Buyer wants return after 40+ days

incugator · January 20, 2008 4:59AM

I have a buyer who wants to return a card 40 days after purchase. He says he has reason to believe the slab was tampered with. I called the person who I got the card slabbed from and it has been in the slab for over 7 years. The buyer says he wants to send card into PSA for re-evaluation. If it comes back as unauthentic, he will file a complaint. After 40 days, can he do this? Many buyers on the board know that I always try to make my buyers 100% satisfied. I really feel like this guy is trying to scam me (for a lot of money) Any suggestions?

zep33 · January 20, 2008 5:02AM

call him a douche and tell him to blow you

WinPitcher · January 20, 2008 5:05AM

Paypal allows for 45 days so he still has time in that regard.

I would tell him to send it to PSA for a revaluation and if it comes back as altered or counterfiet that I would of course refund your money,(I mean you do stand by your cards) PSA should make good if it is indeed a problem card).

make no mention regarding the slab. also if he does send it back for a revaluation he will be waiting some time for it as PSA expects an avalanche of cards due to the .5 craze.

I think this answers your question?

ahhh I just re read your post. You may think he will insert a phony. ahhh hmmmm dunno I'd tll him sure send it back. then 45 days passes he is s o o l at that point.

Steve

mealeworm · January 20, 2008 5:06AM

1 What type of value are we talking?
2 Was it your card? If so you should know if the slab was ok.
3 D oyou have a scan of the card in question? Maybe he tampered with the card and now you might be getting back a different card or a fake??

Dave

SportsItUpCards · January 20, 2008 5:09AM

His time is almost up, so he can't do anything. He probably tampared with it himself, and know want to send you a different card for his money back or something like that. I say, don't worry about it

Giovanni

EagleEyeKid · January 20, 2008 5:10AM

Tell him to go play some dodge cars.
I think he can complain with paypal up to 45 days now?
Either way, I think he's full of it.....40+ days to evaluate
is way too long imo.

RipublicaninMass · January 20, 2008 5:26AM

I have bought some cards int he past that came back trimmed, I would FULLY expect a refund from that, otherwise I think it has been too long. You shold make 100% of people happy, but the card is slabbed..no returns on graded cards

WinPitcher · January 20, 2008 5:30AM

The problem is the buyer is now saying the holder has been tampered with. Even so, too much time has gone by, even if what he says is true too much time has gone by and I would not hold it against you if you told the guy to go and pound sand.

Steve

ripkenintheminors · January 20, 2008 5:32AM

That's quite awhile. I'd be concerned with a return on a graded card.

stormsurge · January 20, 2008 5:35AM

Hmm, that does seem to be an long time for having the item and just now telling you that he thinks their is a problem. I don't think I'd be willing to refund him.

storm888 · January 20, 2008 5:37AM

We are not fond of refunds.

There is, based on your info, a 50/50 chance that the buyer is/is not a scamster.

If he files b4 the 45-days, PP will lock up the money.

A lulling email might get you past the 45-days:

"Please send the card to PSA for review. Let me know the results promptly. Thanks."

Or, you can do nothing and see what happens. If he is playing the switcheroo, in
the end, your original scan will support your position.

Remember: If he paid by credit card through PP, the CC company will/can support
a chargeback at almost anytime. 180-365 is now in the merchant-account agreements,
but it is actually FOREVER. The decision is based on when the "fraud should have
been discovered."

incugator · January 20, 2008 6:07AM

Okay, more info. The seller claims that the slab has some frosting. In his scans, the card does have some minor frosting, but I have slabs that I sent in myself with similar frosting issues. The frosting is only on one side of the card which seems pretty common. I'm not going to name the card or buyer yet because I want to try to handle the situation without too many problems. I called the person that I purchased the card from and he said that he and his business partner purchased the card a few years ago (he said 3-5 years ago) and that it was already slabbed.

This seller didn't pay with paypal, and he has already left positive feedback so I really don't know what he can do.

I think that there are 3 possibly situations.

