Once collected modern but switched to vintage? Why?

elsnorto

Like many of you, my involvement and interests within this hobby has changed considerably over the years. I once collected everything... then just football building sets... then I was a player collector... then I dabbled in the hobby as a (side) business... and now I focus on memoraibilia and vintage football.

I was thinking of the reasons for this, specifically my migration towards vintage and was curious why others who have made the same move did so.

For me it was many factors. While I always had an apprecation for vintage:

#1 Cost. I did not have the scratch, but have been very fortunate in my career and have much more expendable income now.

#2 Access. Before the internet it was much more difficult to come by vintage material. Conversely, if modern is your thing you can go to card shows, card shops, or even Walmart.

#3 Confidence. I was reluctant to buy vintage out of concern for counterfeit or altered cards. Grading companies such as PSA have made me much more confident in this regard and helped standardize condition and thus market value.

#4 Disgruntlement. General disappointment with the modern stuff due to too much product, skyrocketing prices with too little bang for the buck, and the vast majority of modern stuff does not hold its value.

Again, I always had an appreciation for vintage stuff, but I must say I find the simple charm and history involved to be much more of a factor now and today for some reason... perhaps a direct reaction to what the modern hobby has become.

Anyone else care to share their reason(s) for moving from modern to vintage?

Snorto~

rube26105

most modern is garbage compared to vintage anything in my opinion, they just dont make em like they did in 30's thru 50's,new cards cost wad and most of the time u get nothing,i was sick of buying boxes with 1 or 2 packs in em and getting zilch for 100.00 a pack- only modern i like is allen and ginter,rest of it is good firestarter
randy

elsnorto

Rube, I don't know about all modern being garbage. It's a matter of taste and I don't bag on those who get their enjoyment out of modern stuff. Honestly, I do miss cracking wax and every now and again will pick up a box of something to satisfy that urge. But like you said, I got tired of opening high priced wax and being able to get maybe 25% return on my investment if I sold everything in it. Hold onto it for any period of time and that 25% is likely going to slip considerably as the newer, latest and greatest, stuff hits. Vintage, conversely, seems to be a much better investment... at the very least it does not decrease dramatically as a whole. Of course "investment" is a dangerous term to use for any hobby as it could all go away... modern and vintage values alike.

Snorto~

vintagetoppsguy

My card collection is an investment! There I said it. Some people think that is a bad way to look at it like it's a dirty word, but that's what it is. That doesn't mean that it can't be fun. When I first come to realize that it was an investment is the time my focus shifted to vintage. I wanted something that would hold (and appreciate) it's value. I agree with Snorto, I can go buy a $100 box of newer wax to open and it might have a book value of $25.00 after I bust it or I can go buy a nice '54 Topps Duke Snider (or whatever) for about the same price that will continue to gain value over time. And like he also pointed out, that $25.00 box of cards will decrease over time as newer and newer stuff comes out.

I used to collect everything - baseball, foootball, new, vintage, autographs, etc. Let's focus on just the autographs. Take a guy like Troy Aikman who is only is only 40 years old and already a member of the NFL HOF. Say he signs 10,000 autographs a year and let's also say he live to be 72 (another 32 years), that's is 320,000 autographs that he will sign and do you ever think they will really be worth anything? No, becasue the supply will far exceeed the demand. That is why I focus on vintage so that my collection will actually be worth something and hold it's value. They can continue to put out new product and these players can continue to whore out their signature, but they aren't making any more vintage!

rube26105

i bought boxes of ud esquistite for 100$ a box,had one pack in each box,opened em, 50cents worth of cards,same thing with basketball boxes with 2 packs in a box shaped like a traingle, rookie threads maybe, 2 packs nothing, im done with high price junk,i couldnt get a good pull froma pack anymore if my life depended on it,but i do like A & G ,thats it
ill just keep upgrading my 50 bowman fb set-they arent making those anymore and they get harder to find all the time!
nothing wil ever top the looks of old goudeys/playball/sportkings/certain bowmans,some of em design kinda stunk,53-54 bow fb come to mind,-they just dont make stuff like that anymore, all they want is big time $ margin-2007 topps is so original baseball/fb/and basketball all are the same design,talk about getting cheap lol,thats pathetic-not like they're down to their last buck or anything-i love modern,just aint playing their stupid games anymore, i always lose lol
randy
p.s. my sediments exactly vintage!!they arent making the old stuff anymore!!!!!!

