When are the results announced for the next baseball HOF class and who is expected to make it?
thenavarro
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When are the votiing totals announced for the next baseball hall of fame class and who is expected to make it this class? Just want to get a headstart on getting their signed Topps rookie card,
Thanks,
Mike
Thanks,
Mike
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Veterans only vote for 1943-present players. No standouts, but Gil Hodges, Curt Flood, Roger Maris might have a snoball's chance. Munson is mentioned but I thought he didn't have enough playing years to be eligible. Dark horse candidates might be Billy Pierce, Dick Groat, Elroy Face, Don Newcome.
I already have signed rookies of Henderson, Rice, Blyleven, Smith, and Dawson so hopefully I'll be covered this year then.
I managed to dig up a story on it on the Hall's website as well.
01/09/2008 6:15 PM ET
Henderson headlines 2009 ballot
Newcomers also expected to include Cone, Orosco, Vaughn, Grace
By Jack O'Connell
NEW YORK -- Goose Gossage is still parading all over town from one press conference, interview and personal appearance to another as the newest elected member of the National Baseball Hall of Fame, and thoughts already are looking ahead to the Baseball Writers' Association of America's next ballot.
That's part of the intense interest in Hall of Fame voting, that no sooner does one election get announced than people start looking forward to the next election and who might be following Goose to Cooperstown.
The 2009 ballot is months from being formulated, of course, but the previous election is always a starting board. After all, 13 players from this year's ballot will be on the 2009 ballot, including two players who will be getting their last shot at making the Hall.
Boston Red Sox slugger Jim Rice and 288-game winning pitcher Tommy John will each be on the 2009 ballot for the 15th time, the limit a player may remain in consideration provided he is named on at least 5 percent of the ballots cast annually by 10-year members of the BBWAA.
A 75-percent plurality is required for election, and Rice drew very near that lofty neighborhood in the most recent election. With 543 ballots submitted, 408 votes were necessary to gain election. Rice fell just 16 votes short at 392 for 72.2 percent, which bodes well for him in 2009. Gossage, for example, had 71.2 percent of the vote in the 2007 election and gained 14.4 percent this year to win election with 466 votes (85.8).
This was not Gossage's last year on the ballot, either, but his ninth. Players in the 15th year tend to get more votes than in previous elections because voters are aware it is his last time. That also bodes well for Rice. Dave Concepcion, the shortstop of Cincinnati's Big Red Machine clubs of the 1970s, was on the ballot for the last time this year and got 14 more votes than the previous ballot. Rice picked up 46 votes this year from last and still has another year left.
In John's case, he has much more ground to cover than Rice. John's total is still below 30 percent. He got 158 votes (29.1) this time. In recent years, the biggest jump a player made the year he was elected was 19 percent by Tony Perez in 2000.
Significant jumps were made this year also by Andre Dawson (49 votes) and Bert Blyleven (76) that pushed them over the 60-percent margin. The question now is, can they continue to gain ground?
Tim Raines was the only first-time player on the 2008 ballot who received the sufficient support of 5 percent to stay on the ballot for 2009. The other holdovers will be Harold Baines, Don Mattingly, Mark McGwire, Jack Morris, Dale Murphy, Dave Parker, Lee Smith and Alan Trammell.
As for newcomers on the 2009 ballot, that is the call of the BBWAA's six-person screening committee that helps shape the ballot. The process begins in April when the committee is presented the list of players who fit the first criterion, that they played in at least 10 Major League seasons and have been retired for five years. Any player approved by two or more screening committee members is placed on the ballot.
By mid-July, the ballot is set, but it is not announced until late November while the Hall, with assistance from the Elias Sports Bureau of statisticians, put together biographical sketches of the candidates that accompany the ballot in the Hall of Fame packet to voters.
If he had not decided to keep playing in the Majors into his mid-40s, Rickey Henderson might be in the Hall of Fame already. However, if he does not stage yet another comeback, Henderson will be eligible for the ballot for the first time in 2009. The career leader in runs scored and stolen bases will be a strong contender to join 43 other Hall of Famers who were elected in their first year of eligibility.
Also likely to make their Hall of Fame ballot debuts in 2009 are pitchers David Cone and Jesse Orosco, first basemen Mo Vaughn and Mark Grace and third baseman Matt Williams.