#1. The buyer needs the money and can't resell the card for the price paid.

#2. The buyer is a scammer that isn't very good at what he does.

#3. The slab is frosted and the buyer feels unsure if the card is real.

If anybody could send me pics of frosted tampered slabs. I'd really appreciate it. Please post pics or links on this thread. You guys are always a great help.

-Ryan

jvineyard · January 20, 2008 6:07AM

Is there a chance the card was part of this mess:

Counterfeit PSA Slabs

I was just contacted by an ebay seller that sold me a 1934 Goudey Gehrig over 30 days ago that he now believes is a counterfeit. I carefully compared the slab and card to the others in my 1934 set and did not see a problem. However, Levi Bleam has a '34 Goudey with the same cert number listed on ebay right now - so one of them is fake.

My seller has offered a full refund. I am going to walk the card into PSA this week for confirmation, but I am pretty sure now that the card is a reprint inserted into the tampered slab.

This seller contacted me, and offered a refund, and I will never hesitate to buy from a dealer that is that honest.

11235813 · January 20, 2008 6:30AM

This is why it is important to have a clearly stated refund policy in all your listings.

I am constantly astounded by the number of sellers who do not clearly state their refund policies (about 70-80% in my estimation).

WinPitcher · January 20, 2008 6:40AM

Not sure that a clearly specified refund policy would help with this matter.

My take? the guy waited too long.

Tell him to pound sand.

Steve

incugator · January 20, 2008 6:41AM

My refund policy is well stated. I didn't get this card on Craiglist in the scam. Is there legitimately anything this guy can do at this point? Auction ended over 45 days ago. Payment wasn't paypal and he already left positive feedback.

-Ryan

WinPitcher · January 20, 2008 6:47AM

Inc

If that is the case, i don't think so. I mean he could sue you in small claims court, then again anyone can do that.

I would stop communicating with the guy and block him from further auctions.

I mean you are 100% sure the slab was ok when you sold it? and are 100% sure the card is authentic? If so then it is a done deal as far as i would be concerned.

Steve

storm888 · January 20, 2008 6:50AM

NOTE:

IF the card was counterfeit AND/OR in a counterfeit-slab when you sold it,
you would be liable, and would have to refund.

You would have recourse against your seller, he against his.

I have ALWAYS thought that I could tell if a holder had been tampered.
Pry-marks are hard to hide; but, that "scratch-out" product you see
advertised on TV can be Dremel-buffed into those marks. The crooks
say it is a tough job to get right, and it takes a long time.

SEVERE frosting is bad. "Frost-spots" are common.

I would get PSA involved. They are VERY happy to help.

YOUR seller could have gotten scammed. Or, he could have scammed you.

OR, the card might be perfectly FINE. ........ PSA will know.

rube26105 · January 20, 2008 6:59AM

tell him to stick it, what a negative, whoopie, life goes on

<call him a douche and tell him to blow you>

haaaaaaaa

BassPro77 · January 20, 2008 8:35AM

I would say 7 or 10 days, yeah maybe. after fourty days I would just say tough luck buddy. theres always a chance they tried to open or tamper with the case and screwed up. I SAY SCREW HIM

WinPitcher · January 20, 2008 8:39AM

What type of feedback does this buyer have? Does he have prior feeedback that state he has done this b4?

I agree with Storm, if you sold him a counterfiet the time that has elapsed is irrelavant.

I'd ask him (if i was still even communicating with him) why he waited 40+ days to mention this.

Steve

gamehunter · January 20, 2008 10:17AM

The creep probably broke open the slab himself and put a mickey mouse card in it or something. Now he wants to get a full refund and keep the good card that used to be in the slab.

Allen · January 20, 2008 11:25AM

<< <i>The creep probably broke open the slab himself and put a mickey mouse card in it or something. Now he wants to get a full refund and keep the good card that used to be in the slab. >>

Me thinks gamehunter right.

