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Is this a PSA 10 Molitor? Thoughts?

neilbcpaneilbcpa Posts: 2
in PSA Set Registry Forum
Does this look like a 10 to everyone? I am not crazy about the L/R centering.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=300183005285&ssPageName=STRK:MEWA:IT&ih=020

Comments

  • FavreFan1971FavreFan1971 Posts: 3,103 ✭✭✭
    image
  • shagrotn77shagrotn77 Posts: 5,581 ✭✭✭✭
    Welcome to the boards Neil. What took ya so long?
    "My father would womanize, he would drink. He would make outrageous claims like he invented the question mark. Sometimes he would accuse chestnuts of being lazy. The sort of general malaise that only the genius possess and the insane lament. Our childhood was typical. Summers in Rangoon, luge lessons. In the spring we'd make meat helmets. When we were insolent we were placed in a burlap bag and beaten with reeds - pretty standard really."
  • ldfergldferg Posts: 6,742 ✭✭✭
    yes, looks like a 10. no klutts smudge or smudge at the bottom near the 78 rookie shortstops designation. sweet card.


    Thanks,

    David (LD_Ferg)



    1985 Topps Football (starting in psa 8) - #9 - started 05/21/06
  • ColleSystemColleSystem Posts: 512 ✭✭
    Slight tilt on the bottom. The question to ask is whether or not you would be confident that if you cracked it out, that it would come back a 10. If not, then you might want to pass on it or trade it.

    Scott.
    My sets:
    1977 Topps Star Wars - "Space Swashbucklers"
  • psafanpsafan Posts: 232
    If you crack that out to resubmit, it probably won't get in a holder these days
  • PSASAPPSASAP Posts: 2,284 ✭✭✭
    Why in God's name would anyone crack that card out? To get an 11???!!!
  • cardbendercardbender Posts: 1,831 ✭✭
    Looks like a 10 to my eyes. Centering doesn't have to be perfect 50/50 to receive a 10. L-r looks like it's better than 45/55 and probably close to 47/53, which is fine. It does look like it has a very subtle tilt but that's being ultra nit picky.
  • ldfergldferg Posts: 6,742 ✭✭✭
    i would not be disappointed to have this in my collection.


    Thanks,

    David (LD_Ferg)



    1985 Topps Football (starting in psa 8) - #9 - started 05/21/06
  • AlanAllenAlanAllen Posts: 1,530 ✭✭✭
    No, that's a PSA 10 Trammell image
    No such details will spoil my plans...
  • 19541954 Posts: 2,898 ✭✭✭
    looks like a PSA 10 to me from the scan. I don't have a problem with that centering or tilt.

    Shane
    Looking for high grade rookie cards and unopened boxes/cases
  • blacklabblacklab Posts: 187 ✭✭
    It's a 10.
  • perkdogperkdog Posts: 30,589 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Its a 10! Great card!
  • bigredonebigredone Posts: 93
    #1 Its impossible for anyone to truely be able to evaluate a scan of a card or for that matter a slabbed card in hand. I need to see a card raw. Card Grading has always be subjective and still is. PSA's inconsistant grading as of late has caused me to stop submitting cards to them.


    #2 10 means perfect and YES it does have to have 50/50 centering in my book. Once a card is slabbed centering IS the #1 most visual thing your going to see.


    #3 There is no such thing as a PSA 10. They are all just Mint 9's hiding under a 10 label. The Gem 10 grade was created by third party graders to create a false sense rarity. PSA realized that there is a sucker born every minute. most of them card(label) collector's who will keep spending money resubmitting 9's trying to get 10's. If it's a money card, Mantle, Mays, etc. I can see maybe taking a shot. But PSA makes a bundle off resubmitted common to semi-stars cards. Im a guilty fool myself.

    #4 Question is, do you collect cards or do you collect labels?
    If you collect cards, then I would sell the 10 to some fool willing to pay a ridiculous price just for the sake of moving up in the set Registry.
    For the label collector's it looks good in the registry, but its still just a Mint 9 hiding in a 10 label.
    Then you could use the money to pick up a PSA 9 (Which is all you really had anyway) as well alot of other cards you need.

    #5 If you collect Labels then keep the card. And keep convincing yourself that your 10 is nicer than all of the 9's out there image You can also rest easy knowing that if you had to crack it out of the case and resubmit it odds are in your favor that it will be graded a 10 againimage
  • neilbcpaneilbcpa Posts: 2
    Thank you all for your input.
  • MeteoriteGuyMeteoriteGuy Posts: 7,140 ✭✭
    I think it is a nice card. I would not be upset with it as a 10 in my collection.