Cone, the 1994 American League Cy Young Award winner, was 194-126 with a 3.46 ERA and 2,668 strikeouts and pitched on five World Series champions. Orosco, a four-decade reliever (1979-2003), appeared in more games (1,252) than any player in history.
Vaughn, the 1995 AL Most Valuable Player, was a .293 hitter with 328 home runs in a career shortened to 12 seasons due to leg injuries. Grace, a four-time Gold Glove winner, hit .303 over 17 seasons with 2,445 hits, of which 1,754 were the most of any player in the decade of the 1990s. Williams played on World Series teams for three organizations, combining power (378 home runs) and defense (four Gold Gloves).
Others with a shot at making the ballot include pitchers Steve Avery, Charles Nagy, Denny Neagle and Dan Plesac; infielders Jay Bell, Mike Bordick and Dean Palmer; and outfielders Ron Gant and Greg Vaughn.
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<< <i>I'd think that Henderson and either or both Rice and Dawson get in. Dan Plesac and Dean Palmer are locks as well. >>
No love for Greg Vaughn? I had hundreds of his 1990 Topps card back in the day.
Bill Spiers, too.
D's: 50P,49S,45D+S,43D,41S,40D,39D+S,38D+S,37D+S,36S,35D+S,all 16-34's
Q's: 52S,47S,46S,40S,39S,38S,37D+S,36D+S,35D,34D,32D+S
74T: 241,435,610,654 97 Finest silver: 115,135,139,145,310
73T:31,55,61,62,63,64,65,66,67,68,80,152,165,189,213,235,237,257,341,344,377,379,390,422,433,453,480,497,545,554,563,580,606,613,630
95 Ultra GM Sets: Golden Prospects,HR Kings,On-Base Leaders,Power Plus,RBI Kings,Rising Stars
.............................G.............AB.........R.............H.........2B......3B....HR.....GS.....RBI......BB.....SO......GIDP...AVG....OBP....SLG
Gil Hodges.......2,071.....7,030....1,105....1,921....295.....48....370....14...1,274....943...1,137....165.....273.....359....487
Other HOFer.....2,143.....7,161...1,259....2,116.....358.....85....407.....5....1,333....971...1,237....166.....295.....380....540
Some career highlights
7 World series appearances, 2 World Championships as a player, 1 World Championship as a manager, 8 All Star selections, .992 Fielding percentage, had more RBIs during the 1950s (1001) than any other player in the league, and a 3 time gold glove winner.
3 years of his career (age 20, 21, and 22) went to serve his country in WWII (as many HOFers did), and he received the bronze star from the US Navy.
The other HOFer that I compared him to above was none other than Duke Snider.
Less Brewers, more Cubs (except for maybe Gorman Thomas).
Go Cubs.
Looking for Charlie (Charley) Maxwell cards.
<< <i>I don't know if he is even eligible for consideration, but it's time to let Gil Hodges into the Hall. >>
Hodges is eligible and will be under consideration among the Veterans committee.
Sincerely,
Rickey
i agree hodges should be in, he didn't get in last time on the veterns committee so i think he now waits til 2010, i think they vote every 3 years.
it's a same he's not in already.
henderson and rice this year, i think
collecting RAW Topps baseball cards 1952 Highs to 1972. looking for collector grade (somewhere between psa 4-7 condition). let me know what you have, I'll take it, I want to finish sets, I must have something you can use for trade.
looking for Topps 71-72 hi's-62-53-54-55-59, I have these sets started
Edited to add: Oh, and by the way, the Schilling argument has been going on for a week now. Look up his stats with Don Drysdale. My guess is that they're very similar and no one questions Drysdale being in the HOF. Why? Because he won the 1 Cy Young. If Schill ever did, there wouldn't even be a debate.
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Henderson and Rice are locks, Dawson has a good chance, and Blyleven has about an average chance. No one else has a prayer next year.
<< <i>Nick, just my opinion but after looking at your stats and never seeing Hodges play, his stats are worse in every category (yes, marginally). His numbers seem iike he's a lock for the hall of very good and Local Legend status (kind of like Tom Sanders from the Celtics title runs), never the best player on his own team and a fantastic guy to have, but not a HOFer. Hard to let guys who hit under .280 in. Believe me, I was no fan of Mazeroski getting in.