BobaFett72 · January 20, 2008 1:58PM

i just saw this in one of your posts: "Auction ended over 45 days ago. Payment wasn't paypal and he already left positive feedback"

screw him. 45 days later. he can sit and spin.

gemmintrarities · January 20, 2008 2:01PM

<< <i>I have a buyer who wants to return a card 40 days after purchase. He says he has reason to believe the slab was tampered with. I called the person who I got the card slabbed from and it has been in the slab for over 7 years. The buyer says he wants to send card into PSA for re-evaluation. If it comes back as unauthentic, he will file a complaint. After 40 days, can he do this? Many buyers on the board know that I always try to make my buyers 100% satisfied. I really feel like this guy is trying to scam me (for a lot of money) Any suggestions? >>

I had some guy recently say almost the same exact thing. Care to divulge his Ebay ID?..

gamehunter · January 20, 2008 2:19PM

Ryan, let us know what this clown's eBay ID is so we can block him from our auctions.

drewsef · January 20, 2008 2:24PM

frosting on the side of the card holder is the flash point where it is sealed

Carew29 · January 20, 2008 2:25PM

Bottom line is, he was happy when he left the feedback. He has no case, simply reply to him that he should have returned the card the day he left feedback if he was not happy. Or just ignore him and block him from future bids.

DeutscherGeist · January 20, 2008 4:09PM

Assuming this guy is not lying, he is not out of line. Sometimes it takes years before finding out a card or any collector's piece is counterfeit.

Upon receiving the card, the buyer trusted PSA that what he bought was authentic. How could he doubt ? After a while, when one gains more knowledge about cards, you begin to wonder about what you bought and look at it a second time with a different perspective. He probably only recently found out about this "frosting" thing. 40 days is actually a very short time period in that respect. Some people think they have something authentic and keep it for years never knowing it was a dud until the next generation finds out (a son or grandson who gets that collectable reappraised).

He wants to send the slab back to PSA, which is what a collector who is concerned should do. Since you have a scan of the original card, he cannot get away with switching the card out. That would be too difficult to do if at all. You also have a picture of the slab, so you can compare if there was any changes in that too. Save that evidence in case you are challenged more intensely. Ask him for a recent scan and explanation of where he thinks the problem area is exactly and then check your records for a match (you can see if there are any changes that way).

He can only seek damages if the card is found to be fake, other than that, he has no way of recourse. Even a credit card company has a time limit. 180 days? I never heard of it that long. I only see 90 days tops. Paypal probably expired by now. Let us know how it goes.

pandrews · January 20, 2008 4:20PM

is his ebay ID by any chance "bythesky"?

if so, he is a complete idiot..

WinPitcher · January 21, 2008 12:24AM

At this point we only have dribs and drabs of the story, (not implying the OP is not telling the truth) however, it would be nice to see the original auction and be able to look at the buyers feedback. Then and only then we might be able to answer these questions.

If i was the seller and I knew 100% that this buyer was FOS I would not have to come here for answers. OP please do not take my meaning wrong. But a lil more information is needed.

All this conjecture is meaningless at this point.

Steve

ebayaddict · January 21, 2008 1:22AM

Then i would n't worry about it....tell him to sell it.

incugator · January 21, 2008 1:25AM

The story has developed a little bit. The buyer has 100% feedback but a fairly low feedback score. (In the low 200's mostly low$$$ stuff)

He is now saying that he thinks the card is real, but he simply isn't sure. HE recently got burned on a 51 mantle and now he is skeptical about my card.

I always want to make my customers happy or at least satisfied. I'm considering offering this guy 80% of the paid price of the card as long as the card is returned. This will allow me to get the card and view if it has been tampered with before sending a refund. Off of that, I can determine whether I need to send the card back to PSA for re-evaluation.

Would this be a fair offer for a skeptical buyer with no proof.

I will not allow him to send the card into PSA because of fear of the old swicharoo.

-Ryan

baseballfan · January 21, 2008 1:41AM

i think zep33 has summed it up

Buyer wants return after 40+ days

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