Need help identifying this coin from 1576

RichieURich

This coin came in on an appraisal, I would like help in identifying it, plus an estimate of wholesale value. Thanks!

ASUtodd

Here is some information I found on a fake version of this coin. It does give the weight that the coin should be.
Medieval and Later

Albertine Line, AR Thaler, 1576, Germany-Saxony
.AVGVSTVS.D:G.DVX.SAXO.SA.ROMA.-IMP.
Armored bust right with two-handed sword
.ARCHIMARS-CHAL.ET.ELEG
Arms
38mm x 39mm, 20.60g (seriously underweight - should weigh 28.00-29.00g)
Ex Ralph T Foster, eBay, May 2006, sold as authentic in 2x2 - returned May 2006

Note: Seems to be a lost wax method cast fake intended to defraud. The edges are hammered oddly and the piece sounds hollow. There is a small plug mark or sprue removal spot on the edge at 3 o'clock. Some small pits on obverse and reverse edges. Most likely, Mr. Foster did not remove this piece from the 2x2 when he bought it and would not have known this was a fake.

RichieURich

ASUTodd, I apologize for not including the weight in the original post. The coin weighs 28.5 grams. Diameter is just slightly smaller than an American Silver Eagle, which the Redbook pegs at 40.6 mm, so it's probably 39 to 39.5 mm. I looked for a sprule on the edge, but there are lots of marks and scratches, so it's difficult to tell if there was one there at one time. The edge is the most suspicious part of the coin to me. It's flat to the touch, with no rim bumps (very suspicious), but lots of small scratches under magnification. The edge isn't knife-like like a proof coin, but is high, such that the coin maintains its full thickness all around the edge. Thoughts?

1jester

I'm not an expert on the series, but from the scans I see nothing that would lead me to believe it's counterfeit.

coinkat

Saxony... not sure of the exact value, however, I do believe it is not rare.

Sapyx

I'm not sure what the deal is with all the scratch-marks around the top section of the obverse legend are, though. It's either a botched attempt at tooling or the coin had something stuck there that required heavy scraping to remove. Maybe some corrosion, or a large mount mark?

Either way, it'd probably bring the coin down a notch or two in grade - and it's probably enough to have it rejected by the TPGs as altered.

lordmarcovan

Love those Saxony thalers. Had one similar to that, a few years ago.



<< <i>I'm not sure what the deal is with all the scratch-marks around the top section of the obverse legend are, though. It's either a botched attempt at tooling or the coin had something stuck there that required heavy scraping to remove. Maybe some corrosion, or a large mount mark? >>

Probably a mount removal, yeah. Lots of these were mounted.

RichieURich

Anyone have an idea as to the value of it? Thanks.

TwoKopeiki

Here's one on CNG for sale for $495. It looks to be a problem-free XF example, though.



GERMANY, Sachsen-Albertinische Linie. August. Elector, 1553-1586. AR Taler (40mm, 29.09 g, 6h). Dresden mint. Dated 1575. Armored bust right, holding sword with both hands, 15 75 across / Coat of arms surmounted by three helmets. Schnee 725; K&K 68; Davenport 9798. EF.

shuckins

Love those Saxony thalers. Had one similar to that, a few years ago.

I bet it looked like this.....

RichieURich

Anyone have an idea as to the value of the coin? Thanks.

lordmarcovan

Upper $200s? Just a WAG.

I had a slabbed XF40, as I recall, and it wasn't a whole lot more than that. But there are too many variables and I am away from my books (and Krause wouldn't help anyway since it starts at 1601).

I don't really know but I don't think much more than $350 on this one, tops. But I could be way off-base. Let somebody else chime in.

(Edit- I'm talkin' retail.)