I was audited by the IRS a number of years ago when I had a real job and but was doing some coin dealing on the side. From our first meeting (I insisted on meeting at my accountants office) with the auditor I knew he thought they had me cold!
Fortunately, I was able to produce receipts for every purchase and sale. Not only that, but I was able to account for every deposit made into all of our bank accounts.
I have no sour grapes with the guys that sell on ebay. [ btw - ebay started as a quest to find old peez holders. ] Casual sellers have nothing to worry about, but the guys who make a living selling on ebay and pay nothing in taxes are ripping all of us off.
The long arm of the law .... I'm not an account but I don't think there is any statue of limitations on unreported income.
Don Willis Premium Numismatics, Inc. myurl 800-596-COIN
<< <i>People are only gonna pay so much for a widget, whether there are 2 people selling em or 18 people selling them. >>
Seems you lack a fundamental grasp of economics in general, and eBay in particular.
Russ, NCNE >>
So you think that if the number of sellers with bullion silver eagles goes from 200 to 75 that the price on eBay will double? Perhaps you could forego the punitive response and illustrate your point with a specific example; preferably not a niche or specialized item.
<< <i>The long arm of the law .... I'm not an account but I don't think there is any statue of limitations on unreported income. >>
You're right. There is no SOL for fraud.
Always took candy from strangers Didn't wanna get me no trade Never want to be like papa Working for the boss every night and day --"Happy", by the Rolling Stones (1972)
In responce to a previous post about 1099's . While the bay may be forced to divulge certain sellers and or dollar amounts , I don't see where it's their resposibility or requirement to issue 1099's . There are a myriad of 1099-XXX statements that are generated when money is transferred to a receiving party . Some of the common ones are 1099 B ,1099 DIV , 1099 INT, 1099 R , 1099 MISC etc . These forms report dollar amounts received from stock sales (B) , dividends (DIV) , interest (INT) , pensions(R) and self employment(MISC). It's your money, and becomes taxable when you receive it . Ebay does not 'pay you' . The buyers do . I don't think it's possible for tens of thousands of buyers to send tens of thousands of 1099's to tens of thousands of sellers . Oh yeah , don't forget . There is also a copy to be mailed to the IRS , so that it can be matched up when taxes are filed .
Nickel - not to split hairs, but when you trade stock through your brokerage most often you are buying or selling to another person or firm - not to your broker. Yet at yearend, as you point out, your brokerage is required by law to send you a 1099-B. I really don't see the difference between trading stocks, coins, or peez holders.
As a matter of fact virtually every business is required to generate various 1099s at yearend. It's a costly pain in the a... to us small business owners but is required by law.
I always thought the general intent of IRS regulations was to tax income at every level it is earned. That's why corporations pay tax, shareholders pay tax, employees pay tax, etc. When ebay was a small fry the money was insignificant. Now at over $7 billion a year it's not.
If and when the law is changed to address ebay it may very well encompass all other auction venues.
Don Willis Premium Numismatics, Inc. myurl 800-596-COIN
<< <i>In responce to a previous post about 1099's . While the bay may be forced to divulge certain sellers and or dollar amounts , I don't see where it's their resposibility or requirement to issue 1099's . There are a myriad of 1099-XXX statements that are generated when money is transferred to a receiving party . Some of the common ones are 1099 B ,1099 DIV , 1099 INT, 1099 R , 1099 MISC etc . These forms report dollar amounts received from stock sales (B) , dividends (DIV) , interest (INT) , pensions(R) and self employment(MISC). It's your money, and becomes taxable when you receive it . Ebay does not 'pay you' . The buyers do . I don't think it's possible for tens of thousands of buyers to send tens of thousands of 1099's to tens of thousands of sellers . Oh yeah , don't forget . There is also a copy to be mailed to the IRS , so that it can be matched up when taxes are filed . >>
It was only one suggestion as to what might happen. eBay does take money from you the seller in the form of fees . They keep a running total of what they take from you in fees in much the same way that your employer keeps track of the deductions he takes from you and sends to the appropriate recipient/s. Since the fees eBay gets are in direct relation to your selling price they will also have that info. They may not be required to furnish a 1099, but your account will probably have the info that the IRS wants. They may simply require that eBay make it available.
