Some musings on the Registry phenomenon
lordmarcovan
Posts: 43,564 ✭✭✭✭✭
In my pre-computer, pre-Registry past, my best numismatic friend and I used to collect roughly parallel sets and try to "one-up" one another in friendly competition. We were quick to gloat over our victories, but just as quick to make admiring "oohs" and "aahs" when the other guy scored a beautiful coin.
I enjoyed this competition, as it was educational and helped me to learn what others appreciate in the hobby, as well as sharpening my own senses and making my taste more discriminating. If my buddy didn't like one of my coins, I looked at it a little less eagerly. On the other hand, if he really liked one I was lukewarm on, then my opinion of that coin went up a bit. I respected (and still respect) his opinion. He has since branched out to other fields like political memorabilia and paper money, and we now live 700 miles apart.
I am the sort who likes structure and likes to complete a set of coins within a certain set of guidelines- "rules", if you like. The Registry has given me a common set of rules and an arena to play the game with like-minded folks, and I thoroughly enjoy the thrill of that friendly competition all over again. Many thanks to you all. Having an online inventory database and web space to host images is fantastic, too. Hats off to PCGS!
On the other hand, there are folks who do not "get it", and the Registry has a flip side, where avarice and covetousness reign supreme. Partially as a result of Registry perfect-o-mania, some people will pay truly insane prices for some coins (hey, it's their money, though, right?). Some of the critics have a point. I knew there would be critics when I switched over, and it seems there is quite a bit of criticism of the Registry from outsiders lately. One critic said he is "not a part of the Registry but working to build a better Registry". Give me a break. Sure, there are snags and the thing ain't a perfect system, but it gets my vote for the best show in town.
The voices of critics don't change the fact that I am having a lot of fun here (and let's not forget that that is what it is all about). When I started, I looked for a way to explain the whole thing to my wife, in terms she would understand. In the end, the best I could come up with was to tell her that I was trying out for "The Super Bowl of Numismatics". Now I think it is more like the Numismatic Olympics. You have different classes and different events to play in, and different kinds of medals to win. Your competitors are from all over the country or the world, and for the most part they are also friends.
My hot air has run out. Musings are done now. As you were...
I enjoyed this competition, as it was educational and helped me to learn what others appreciate in the hobby, as well as sharpening my own senses and making my taste more discriminating. If my buddy didn't like one of my coins, I looked at it a little less eagerly. On the other hand, if he really liked one I was lukewarm on, then my opinion of that coin went up a bit. I respected (and still respect) his opinion. He has since branched out to other fields like political memorabilia and paper money, and we now live 700 miles apart.
I am the sort who likes structure and likes to complete a set of coins within a certain set of guidelines- "rules", if you like. The Registry has given me a common set of rules and an arena to play the game with like-minded folks, and I thoroughly enjoy the thrill of that friendly competition all over again. Many thanks to you all. Having an online inventory database and web space to host images is fantastic, too. Hats off to PCGS!
On the other hand, there are folks who do not "get it", and the Registry has a flip side, where avarice and covetousness reign supreme. Partially as a result of Registry perfect-o-mania, some people will pay truly insane prices for some coins (hey, it's their money, though, right?). Some of the critics have a point. I knew there would be critics when I switched over, and it seems there is quite a bit of criticism of the Registry from outsiders lately. One critic said he is "not a part of the Registry but working to build a better Registry". Give me a break. Sure, there are snags and the thing ain't a perfect system, but it gets my vote for the best show in town.
The voices of critics don't change the fact that I am having a lot of fun here (and let's not forget that that is what it is all about). When I started, I looked for a way to explain the whole thing to my wife, in terms she would understand. In the end, the best I could come up with was to tell her that I was trying out for "The Super Bowl of Numismatics". Now I think it is more like the Numismatic Olympics. You have different classes and different events to play in, and different kinds of medals to win. Your competitors are from all over the country or the world, and for the most part they are also friends.
My hot air has run out. Musings are done now. As you were...
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Comments
Of course I had to look up the word, avarice, but other than that- your Thread nailed what the Registry provides that is positive and what the Registry can lead to that is negative.
peacockcoins
Your description of your relationship with your friend is how I approach the registry sets. (Plus I also find them one fantastic inventory system!)
You ought to try collecting Mercury dimes--the group that collects these seems pretty easy going and cheers when one of us upgrades his or her set.
