King of the Lincoln's???
bolivarshagnasty
Posts: 7,351 ✭✭✭✭✭
I've been reading the MPL threads, and without a doubt the MPL's are some of the most beautiful and scarce Lincon's among the Lincolns. But if pop reports were the only factor, I wondered where some of the new varieties might stand in all of this. These are just two examples, let's hear from others on their scarce Lincoln's.
1909 S/S RPM 1 FS-1501-----60----61----62----63----64----65----66
ANACS-------------------BN-----2-----3-------3-----
----------------------------RB---------------------3----10------------3
----------------------------RD-----------------------------------1-----3------1
NGC----------------------BN---------------------------2------1-----
----------------------------RB---------------------1-------------------1
----------------------------RD-------------------------------------------------1
PCGS---------------------BN-----------------------------------3
----------------------------RB------------------------------------------1------1
----------------------------RD---------------------------------------------------Total 40
1928-S Large S FS-501
ANACS-------------------BN-------1-------------1-------2
----------------------------RB---------------------2-------1----3
----------------------------RD
NGC-----------------------BN
----------------------------RB-----------------------------1
----------------------------RD
PCGS---------------------BN------------------------------------3
----------------------------RB-----------------------------1-----1
----------------------------RD----------------------------------------------------Total 16
Some real low pop Lincolns, at least at the big Three TPG's. Who is the true King of the Lincolns??
1909 S/S RPM 1 FS-1501-----60----61----62----63----64----65----66
ANACS-------------------BN-----2-----3-------3-----
----------------------------RB---------------------3----10------------3
----------------------------RD-----------------------------------1-----3------1
NGC----------------------BN---------------------------2------1-----
----------------------------RB---------------------1-------------------1
----------------------------RD-------------------------------------------------1
PCGS---------------------BN-----------------------------------3
----------------------------RB------------------------------------------1------1
----------------------------RD---------------------------------------------------Total 40
1928-S Large S FS-501
ANACS-------------------BN-------1-------------1-------2
----------------------------RB---------------------2-------1----3
----------------------------RD
NGC-----------------------BN
----------------------------RB-----------------------------1
----------------------------RD
PCGS---------------------BN------------------------------------3
----------------------------RB-----------------------------1-----1
----------------------------RD----------------------------------------------------Total 16
Some real low pop Lincolns, at least at the big Three TPG's. Who is the true King of the Lincolns??
0
Comments
1 would be 22-d no d
2 would be 55 ddo
I personally like the 1955 ddo...that would be my type coin for the Lincoln Cent if I ever did a type set.
JMHO
Regular strike coins, mintage wise, all the Matte proofs have a clear lead. Depending on whose numbers you rely on, it is either the VDB or the 1915 or 1916 which have the lowest mintages. These last years of the Mattes probably had quite a few melted at the mint, though we will never know for certain.
Several branch mint coins of the twenties can lay claim to being the rarest, if you go by surviving RED examples. Perhaps higher grades of some of these coins may yet show up and reach into the six figure range.
In time, the 1969S Doubledie may be regarded as a great rarity as well, though at this date it is possible more will surface since unsearched bags and rolls still exist.
The 1909 VDB doubledie may be one of the rarest lincolns in high grade, this MS66RD has a pop of 6 If youve never seen one, take a look at the TY on Liberty and the 19 on the date. thats where the doubleing is most apparant. Sometimes its easier to examine VDB's for this by holding the coin upside down while looking with the loupe.
-Paul
<< <i>
Regular strike coins, mintage wise, all the Matte proofs have a clear lead. Depending on whose numbers you rely on, it is either the VDB or the 1915 or 1916 which have the lowest mintages. These last years of the Mattes probably had quite a few melted at the mint, though we will never know for certain. >>
I have followed the different reporting on the VDB in the Red Book since Kevin Flynn's research in the late 1990's resulted in the 1,194 "number" replacing the traditional 420 "number". Recently our own poster and researcher Roger Burdette (RWB) has convinced Red Book to again change mintages on some MPL's. Part of the problem is the definition of what is "mintage" as far as PROOF coins are concerned. I believed that proof coins were minted to SELL to customers and that the US Mint reported numbers based on those sales. Apparently, according to researchers far more knowledgeable about mint policies than I am, the mintage reported is the quantity struck that is "good" for distribution. It doesn't mean that all the coins good for distribution actually went into distribution. So, in the case of the 1909VDB matte proof, based on Kevin Flynn's detailed explanation in his 1996 book with John Wexler called "the Authoritative Reference on Lincoln Cents" there were 1,503 of the VDB's struck and 1,194 were "good". It is ASSUMED that many of those never made it into collectors hands and the current pop reports support that theory. I "like" the 420 number because it "seems" close to reality and I assume that about half of THAT quantity got lost over the past 99 years and only about 200 currently exist. The 1916 MPL has a mintage story also with mint records showing "only 600" were minted instead of the reported 1,050. I wouldn't doubt that only 600 made it into distribution, but I truly believe that today there are more 1916's in existence than there are 1909VDB's. If RWB reads this he might want to comment. Steve
My Complete PROOF Lincoln Cent with Major Varieties(1909-2015)Set Registry
as of late it was removed from the price guide and i ask a lil why???