    I disagree with most of bigredone's comments. It is not bigredone who decides PSA guides for what a PSA 10 is. And yes, in the recent old school days there was no gem mint, but hey, in the 1940's I doult anyone used the word mint.

    There is a reason why almost every collectible and industry has third party grading or inspection.

    Mark
    Collecting PSA graded Steve Young, Marcus Allen, Bret Saberhagen and 1980s Topps Cards.
    Raw: Tony Gonzalez (low #'d cards, and especially 1/1's) and Steve Young.
  • otwcardsotwcards Posts: 5,291 ✭✭✭
    The card isn't perfect, but regardless of bigredone's standards, PSA's standards do NOT require a GEM MINT 10 to be "perfect," but to fall within a tightly defined and specific level of tolerence.

    My concern would be that the tilt and the slightly, non-parallel top to bottom borders, suggest that perhaps the card may have come off a sheet and is perhaps asymmetrical. It's also possible there is some distortion in the image that could represent the appearence that illicits this assumption.

    In any respect, it's a very solid grade and given what is visible in the scan, there isn't much to suggest that it isn't "10" worthy.

    To address some of the other statements, I doubt that there is ANY PSA 10 of a standard cardboard stock card that any of us would crack out and be 100% certain that it would grade a PSA 10 again if resubmitted. There's always that fickle finger of fate and subjective judgement we have to worry about.
  • jmbkb4jmbkb4 Posts: 2,963


    << <i>If you crack that out to resubmit, it probably won't get in a holder these days >>



    DBH!!!

    DBH!!!

    DBH!!!
  • jmbkb4jmbkb4 Posts: 2,963
    link
  • WinPitcherWinPitcher Posts: 27,726 ✭✭✭
    yes i think it fits the PSA standard for a 10. Does it fit mine? NO

    Is it worth 2000.00? Not to me (unless I'm selling)


    Nice card


    Steve
    Good for you.
  • bigredonebigredone Posts: 93
    "I disagree with most of bigredone's comments. It is not bigredone who decides PSA guides for what a PSA 10 is "

    So its some PSA God(employee) who decides. With the amount of cards that must flow through PSA, I sometimes wonder exactly where they find all these "Grading experts" I will stick with my 30+ years of hobby experience to decide what I put in my collection. You can have the "New PSA hourly Employee"


    "There is a reason why almost every collectible and industry has third party grading or inspection"

    That reason being that Grading has been, and always will be subjective. Third party grading will not change that. Then there's the real reason....... MONEY Baby!


    " The card isn't perfect, but regardless of bigredone's standards, PSA's standards do NOT require a GEM MINT 10 to be "perfect," "

    uh...... EXCUSE ME! THe very meaning of "GEM MINT 10 " implies Perfection! There would be no other reason to have the grade.



    Collect the card, Not the label. 10's are fools gold.
  • jmbkb4jmbkb4 Posts: 2,963


    << <i>If you crack that out to resubmit, it probably won't get in a holder these days >>



    Idiotic, cliche comment.

    dabighurt!!
  • theczartheczar Posts: 1,590 ✭✭
    bigredone,

    so i guess you have no graded cards in your collection?

    in reality it is a PSA employee who decides (i denote a elitist tone toward hourly workers) what goes in a PSA slab. regardless of there FLSA designation i would hope that the great portion of them are professional and take their jobs seriously.

    none of us are perfect and beauty is in the eye of the beholder and buyer. there is also a sense of comfort knowing a graded card is not counterfeit, trimmed etc.

    it is easy for people to throw stones at company's that have found a successful nitch in the market.

    psa has many money making adventures. they are not for everyone but the registry program seems quite popular.

    maybe you should start bigredone's grading service and see how that works out. with 30+ years of hobby experience i am sure people will be beating down your door for your expertise.

  • otwcardsotwcards Posts: 5,291 ✭✭✭


    << <i>" The card isn't perfect, but regardless of bigredone's standards, PSA's standards do NOT require a GEM MINT 10 to be "perfect," "

    uh...... EXCUSE ME! THe very meaning of "GEM MINT 10 " implies Perfection! There would be no other reason to have the grade. >>



    Third party grading is not the end-all solution, but pompous blowhards that act as if there opinion IS the end-all thought and strut their XYZ years of hobby experience probably couldn't tell the difference between a inked up 1971 Topps or a dummy Yellow Team 1958 Hank Aaron. Hell, I think one might be hard pressed to know the difference between Tommie Aaron and Tommy Aaron.