F the IRS, who would in their right mind pay taxes to a Government when they let George Bush waste your tax dollars. Boycott the IRS Now!! I do every year and will until they catch me.
I know I keep every receipt and note additions for grading, crossover, ... costs. Pathetically, I even have bags of 2x2s with adjust prices written on them as backups. Sometimes it is difficult on a bourse when I get a price for dozens of selected coins. Have to move aside and reprice them all to get it to work out to the total properly. But it make the taxes work out correctly. From things I have heard and the way transactions are conducted, I am not so sure all of the fulltime dealers (and I am certainly not fulltime) declare all of their income. Not sure who and how many, but I seriously doubt all. But to cheat on taxes is cheating your fellow, honest taxpayers.
(I did a bourse and wondered if I was the only cash seller who was actually collecting, reporting, and ultimately paying sales tax.)
<< <i>I may be in error here, but I'm told that there is no tax on unsold inventory. >>
Not a Federal tax, AFAIK.
There is a city imposed tax on same in Houston. 1% of value of stock on hand.
Sure, it's little more than theft. It's much worse on car dealers than coin shops.
We have our liberal, tax raising theif of a Mayor to thank for it.
That's also why property taxes were required to go up even though values have dropped.
"Lenin is certainly right. There is no subtler or more severe means of overturning the existing basis of society(destroy capitalism) than to debauch the currency. The process engages all the hidden forces of economic law on the side of destruction, and it does it in a manner which not one man in a million is able to diagnose." John Marnard Keynes, The Economic Consequences of the Peace, 1920, page 235ff
<< <i>Keep in mind that there is a statute of limitations that limits how far back the IRS can go. It's usually 3 years from the date of filing the return. If the amount underreported is 25% or more of gross income, then it's a 6 year SOL. However, the clock never starts running unless a tax return is actually filed for that year. >>
The IRS can go back 10 years if they decide to and they can make up any reason they want to justify it.
Been there, thanks to an ex-wife. 10 years is the limit, though.
Even if they can prove an 11 year old felony, they can't touch you over it.
Sure, they'll give you a hard time, but after 10 years, you are free and clear of any tax issues.
"Lenin is certainly right. There is no subtler or more severe means of overturning the existing basis of society(destroy capitalism) than to debauch the currency. The process engages all the hidden forces of economic law on the side of destruction, and it does it in a manner which not one man in a million is able to diagnose." John Marnard Keynes, The Economic Consequences of the Peace, 1920, page 235ff
F the IRS, who would in their right mind pay taxes to a Government when they let George Bush waste your tax dollars. Boycott the IRS Now!! I do every year and will until they catch me.
Comments
Fortunately, I was able to produce receipts for every purchase and sale. Not only that, but I was able to account for every deposit made into all of our bank accounts.
I have no sour grapes with the guys that sell on ebay. [ btw - ebay started as a quest to find old peez holders. ] Casual sellers have nothing to worry about, but the guys who make a living selling on ebay and pay nothing in taxes are ripping all of us off.
The long arm of the law .... I'm not an account but I don't think there is any statue of limitations on unreported income.
Premium Numismatics, Inc.
myurl
800-596-COIN
<< <i>
<< <i>People are only gonna pay so much for a widget, whether there are 2 people selling em or 18 people selling them. >>
Seems you lack a fundamental grasp of economics in general, and eBay in particular.
Russ, NCNE >>
So you think that if the number of sellers with bullion silver eagles goes from 200 to 75 that the price on eBay will double? Perhaps you could forego the punitive response and illustrate your point with a specific example; preferably not a niche or specialized item.
<< <i><< People are only gonna pay so much for a widget, whether there are 2 people selling em or 18 people selling them. >>
Seems you lack a fundamental grasp of economics in general, and eBay in particular.
Russ, NCNE >>
So you think that if the number of sellers with bullion silver eagles goes from 200 to 75 that the price on eBay will double? >>
A) I said nothing about bullion.
