Do you have a grading reference set for your prime focus?

TwoKopeiki

Back when I received my first grades from PCGS, I decided to start putting together a photo set of graded 8 Reales to better understand what each grading company takes in consideration when assigning a grade. I have separated those into mints and now slowly finding graded pieces to add to this set.

Once I've build it up to a few hundred images, I am planning to start comparing the grading companies to get a better feel for the "grade spread" between a single grade in each of the grading companies, as well as between different grading companies. So far PCGS looks to be stricter than NGC when it comes to portrait 8 Reales. However, there are a few obvious "outliers" that makes me wonder what I am not picking-up in the images, like this one, for example:

PCGS 45 which looks like a VF from the images




Is this just a poorly imaged weak strike? I mean the knot on Carlos's cape is barely visible, as well as "U" and "L" on the pillars on the reverse, not counting the lack of detail on the lions and crown...

Also, if you happen to have images of slabbed portrait 8 Reales - please post 'em or e-mail 'em to me at Roman.Martyn@gmail.com

Is this a futile exercise, since images are often not a good representation of the coin, or does it make sense to anyone else?

spoon

It definitely makes sense. Even with the faults of photo grading, if we look at enough pictures some common characteristics are bound to pop out.

Incidentally, this is one of the goals of the site that I'm (still!) working on.

Hussulo

That’s a great idea Roman. I would love to see your findings once yo complete them.
I see what you mean. Looking at the pictures I can't see how that coin received an EF grade. It might be better in hand though and I must add although I admire 8R's I don't collect them so it may be an EF for its type/mint.
Personally going off the pictures (which probably aren't very accurate) I would say US VF, British F (barely).

TwoKopeiki

Hus, I've encountered a number of raw Potosi 8 Reales that were either broadstruck, or struck on tapered (varying thickness) planchets, so definitely not ruling-out that possibility. I'm planning to send a couple of pieces like that with my next submission to see how PCGS handles it.

theboz11

Previous findings have concluded that all TPC's are inconsistent across the board. Some just more than others

worldcoinguy

Interesting topic. There must be more to the story on that PCGS 8 reales piece in regards to mint, strikes, planchets, dies, etc, because it sure looks VF to the nonprofessional like myself. I would be quite disappointed if I bought that one "sight unseen" assuming that I could rely on the holder. I know....I know... I know......."buy the coin not the plastic".

bosox

koincollect

A grading reference set for world coins might not be the ultimate reference as it would just highlight what a coin grade would be like and does not take into account the intricacies off the series we are collecting. This is due to the fact that the world graders are not specialized in these as they are in the US series which have been fairly documented for grading purposes. I do not have specific examples from the US series but there are many coins which due to the minting process/die quality/planchet types/other variables at a particular facility grade differently than similar looking pieces from others! Just my 2c.

Doogy

<< <i>A grading reference set for world coins might not be the ultimate reference as it would just highlight what a coin grade would be like and does not take into account the intricacies off the series we are collecting. This is due to the fact that the world graders are not specialized in these as they are in the US series which have been fairly documented for grading purposes. I do not have specific examples from the US series but there are many coins which due to the minting process/die quality/planchet types/other variables at a particular facility grade differently than similar looking pieces from others! Just my 2c. >>




yeah, i think i agree with your sentiment. The US collectors have gotten every last detail down to the excrutiating bone of it, such as die types/cracks, et cetera (look at Morgan VAM collectors, for instance!). I think it would be much harder to do this, and to find research on a darkside coin series, especially one series like this that tends to display more crude minting technology than other coins of the time (US and European coinage, for instance). I would hazard a guess that both PCGS and NGC aren't all that consistant with a series like this grading wise, because of all of these variables, many of them not previously documented. just my 2 shillings

lordmarcovan

What is this "prime focus" concept of which you speak?

D'you mean to suggest that there are actually people out there who can focus on ONE specialty of numismatics, and stick with it?

coinkat

what LordM said... but I will add the following:

Understanding grading is truly a combined talent of many components and the learning process really never ends until one stops collecting.

MrEureka

Do you have a grading reference set for your prime focus?

Since I don't grade the coins in my collection, I certainly don't need a "reference set". I just buy what I like.