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1903 mckinley $1 gold was it a bargin???

off ebay at $360 bin...was it a good buy or not what say you???
this guy also has what looks like a sweet deal on a 1882 $3 only reason i say that is it is a coin i owned along time ago and know it's low mintage in the $3. series
anyways...here's the ebay auction
$1. mckinley
everything in life is but merely on loan to us by our appreciation....lose your appreciation and see


Comments

  • PerryHallPerryHall Posts: 46,868 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Only buy a $3 gold in a top tier slab since this series is very heavily counterfeited---especially the 1882. The "Omega man" counterfeited quite a few examples of this date.

    Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
    "Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value---zero."----Voltaire
    "Everything you say should be true, but not everything true should be said."----Voltaire

  • Was the "omega man" an ebay seller?
    -Rome is Burning

    image
  • PerryHallPerryHall Posts: 46,868 ✭✭✭✭✭


    << <i>Was the "omega man" an ebay seller? >>



    He was a counterfeiter. He marked his coins with a microscopic greek letter omega---hence the name given to him. His two most produced coins was the high relief MCMVII Saint (the omega was within the eagle's talons) and the 1882 gold $3 (the omega was within the loop of the R in LIBERTY).

    Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
    "Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value---zero."----Voltaire
    "Everything you say should be true, but not everything true should be said."----Voltaire

  • MrEurekaMrEureka Posts: 24,419 ✭✭✭✭✭
    The McKinley looks fake to me. The rims are too broad and the portrait too flat.

    image
    Andy Lustig

    Doggedly collecting coins of the Central American Republic.

    Visit the Society of US Pattern Collectors at USPatterns.com.
  • If it's authentic and has no jewelry marks I'd say it was a good deal.
    A lie told often enough becomes the truth. ~Vladimir Lenin
  • CaptHenwayCaptHenway Posts: 32,769 ✭✭✭✭✭


    << <i>The McKinley looks fake to me. The rims are too broad and the portrait too flat.

    image >>



    What he said......
    TD
    Numismatist. 50 year member ANA. Winner of four ANA Heath Literary Awards; three Wayte and Olga Raymond Literary Awards; Numismatist of the Year Award 2009, and Lifetime Achievement Award 2020. Winner numerous NLG Literary Awards.
  • AUandAGAUandAG Posts: 24,941 ✭✭✭✭✭
    I sure don't know if it's real or not, but there is no return policy stated. Not my cup of tea.

    Hope it looks great in hand and is the real deal.

    bobimage
    Registry: CC lowballs (boblindstrom), bobinvegas1989@yahoo.com
  • lasvegasteddylasvegasteddy Posts: 10,432 ✭✭✭
    if there are certain diagnostics i should look for i'd appreciate any pm with what to look for when it arrives

    upon looking at many other images it seems that these lil pieces had many strike issues and rims are all over the place on these too

    but i'd listen to any diagnostics checks someone has to cough up here...sincerely

    and hopefully this is not yet another tuition i've to pay
    everything in life is but merely on loan to us by our appreciation....lose your appreciation and see


  • roadrunnerroadrunner Posts: 28,313 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Many gold counterfeits seemed to be littered with raised tooling marks. The few I have run across, mainly in the $10 Indians, have all shown these.

    An authentic US gold coin will normally show die polish lines in those hard to get to places such as around the date numerals. A complete absence of these on a coin would bother me. So would raised dots or blobs and raised tooling marks (ie scratches in the counterfeiter's die). Thirdly, the luster of fakes has a sort of odd grainy texture that doesn't flow well. The luster looks more like it was machined (like the bottom of your cooking pans) than struck (swirling/curving/patches of flow lines).

    One forum member sent me a fake BU $10 Indian. It exhibited all the characteristics noted above and was promptely returned with money refunded.

    roadrunner
    Barbarous Relic No More, LSCC -GoldSeek--shadow stats--SafeHaven--321gold
  • That seller's 1878-CC is a blatant fake. He's also asking $700.00 for a 1952-D Lincoln Cent slabbed by NNC, which pretty much destroyed any credibility he may have had before I saw his "PL" Morgans.
  • lasvegasteddylasvegasteddy Posts: 10,432 ✭✭✭
    i'll report back and hopefully as it made it into plastic too...sadly if it doesn't...
    unless it doesn't have die polish lines and a grainy look about it...
    then i got yet another mess to get out of or man up on as yet more tuition paid
    with fingers crossed his 100% f/b is a concern he addresses
    everything in life is but merely on loan to us by our appreciation....lose your appreciation and see


  • mrcommemmrcommem Posts: 1,189 ✭✭✭✭✭
    I suspect that you might have a counterfeit. According to Swiatek and Breen book on Silver and Gold commemortives this coin has been extensively counterfeited. The book show a McKinley that looks very much like your specimen. Denticles weak, blurry details, lack of depth. I would try to get it certified, but don't hold your breath.