Russ, NCNE
<< <i>The long arm of the law .... I'm not an account but I don't think there is any statue of limitations on unreported income. >>
You're right. There is no SOL for fraud.
Didn't wanna get me no trade
Never want to be like papa
Working for the boss every night and day
--"Happy", by the Rolling Stones (1972)
to divulge certain sellers and or dollar amounts , I don't see where it's their
resposibility or requirement to issue 1099's . There are a myriad of 1099-XXX
statements that are generated when money is transferred to a receiving
party . Some of the common ones are 1099 B ,1099 DIV , 1099 INT,
1099 R , 1099 MISC etc .
These forms report dollar amounts received from stock sales (B) , dividends
(DIV) , interest (INT) , pensions(R) and self employment(MISC).
It's your money, and becomes taxable when you receive it .
Ebay does not 'pay you' . The buyers do . I don't think it's possible for
tens of thousands of buyers to send tens of thousands of 1099's
to tens of thousands of sellers . Oh yeah , don't forget . There is also
a copy to be mailed to the IRS , so that it can be matched up when
taxes are filed .
As a matter of fact virtually every business is required to generate various 1099s at yearend. It's a costly pain in the a... to us small business owners but is required by law.
I always thought the general intent of IRS regulations was to tax income at every level it is earned. That's why corporations pay tax, shareholders pay tax, employees pay tax, etc. When ebay was a small fry the money was insignificant. Now at over $7 billion a year it's not.
If and when the law is changed to address ebay it may very well encompass all other auction venues.
Premium Numismatics, Inc.
myurl
800-596-COIN
<< <i>In responce to a previous post about 1099's . While the bay may be forced
to divulge certain sellers and or dollar amounts , I don't see where it's their
resposibility or requirement to issue 1099's . There are a myriad of 1099-XXX
statements that are generated when money is transferred to a receiving
party . Some of the common ones are 1099 B ,1099 DIV , 1099 INT,
1099 R , 1099 MISC etc .
These forms report dollar amounts received from stock sales (B) , dividends
(DIV) , interest (INT) , pensions(R) and self employment(MISC).
It's your money, and becomes taxable when you receive it .
Ebay does not 'pay you' . The buyers do . I don't think it's possible for
tens of thousands of buyers to send tens of thousands of 1099's
to tens of thousands of sellers . Oh yeah , don't forget . There is also
a copy to be mailed to the IRS , so that it can be matched up when
taxes are filed . >>
It was only one suggestion as to what might happen. eBay does take money from you the seller in the form of fees . They keep a running total of what they take from you in fees in much the same way that your employer keeps track of the deductions he takes from you and sends to the appropriate recipient/s. Since the fees eBay gets are in direct relation to your selling price they will also have that info. They may not be required to furnish a 1099, but your account will probably have the info that the IRS wants. They may simply require that eBay make it available.
(I did a bourse and wondered if I was the only cash seller who was actually collecting, reporting, and ultimately paying sales tax.)
NSDR - Life Member
SSDC - Life Member
ANA - Pay As I Go Member
<< <i>I may be in error here, but I'm told that there is no tax on unsold inventory. >>
Not a Federal tax, AFAIK.
There is a city imposed tax on same in Houston. 1% of value of stock on hand.
Sure, it's little more than theft. It's much worse on car dealers than coin shops.
We have our liberal, tax raising theif of a Mayor to thank for it.
That's also why property taxes were required to go up even though values have dropped.
John Marnard Keynes, The Economic Consequences of the Peace, 1920, page 235ff
<< <i>Keep in mind that there is a statute of limitations that limits how far back the IRS can go. It's usually 3 years from the date of filing the return. If the amount underreported is 25% or more of gross income, then it's a 6 year SOL. However, the clock never starts running unless a tax return is actually filed for that year. >>
The IRS can go back 10 years if they decide to and they can make up any reason they want to justify it.
Been there, thanks to an ex-wife. 10 years is the limit, though.
Even if they can prove an 11 year old felony, they can't touch you over it.
Sure, they'll give you a hard time, but after 10 years, you are free and clear of any tax issues.
John Marnard Keynes, The Economic Consequences of the Peace, 1920, page 235ff
Good luck with that plan!