OAKESY25

I always wanted the cards of the legends like mantle and clemente when I was a kid... but was always out of reach...
they are much more scarce then modern issues and I feel like I am holding a piece of history...

drewsef

<< <i>They can continue to put out new product and these players can continue to whore out their signature, but they aren't making any more vintage! >>



Sorry, but that is completely wrong to blame the players for making what they can while they can, a good percentage of those players won't be in the NFL for more than 3 years, and for the veterans, what's so wrong with making some extra money with no guarantee of being physically able to sustain a good life after the NFL? And for the retired NFL greats who, a great many, gave their body to the NFL and have nothing to show for it, so they aren't supposed to try to get some financial help either?

It's the card companies that are whoring their product to mass production and insert,game used mania and people who continue to buy it are just as responsible as anyone. Each major company should be held to one cheap, one mid-grade, one high end, and one historical(like Heritage,etc..) set per year.

vintagetoppsguy

<< <i>Sorry, but that is completely wrong to blame the players for making what they can while they can >>



I think you missed the point. By no means am I blaming the players, as I would do the same thing if I were in their place. After all, look at a guy like Bob Feller who probably makes more today signing his name than he ever did as a player. My point is, "Will it ever be worth anything in the future?" and my answer is NO because there will be too much of it and supply will far exceed demand.

killingdream

I never exclusively focused on modern. Even when I was a 9 year old in 1979 I was buying fifties and sixties stuff right along with the current 79 Topps. I am 100% vintage focused now because the modern card market disgusts me. There is just way too much product out there and of course most of it is grossly over priced. In addition the insert thing is way out of hand. Once again there are just way too many and the prices that many are going for are outrageous. The game used inserts especially turn me off. Cutting up rare documents , jerseys , bats , etc. to make a cheesy modern card just disgusts me. And how do you know that piece of jersey or bat actually came from who they said it did ? There is absolutely no way of verifying this other than taking some guys word. Even if the stuff really is what they say it is just think how many slivers of bat or jersey they can get out of one item. Hundreds !

TheCARDKid

I've gone back and forth alot.

When I was a kid in the early 90's (still a kid!), my collection was 85% modern, maybe 15% vintage (two goudeys, some 50's and 60's).

Now days, I don't think I'll be buying much of anything post 92 or 93. I want to get some of the basketball subsets from that year that I couldn't afford back then (draft redemption, beam team, magics all rookie). And a few other sets.

And then fill in the 80's.

Then vintage and pre war.

Among my reasons...

-They aren't making anymore.

-Professional grading is well established and trusted. Contrary to other opinions (i.e. net 54, which has a huge anti-psa bias), I trust PSA more than I would buying raw cards from dealers 10 years ago. Look through an SCD from 1995 or 96 and think about buying the raw cards listed. It'd be scary! You're taking your life in your own hands.

Look at all the cards that use to be "nr mint", "gem mint" (i.e. mr mint auctions) and compare it to the population numbers now. Geez...no comparison. There will be problems with the grading standards, doctored cards. You have to be realistic about it. But the pop numbers have been extremely stable for at least a decade now. You aren't going to see ten PSA 10's 52 Mantles appear next week. The trust factor is important before you make a big commitment.

-Be fun to collect, fun to get in the mail. Fun to look forward to. That's what counts.

stitzen

Why do people insist on generalizing modern with game used?

There is plenty of modern stuff that isn't based on game used stuff. The Topps Heritage is a fantastic set of which only a tiny portion is game used cards, the rest is a fantastic homage to the past while focusing on current players. To say all modern is garbage is a gross overgeneralization of product.