  • << <i>i'll report back and hopefully as it made it into plastic too...sadly if it doesn't...
    unless it doesn't have die polish lines and a grainy look about it...
    then i got yet another mess to get out of or man up on as yet more tuition paid
    with fingers crossed his 100% f/b is a concern he addresses >>



    I think you can get him to refund your money if it is indeed counterfeit, I had the same thing happen to me and months later when I told him(not this seller) about it he said return it for a full refund.
    If he doesn't I would think you have recourse through ebay as not as described(counterfeit)

  • ConnecticoinConnecticoin Posts: 13,111 ✭✭✭✭✭


    << <i>i'll report back and hopefully as it made it into plastic too...sadly if it doesn't...
    unless it doesn't have die polish lines and a grainy look about it...
    then i got yet another mess to get out of or man up on as yet more tuition paid
    with fingers crossed his 100% f/b is a concern he addresses >>



    Slabbing this coin would be a waste of money.

    You have at least 3 very experience numismatists telling you this coin is fake. I would return it ASAP and inform the seller you had a dealer tell you it was fake.
  • truthtellertruthteller Posts: 1,240 ✭✭
    The Mckinley is counterfeit.



    TRUTH
  • PerryHallPerryHall Posts: 46,868 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Send it back ASAP. Don't waste your time or money trying to get it authenticated. In the future, stick with gold that's already in a top tier slab.

    Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
    "Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value---zero."----Voltaire
    "Everything you say should be true, but not everything true should be said."----Voltaire

  • lasvegasteddylasvegasteddy Posts: 10,432 ✭✭✭
    i've conceded and have a cancel this sale as the coin listed is counterfiet saving both of us the headache

    thanx to the crew here...now if the seller plays nice or not i'll see
    everything in life is but merely on loan to us by our appreciation....lose your appreciation and see


  • PerryHallPerryHall Posts: 46,868 ✭✭✭✭✭
    How did you pay for this coin?

    Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
    "Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value---zero."----Voltaire
    "Everything you say should be true, but not everything true should be said."----Voltaire

  • jdimmickjdimmick Posts: 9,783 ✭✭✭✭✭
    I agree with the few, I am about 95% sure the 03 is not genuine based on what I see in the photo!



  • << <i>I agree with the few, I am about 95% sure the 03 is not genuine based on what I see in the photo! >>




    image and it looks like the few............. have turned into many


  • << <i>

    << <i>Was the "omega man" an ebay seller? >>



    He was a counterfeiter. He marked his coins with a microscopic greek letter omega---hence the name given to him. His two most produced coins was the high relief MCMVII Saint (the omega was within the eagle's talons) and the 1882 gold $3 (the omega was within the loop of the R in LIBERTY). >>



    Thanks...ditn'd know that
    -Rome is Burning

    image
  • <<i've conceded and have a cancel this sale as the coin listed is counterfiet saving both of us the headache
    thanx to the crew here>>

    Good move. It is easier to back out before paying.
  • ziggy29ziggy29 Posts: 18,668 ✭✭✭
    I'm nearly to the point where I don't trust *any* raw gold, especially when peddled by relatively anonymous eBay sellers.
  • <<i've conceded and have a cancel this sale as the coin listed is counterfiet saving both of us the headache

    thanx to the crew here...now if the seller plays nice or not i'll see>>



    I think thats probably the smart move on this one. Errrrr on the sie of caution. Even though its not a major $$$ coin, why take the chance and risk having your hobby become an a$$ache?
    Looking for Au Classic Commems...
    Also looking for VF-EF Seated halves.

    Sell me your old auction catalogs...image
  • I happened to be looking at some McKinley pics and remembered this thread. Thought I'd add these for future reference.

    image
  • A raw U.S. gold coin, purportedly part of an 'estate sale,' on Ebay? Uh-huh.

    People who are interested in buying raw U. S. gold should, at the very least, invest in two books first:
    "Lonesome John" (John Devine)/Detecting Counterfeit Gold Coins Book 2. This paperback is out of print, but still available from numismatic book dealers.
    Bill Fivaz/United Stated Gold Counterfeit Detection Guide. This $20 spiral-bound book has great photographs, including ones of counterfeit McKinley gold commems.

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