Mark
P.S. to Braddick: I knew what avarice meant, so nyah nyah!! Of course, I am an economist and so probably should know the meaning of the word. However, I couldn't spell the word to save my life!!
It was a Lincoln penny set in an old Whitman folder. I was 10-years-old and my best friend and I had just spent an entire Saturday afternoon at the local coin shop. The shop owner was the kind of guy that tolerated a couple of 10-year-olds asking a lot of redundant questions and we both finally decided that "pennies" were in our price range.
Well, for the next year we scoured the countryside, so to speak, and we tried to find the perfect coin to fill our holders. Along the way, we got our families involved and some of my fondest memories are of my great-aunt Jenny and the "wheaties" she was able to secure for me from her friends.
Now, move the clock ahead 25-years, and really not much has changed. I still have family looking to help me fill some holes and I enjoy trying to find that perfect coin. The only difference is that my holder has become the registry sets and my best friend has turned into many friends from around the country.
I guess the beauty of coin collecting for me is that at times, I'm still that little 10-year-old boy.
MarkJude
Mark's Mattes
Mark's Cameo SMS Set
Mark's Non-Cameo SMS Set
It has been a while since I saw you (lordmarcovan) over in the other place but I don't have to wonder why. It has become an increasing vile place to be.
First of all, I have met this collector (lordmarcovan) in person bought some coins from him as well and certainly can tell you that his intentions are quite honorable.
However, I am a critic of the registry set concept but for a entirely different set of reasons:
They are:
The registry set that is displayed on the internet is alerting others as to what you need to complete your set. Then it makes it..... (1) that much harder and......... (2) that more expensive to complete such set. Now that is not a problem perhaps for type coins sets but for a series the keys could become a serious problem.
I have long believed that registry sets should only be displayed AFTER all the keys bhave been located in the desired grades.
To not do so is only going to cost plenty in youir wallet!!!
I believe this is what has happened with the 1953-S MS-66 FBL Franklin 1932-D MS-66 25c and now the 1936 PR-66 walker.
I have been quietly obtaining the great keys in the high mint state condition and while I don't mind and indeed share with closer friends what I am doing I don't want the world to know what I am doing just yet.
----------------------
No matter where you go,
there you are.
One point that often gets lost in all of this is that for many folks (myself included) the registry is a place to work on a collection while sharing it with others. I have no illusions about every getting in the top XXX of the Mercury sets. I just dont have that kind of money to devote to the hobby. I think this is true for many of us who are on a reasonably small budget.
For the folks who actually compete for the top sets, life is very different and so is their financial standing. I will have to decide how much 16-D I can afford as opposed to locating that choice MS66FB coin. This is true for all the keys for many of us. While we will still compete for certain coins among ourselves, it is all in good spirit and knowing there will be another chance. I doubt we will ever change the price range on a coin.
The deep pockets collectors have to answer a question the rest of us dont. Am I interested in sharing my collection with others or not. If you share your collection, then others will know what you need. This can be good or bad, depending upon your outlook. Is the quest for being number one more important to you than displaying your collection (hopefully with pictures to those of us who only dream of such coins).
By the way, one of my No Bands coins came from Lordmarcovan (Thanks!) to illustrate a point.
Of course, nothing is ever perfect so in time we will change the structure of some sets and hopefully come to a meeting point where most of the collectors are happy with the coins required. If not you atleast have them inventoried.
Oreville- if you don't like people seeing what you need for a Registry set, you have the option of making the set private. (What we call "closing the curtains"). The ranking and grade average are still displayed, but not the individual coins or what you lack.
Take, for example, the High Desert Collection on the 1900-Present Modern Type Set. See? No, you don't. The curtains are closed. There is nothing to click on. High Desert (perhaps for good reason) won't open the curtains and give all us mere mortals a peek at his monster set, despite pleas to the contrary.
Oreville- had I not displayed my set, DeepCoin would not have known that I had a 1939-D MS67 (non-split bands) Merc dime. He need that one for his famous "no bands" collection, and I really needed one with full split bands, so he bought my coin and I was able to get an MS67 FSB with his money and about 25-30 bucks. The coin I ended up with is a bit more common date, but hey, I'm a type collector, so that's cool. I have a higher grade coin and he filled a hole in his Merc set.