>>
HOF MONITOR
DUKE 143
GIL 83
SCHILLING 171
Check black ink...no comparison between GIL AND DUKE.
Schilling would be in hands down, if it weren't for the fact many of the veterans don't like him...it's a crapshoot for him now.
back to back mvp??? single season home run leader held longer then ruth's
the guy is a historical icon.. how he isn't in the hall is beyond me..and a real tragedy...
go santo...
I would love to see my all time favorite donny baseball get in...
I loved rice too..
mark grace won't get in and not sure he deserves it.. but most hits in the 90's is impressive..
it would make my wifes year
<< <i>I say roger maris needs to be in the hall... don't care that his "career stats" don't measure..
back to back mvp??? single season home run leader held longer then ruth's
the guy is a historical icon.. how he isn't in the hall is beyond me..and a real tragedy...
go santo...
I would love to see my all time favorite donny baseball get in...
I loved rice too..
mark grace won't get in and not sure he deserves it.. but most hits in the 90's is impressive..
it would make my wifes year >>
I agree, i think they should make exceptions for being great over long periods, for those that are baseball icons in the history of the game....unfortunately we aren't on the board (LOL)...
Collecting 1970s Topps baseball wax, rack and cello packs, as well as PCGS graded Half Cents, Large Cents, Two Cent pieces and Three Cent Silver pieces.
Here are some stats to compare. One is in the Hall of Fame and the other doesn't have a chance in hell...
Player A:
G AB R H 2B 3B HR RBI SB CS BB SO BA OBP SLG
+--------------+---+----+----+----+---+--+---+----+---+--+---+---+-----
128 557 63 165 12 5 0 31 14 7 16 69 .296 .320 .336
161 691 80 199 29 13 4 74 21 12 41 87 .288 .330 .385
161 680 119 223 37 6 31 96 20 12 34 99 .328 .366 .537
157 624 96 207 32 5 28 99 12 7 32 91 .332 .367 .534
158 657 109 234 42 5 24 121 6 7 23 83 .356 .375 .545
159 635 75 215 45 4 9 85 11 4 41 59 .339 .379 .465
146 551 82 164 40 3 12 80 5 4 57 73 .298 .365 .446
152 611 92 195 29 6 15 89 11 5 31 78 .319 .352 .460
160 639 104 210 38 4 19 110 17 7 44 97 .329 .374 .490
156 622 89 184 39 3 22 89 8 6 47 93 .296 .349 .474
108 439 79 139 32 3 20 112 6 3 28 47 .317 .362 .540
137 538 83 169 39 0 23 99 3 2 56 89 .314 .379 .515
+--------------+---+----+----+----+---+--+---+----+---+--+---+---+-----
Avg 658 97 209 38 5 19 99 12 7 41 88 .318 .360 .477
Player B:
G AB R H 2B 3B HR RBI SB CS BB SO BA OBP SLG
+--------------+---+----+----+----+---+--+---+----+---+--+---+---+-----
7 12 0 2 0 0 0 1 0 0 0 1 .167 .154 .167
91 279 34 79 15 4 4 32 0 0 21 31 .283 .333 .409
153 603 91 207 44 2 23 110 1 1 41 33 .343 .381 .537
159 652 107 211 48 3 35 145 2 2 56 41 .324 .371 .567
162 677 117 238 53 2 31 113 0 0 53 35 .352 .394 .573
141 569 93 186 38 2 30 115 1 4 51 38 .327 .378 .559
144 599 94 186 37 0 18 88 1 0 41 29 .311 .353 .462
158 631 79 191 37 2 23 113 3 0 51 30 .303 .351 .477
102 394 40 101 16 0 5 42 1 0 28 20 .256 .308 .335
152 587 64 169 35 0 9 68 2 0 46 42 .288 .339 .394
157 640 89 184 40 0 14 86 3 0 39 43 .288 .327 .416
134 530 78 154 27 2 17 86 0 0 61 42 .291 .364 .445
97 372 62 113 20 1 6 51 0 0 60 24 .304 .397 .411
128 458 59 132 32 2 7 49 0 2 40 35 .288 .341 .413
+--------------+---+----+----+----+---+--+---+----+---+--+---+---+-----
Avg 636 91 195 40 2 20 100 1 1 53 40 .307 .358 .471
or donny mattingly?