but as to my 2 cent piece the king to me has been crowned in the 09 vdb matty no matter who interjects as they will.
true the likes of 43 coppers,infamous 74 aluminums,64 sms or certain patterns will hold their place as "per se" unicorns
I'll put my vote in with a little story.
"Back in the day", before Lincoln-mania, there was a coin so spectacular, so singular in its beauty, so pristine and well struck that it eclipsed all other Lincoln cents. Stewart will remember this coin as will Mike Printz. It was a 14-S in 66RD. I saw this coin and it has been etched in my brain since then, much like Stewart's 14 PR68RD that I saw while it was still raw. The 14-S 's beauty is compounded by its fleeting existance. Much like many other beautiful things we behold, it is there one moment and then it is gone. The 14-S was stolen from its FEDEX package. Mike could elaborate more, but I believe the coin was lost, at least in it's previous state forever.
That was among the Kings, if not THE KING of the Lincolns
Jack
ambro51; I'll have to agree with you on the 58 DDO being the King. I didn't realize
there were only 3 in existence. Does one exist among the Forum Members? That
would be a great photo to see. Beautiful 1909 DDO and S-VDB in red!!!
To All, Didn't imply that a variety might be the King, just wanted to know what
everyone else's idea was on the subject. I think that pops are only one of the
determining factors in hailing the King.
<< <i>jacktheknife; Interesting story. Do any photos exist of this coin?
ambro51; I'll have to agree with you on the 58 DDO being the King. I didn't realize
there were only 3 in existence. Does one exist among the Forum Members? That
would be a great photo to see. Beautiful 1909 DDO and S-VDB in red!!!
To All, Didn't imply that a variety might be the King, just wanted to know what
everyone else's idea was on the subject. I think that pops are only one of the
determining factors in hailing the King. >>
I believe Stewart owns the finest known example of the 1958DDO. Rick Snow and I almost bought one of these examples in 1996 when coming in 2nd in a mail bid auction for the coin. I also agree this is the rarest of all of the variety Lincoln cents.
IMO, I would give Stewart's 1909 VDB PR67RD Matte Proof Lincoln the nod for "King of the Lincolns". I know there are two examples and Stewart once owned both of the coins and some years back sold the other example and kept his favorite. I am only considering regular issue coins in my decision.
<< <i>jacktheknife; Interesting story. Do any photos exist of this coin?
ambro51; I'll have to agree with you on the 58 DDO being the King. I didn't realize
there were only 3 in existence. Does one exist among the Forum Members? That
would be a great photo to see. Beautiful 1909 DDO and S-VDB in red!!!
To All, Didn't imply that a variety might be the King, just wanted to know what
everyone else's idea was on the subject. I think that pops are only one of the
determining factors in hailing the King. >>
A board member has a 58 DDO. What ever Lincoln you want to call the king will more than likely be in his set (on display at the summer ANA).
<< <i>A variety is not the king of the Lincoln series.
-Paul >>
Total agreement with this statement!!
in July. I have since made plans to attend, looking forward to seeing that unbelievable
collection in person. Thanks for providing that opportunity Mr. Blay!!!
The S VDB was saved from new, and always represented a premium coin, even in the teens and twenties, before Lincoln cent collecting became popular. Given the fact that several thousand have been slabbed in MS, there have always been sufficent coins for the collecting public. No set could be considered complete without an example, and that holds true today also. Whether it is the top registry sets, clamoring for an MS67RD at 90K a pop, or the basic whitman book with a hole filler, it is a sought after coin.
Indeed, more MS SVDBS probably exist than AG to VG since they were desireable and recognized and most were pulled from circulation by the thirties. In regard to value (price), one can argue that an MS67RD SVDB is just as valuable as a PR66RD Matte VDB.