Seems the people saying modern is bad are those who focus more on value of cards and less on collecting.

drewsef

<< <i>

<< <i>Sorry, but that is completely wrong to blame the players for making what they can while they can >>



I think you missed the point. By no means am I blaming the players, as I would do the same thing if I were in their place. After all, look at a guy like Bob Feller who probably makes more today signing his name than he ever did as a player. My point is, "Will it ever be worth anything in the future?" and my answer is NO because there will be too much of it and supply will far exceed demand. >>



must have, but I agree completely. While I think it's cool to own an authentic autograph from a favorite player or great player, there is a really low ceiling I am willing to go to pay for such an item.

On that note, there are just too many instances of people paying crazy money for the modern stuff. There are too many to even name but one that comes to mind because he's off to such a hot start is Tony Romo. His autographed SP Authentic rookie in PSA 10 is at $600 plus with 2 days left, or you can have a Marino,Montana, and Elway rookie, all in PSA 9, or any other combination of proven great NFL players.

killingdream

<< <i>Why do people insist on generalizing modern with game used?

There is plenty of modern stuff that isn't based on game used stuff. The Topps Heritage is a fantastic set of which only a tiny portion is game used cards, the rest is a fantastic homage to the past while focusing on current players. To say all modern is garbage is a gross overgeneralization of product.

Seems the people saying modern is bad are those who focus more on value of cards and less on collecting. >>




I agree that Heritage is a nice product but it is still too pricey for me. I'd rather spend the cash on the sixties sets that I am working on. I'd honestly rather buy a handful of 66 high number commons than a box of heritage.

vintagetoppsguy

It will be interesting to see where that Romo card ends up. I agree with you, I can think of much better cards to spend my money on rather than some guy who although is very promising, has not proven himself yet.

Stone193

As a collector for many, many years...

If ya collect what ya like and gives ya satisfaction and

STAY on budget - it's just plain fun!

Whether for investment or shear enjoyment - or both - it's all good IMO.

mike

rube26105

very true, i guarantee ya the 4 negro leaguer guys are making more $ now off autos in the allen & ginter set than they ever did when they played,one of em told me he made 300.00 a month at his height-they played for love of game,now they play for big contracts and endorsments,old timers have more intergrity than all the high priced dudes they have in all the sports today,its not either one of the generations fault though,its just the times have changed,unforturately the old timers missed it,sacrificed their bodies,and get no pensions like they do now,they just got the shaft-like sammy baugh of skins in a nursing home in tx and red murff of braves in a nursing home, on his deathbed,but still took the time to sign for me,
randy

artimus

red murff of braves in a nursing home, on his deathbed,but still took the time to sign for me,

did you really ask a guy on his deathbed for an autograph?........

rube26105

well...-i didnt know he was in a nursing home, shows some guts actually,still cares about fans,nurse said he was just happy to get some fan mail, alot of these guys are forgotten unfortunately
thats the difference inbetween generations,old guys who are less popular love to sign,i dont know how many negro leagers ive gotten that are just happy somebody remebers them
be nice art-ive sold u stuff lmao!
Randy

BigDaddyBowman

Four things have led me to switch from collecting newer cards to collecting vintage:
1) Being a former history teacher, I always had a love of history....tie that with my love of football and there ya go.
2) The movie and corresponding book "75 Seasons" (of the NFL) really ignited the passion. This led me to becoming a recreational football historian.
3) Getting my first "real job" as a teacher and eventually becoming an A.D.....these allowed me the financial means to support my passion of vintage football.
4) "Losing my vintage virginity." My first vintage cards were a 48 Bowman Waterfield rookie and a 50 Bowman Baugh. Once you own a vintage card..there is NO turning back! Yes, I agree its pretty pathetic to compare losing your virginity to buying a football card.

Reese3333

I collected modern basketball for a long time. It just seemed to me, that every product being released had a Jordan autograph or Lebron James autograph. They are flooding the market with these autographed cards, and people are paying hundreds of dollars for something that isn't rare at all. I started picking up some of the tougher HOF vintage autographs for practically nothing. I still collect some of the modern stuff, but focusing on vintage is my goal now.

Reese

metalmike

My collecting is focused primarily on the Cinncinnati Reds. My secondary focus is printing errors. Even though most of the errors from the 80's and 90's were "created" aka backdoored by the printing/ card companies some of the printing errors from the 60's/70's are quite rare. Vintage Wrong backs and Blank backs, ect command a premium although most grading companies ignore this niche.