Sure, there is bickering and less-than-polite competition here, too, but I have seen far more examples of folks helping each other out on the Registry than the opposite. Once I ended up bidding against another CU forum member (who I didn't really know at first) on eBay, for an early DCAM Memorial cent. He sent me a Private Message explaining why he really needed the coin for his Registry Set, and would be heartbroken to lose the auction, so, being a nice guy, I contacted the seller and explained I would be retracting my bid (and why). The seller (also a member here) said OK, so I retracted and let the other guy win the coin. Again, no big deal because I am a Type guy. If I'd been a Lincoln guy, we'd have had to duke it out.
Markjude- I enjoyed your reminiscenses.
Mark- I'll bet you knew how to spell "avarice" all along. I, on the other hand, just a had a heckuva time with "reminiscenses", and am not sure I got it right.
Braddick- my local dealer still has that AG Huguenot half. He's saving it for me, so it is destined for you... when are you gonna change your ID to "nastycoin"?
-I've had the same experience with bidding on eBay for a coin wanted in a Registry to only find out another member also is chasing after that coin. A couple of emails later plus one mid retraction, and that coin was his.
Another will come along (or, will it? -Haven't seen one yet...).
peacockcoins
<< <i>Oreville, I would disagree about posting coins in the registry sets, at least as far as the Mercury series goes. I actually have people looking for coins that I need and I do the same for them.
OK I AGREE IN PART
One point that often gets lost in all of this is that for many folks (myself included) the registry is a place to work on a collection while sharing it with others. I have no illusions about every getting in the top XXX of the Mercury sets. I just dont have that kind of money to devote to the hobby. I think this is true for many of us who are on a reasonably small budget.
OK I AGREE FOR THE MOST PART.
For the folks who actually compete for the top sets, life is very different and so is their financial standing. I will have to decide how much 16-D I can afford as opposed to locating that choice MS66FB coin. This is true for all the keys for many of us. While we will still compete for certain coins among ourselves, it is all in good spirit and knowing there will be another chance. I doubt we will ever change the price range on a coin.
YOU WOULD BE SURPRISED THAT NOT ALL WHO COMPETE FOR THE TOP SETS WOULD NOT NECESSARILY LIVE ANY DIFFERENT THAN YOU OR ME.
The deep pockets collectors have to answer a question the rest of us dont. Am I interested in sharing my collection with others or not. If you share your collection, then others will know what you need. This can be good or bad, depending upon your outlook. Is the quest for being number one more important to you than displaying your collection (hopefully with pictures to those of us who only dream of such coins).
I BELIEVE SOME TO MANY COLLECTORS STILL BELIEVE IN NOT DISCLOSING THEIR SET FOR A VERY DIFFERENT REASON...THEY ARE CONCERNED ABOUT APPEARING TO BE BOASTFUL.
ALSO MANY COLLECTORS WANT TO JUST COMPLETE THEIR SET (NOT NECESSARILY #1) BEFORE THEY TELL THE WHOLE WORLD WHAT THEY HAVE COMPLETED.
By the way, one of my No Bands coins came from Lordmarcovan (Thanks!) to illustrate a point.
NOW THAT IS A REALLY COOL ENDEAVOR AND THAT IS THE ULTIMATE ANTI FULL BAND COLLECTION AND QUITE FRANKLY POORLY STRUCK OR LATE DIE STATE COINS HAVE EVEN MORE BEAUTIFUL CREAMY WHITE LUSTER AS OPPOSED TO THE SOMETIMES HO-HUM BRILLIANT LUSTER.
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And the Type 2 SLQ that Carl Wolforth is getting I pointed out to him when I had seen it and he posted he needed one on the boards. That one guarantees it will be at least a year before I can pass his Modern set again.
Keith
It sure has been helpful for me to participate. Keith (thanks!) sure is on top of who has what. I've worked out a few trades with fellow Proof Jefferson folks. You can say "check out my set to see if you can upgrade me".
I can see keeping a set in the dark if one is going after those pop 1 coins like our friend pop1 does. I'm not sure what I would do in that case. Anyway I have more than one set and am working mostly on a type set and not going for pop 1 coins so it seems more help than harm for me personally.
<< <i>that I am having a lot of fun here (and let's not forget that that is what it is all about) >>
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For all its flaws (and I believe that PCGS is sincerely trying to make it better), the Registry (and these forums) is (are) the most fun in numismatics today.
Chris