MINIMUM PLATE APPEARANCES

>>

Hey, I will always cherish the "Manny being Manny" years (up to the high-fiveing the fan in Baltimore), especially his post-season herioics.

I actually feel bad for Manny the most, because he tarnished the last years of his career with his antics (or whoever encouraged him to dog it), and there is a decent chance he will miss out on another World Series championship.

WinPitcher · September 9, 2008 3:06AM

and there is a decent chance he will miss out on another World Series championship.

He has almost the same chance winning one with the Dodgers as he had with winning one with the Sox.

Both seemed poised to be making the Post Season this year. If history is any barometer
he has a better chance in winning one with the Dodgers then he had with Boston.

At least historically speaking.

Steve

Connecticoin · September 9, 2008 7:53AM

<< He has almost the same chance winning one with the Dodgers as he had with winning one with the Sox.

>>

Nah, I think the D-Backs will get their sh*t together and win the division.

Manny hitting 403 Dodgers take over 1st pl. Can he garner some MVP votes?

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