Black Ink: Batting - 22 (92) (Average HOFer ¡Ö 27)
Gray Ink: Batting - 122 (153) (Average HOFer ¡Ö 144)
HOF Standards: Batting - 39.3 (154) (Average HOFer ¡Ö 50)
HOF Monitor: Batting - 159.5 (70) (Likely HOFer > 100)
6 Gold Gloves, 10 All-Star games, 1 Batting Title (4 Top 5 finishes), 6 Silver Sluggers
Player B:
Black Ink: Batting - 23 (84) (Average HOFer ¡Ö 27)
Gray Ink: Batting - 111 (187) (Average HOFer ¡Ö 144)
HOF Standards: Batting - 34.2 (200) (Average HOFer ¡Ö 50)
HOF Monitor: Batting - 133.5 (98) (Likely HOFer > 100)
9 Gold Gloves, 6 All-Star Games, 1 Batting Title (5 Top 5 finishes), 1 MVP, 3 Silver Sluggers
Player A was an outfielder (more spots for AS, GG, and SS awards). Player B was a 1st baseman.
Player A is Kirby Puckett and Player B is Don Mattingly.
<< <i>....after looking at your stats and never seeing Hodges play, his stats are worse in every category (yes, marginally)..... >>
Vito, taking one stat of Gil's and Duke's, like HR's for instance, yes they are 37 HR's apart, but when you span that over their 18 year each career, then Gil Hodges only averaged 2 less HR's per year than Duke.
<< <i>Check black ink...no comparison between GIL AND DUKE...... >>
You keep measuring everything by the black ink.
<< <i>In many cases it's really not about stats. If anybody believes Ozzie Smith doesn't deserve to be in then they weren't watching baseball in the 80s. >>
I agree, it is not just about stats. Character and steroids can make a play (I wonder what happens with alomar and spitting)
But for those that like to compare stats, they should compare ALL stats, not just parts of their stats to make their argument)
Baseballreference.com does a great job of this with their HOF monitor.
It seems to be pretty accurate in selection...Besides known steroid users, there is not one player with a HOF monitor above 150 (and most above 135) that is not a HOF'er or future HOF'er besides Pete Rose.
Baseball Reference HOF Monitor
Ozzie 143
Mattingly 133
Blyleven 120
Rice 144
Alomar 193
<< <i>otw- Puckett falls in the same category that Ozzie does: A team leader and the best player for a storied World Series team. Puckett got in on more than stats. While his stats are iffy, he led his team to two rings. If Mattingly leads the Yanks to a ring he gets in too. >>
Even Puckett had a 159 HOF monitor...if he didn't get in, he would be the ONLY 150+hof monitor that wouldn't get in...
6 points if they were the regular SS or C on a WS team, 5 points for 2B or CF, 3 for 3B, 2 for LF or RF, and 1 for 1B. I don't have the OF distribution, so I give 3 points for OF.
<< <i>Not that I buy into a made up scale like that, but Puckett loses 10 points if he wasn't on the World Series teams so he would have been at 149.
6 points if they were the regular SS or C on a WS team, 5 points for 2B or CF, 3 for 3B, 2 for LF or RF, and 1 for 1B. I don't have the OF distribution, so I give 3 points for OF. >>
I don't necessarily buy into these monitors, because they don't show a lot, but I do believe it is the most accurate and fair way to attribute "STATS", for those that like to use stats to compare worthiness.
It does nothing for "clutch, charisma, off the field, personality" etc...which all may be attributed to HOF worthiness...but beyond that it is the best tool we have to compare stats.
Another great tool i use is WINSHARES & PLAYER RANKINGS....this is great for current players...select the year or all years. Great for determining the most valuable players of each team.
WINSHARES - ANOTHER GREAT TOOL
ESPN PLAYER RANKINGS
<< <i>Henderson and Rice are locks, Dawson has a good chance, and Blyleven has about an average chance. No one else has a prayer next year. >>
Agreed. Rickey is a lock, Rice will get in (it's well overdue) and Bert and The Hawk are each building momentum among writers who should have already voted them in. Might take another year or two for them, but they're each on the right path.