    Please share with me ANYWHERE that GEM MINT 10 claims to be perfect? Or is this just your assumed implication? Directly from the PSA standard definition:

    << <i>A PSA Gem Mint 10 card is a virtually perfect card. Attributes include four perfectly sharp corners, sharp focus and full original gloss. A PSA Gem Mint 10 card must be free of staining of any kind, but an allowance may be made for a slight printing imperfection, if it doesn't impair the overall appeal of the card. The image must be centered on the card within a tolerance not to exceed approximately 55/45 to 60/40 percent on the front, and 75/25 percent on the reverse. >>



    The definition clearly states VIRTUALLY and specifically states the parameters of acceptable allowance. The fact that you choose to differ with this and most other aspects of grading begs me to question what your real issue is? Your bitterness sounds more like that of a "hobby vet" who submitted his best cards, all PERFECT in his opinion, and got "screwed" by the graders when everything came back PSA 6-8...

    In any respect, I do agree that there are some obscenely outrageous prices paid for grades that a card may not necessarily have warranted. At that point, it becomes the concern of the end user on how much they will pay for such an item. Who are you or I to tell someone else how to spend their money?!?!?
  • theczartheczar Posts: 1,590 ✭✭
    ...The fact that you choose to differ with this and most other aspects of grading begs me to question what your real issue is? Your bitterness sounds more like that of a "hobby vet" who submitted his best cards, all PERFECT in his opinion, and got "screwed" by the graders when everything came back PSA 6-8...

    give that man a cigar for that quote. you hit the nail on the head.

    big red probably had a store, mail order business or set up at shows (or a combination of the three) and can no longer push off EX and NR-MT cards as anything other than that. Thirty years ago no one cared about centering. Four sharp corners, slap a mint price tag on it and away we go.

    fast forward and someone has attempted to standardize the industry and has pushed those with inferior products to the curb. they see what PSA 9's and 10's are commanding and their PSA 7 (OC) makes them very BITTER!

    guess what? there are a handful of people who have connections, scour the market place for beautiful raw products and are the leaders of the industry when it comes to top grade merchandise.

    of course not everyone is loaded and there is a strong niche for nice mid-grade vintage cards. i support all collectors whatever they can afford for their hobby. but as a buyer quickly recognizes that, some sellers cannot.

    they think their product are sax 5th avenue, when they really are big lots or family dollar. (i love big lots and family dollar btw)
  • ColleSystemColleSystem Posts: 512 ✭✭
    I actually think that bigredone brings up some very good points. PSA 10s do seem a bit weak IMHO. I have gotten 10s back before that I have resold and kept my better looking 9s on more than one occasion. Usually, it is because of focus and registration issues. In my experience, I have had a much easier time getting a card in a PSA 10 holder than a SGC 98 holder. I couldn't even imagine getting an SGC 100 holder.
    My sets:
    1977 Topps Star Wars - "Space Swashbucklers"
  • ColleSystemColleSystem Posts: 512 ✭✭
    theczar has some great points to in regards to the psa graders. The selling point for PSA graders is that they are -THIRD PARTY-. One doesn't need to have been looking at cards for decades to understand what a mint or Gem mint card is. The real selling point for PSA is that they are a neutral party.
    My sets:
    1977 Topps Star Wars - "Space Swashbucklers"
  • WinPitcherWinPitcher Posts: 27,726 ✭✭✭
    The real selling point for PSA is that they are a neutral party.


    That, and the registry.


    Steve
    Good for you.
  • grote15grote15 Posts: 29,690 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Well within the guidelines for a PSA 10. Not a perfect card, but I've seen worse in a 10 holder.


    Collecting 1970s Topps baseball wax, rack and cello packs, as well as PCGS graded Half Cents, Large Cents, Two Cent pieces and Three Cent Silver pieces.
  • onlyanumberonlyanumber Posts: 2,433
    No smudge on the card also helps...Looks like one of the nicest Molitor/Trammells I've ever seen...
    Next MONTH? So he's saying that if he wins, the best-case scenario is that he'll be paying for it two weeks after the auction ends?

    Forget blocking him; find out where he lives and go punch him in the nuts. --WalterSobchak 9/12/12



    image


    Looking for Al Hrabosky and any OPC Dave Campbells (the ESPN guy)
  • StingrayStingray Posts: 8,843 ✭✭✭


    << <i>Well within the guidelines for a PSA 10. Not a perfect card, but I've seen worse in a 10 holder. >>



    Agreed, this is within the standards of a 10, take a look at the 1990 Leaf Thomas that was in the Oct. 07 SMR article. Now that is a low end 10!!
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