OT Liteside Colonial counterfeits any value? PICS

Rickc300

These 3 "coins" were brought into a local coin shop by a customer and I took photos of them to try and find out some information on them for the owner. I took these pics with lousy lighting conditions so I apologise for the quality or lack there of of the pics, fluorecent lighting and coins do not make for good color shots... Anyway, Is there any demand for these? Where do I find out a value or if they are modern fakes or contemporary counterfeits? Thanks in advance for your help!
Rick
This one looks and rings like silver. Weighs in at .210 troy ounces.


Again, appears to be silver and weighs .225 Troy OZ


Last one is this one: Weighs .175 OZ (troy) and is made of some sort of pot metal and copper coated. You can see where some of the copper sheeting has come off revealing the pot metal.

ASUtodd

The first one you have is a NE (New England) Shilling. These were made around 1652. Book price, if real, goes for about 40,000 according to the 2008 Red Book...
The second appears to be a variety of the 1783 Constelatio.. ALTHOUGH, in looking through the book I do not see ANY with the humber 1000 on them and the U.S looks a little suspect compared to these. They book for around 110 -3745 VG 2008 Red book.

The third is a 1788 Mass Cent. There are two varieties, one with a period of Massachusetts and one without, your has the dot so it books at 100 VG 2008 Red book.

As far as telling they are fake...well I cna't help too much there. Maybe with this knowledge you can find other pics of these coins and compare.
Todd

Devman

Hi Rick,

Unfortunately, these three coins are all counterfeits. The first is indeed a New England shilling imitation piece that appears to be a cast copy from an authentic piece. Probably 19th century origin, but very possibly later as well.

The next issue is a Nova Constellatio piece that has been cast from cheap imitation dies. More or less, a copy of a copy.

The last is a Massachusetts copper piece that is an electrotype. You can tell by the split around the rim and the actual base metal coming through the surfaces where the plating didn't completely cover it.

Hope this helps.

DH

ASUtodd

Devman, was I right on with the coins ID's? Also in looking through my books I never found a Constelatio that had a 1000 on it.... ANy idea why?
Todd

Devman

The coin ID's were fine. In regards to the Nova Constellatio piece, try looking under the pattern set that was struck of these dated 1783. It was a pattern set that was made to demonstrate a denomination system based on 100's and finally 1000. This is the same set that came out of Garrett I in 1979, was offered later by Stack's at a fixed price I believe in 1993.

As far as values of the counterfeits, there is a small pocket of collectors that do collect contemporary counterfeits and 19th century electrotypes, but it is a very small group. These pieces serve well as far as novelty purposes are concerned, but I would value these at no more than a few dollars a piece.

Rickc300

Thanks for the input! I knew they were cast copies, but I was wondering about any possible value. Some counterfeits have a niche all there own and I was hoping these may fall into one of those slots... I wouldn't mind having them for myself but I think the seller is going to want more than a couple of bucks each.

I have collected a few counterfeits over the years, mainly ones made to pass at the time of issue. Unlike the modern replicas trying to dupe collectors. I have a gold plated "V" nickel that was passed enough times to wear the plating down on the high points revealing the real copper nickel coin underneath. I have turned down an offer of 100 bucks for that one. It is worth more as a conversation piece at a coin show to me... You should see the looks of dealers when I say I have a five dollar Liberty gold piece I want to sell; I know it is a five dollar piece because of the big Roman numeral V on the back... LOL, simple minds, simple pleasures...

Thanks for the help,
Rick