Scored some great color on this 1840 half dime, but..***Updated, large pics****....
Rob41281
Posts: 2,401 ✭✭✭✭✭
Picked this up on ebay last week, took a chance on the color being better in hand, which it definatly is. however, it appears it got a grade bump for the color, doesnt appear to be a 58 to me. Better bigger pics have now been posted.sellers pics are first.
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Nice coin.
http://www.ebay.com/sch/rs8199/m.html?_nkw=&_armrs=1&_ipg=&_from=
<< <i>pretty coins typically require a slight "premium" -- and are worth it. >>
<< <i>pretty coins typically require a slight "premium" -- and are worth it. >>
My thoughts exactly.
http://www.ebay.com/sch/rs8199/m.html?_nkw=&_armrs=1&_ipg=&_from=
http://www.ebay.com/sch/rs8199/m.html?_nkw=&_armrs=1&_ipg=&_from=
To attribute the obverse dies for the Liberty Seated half dimes, we look at several positional relationships that will not appreciably change over the use of the die. These include the Shield Line position (the alignment of the right side of the upright of the 1 with the pales of the shield, numbered 1-10 from left to right), the Shield Point relative to the date numerals below, and the center of each date numeral relative to the dentils below. For the 1840 ND half dimes, the Shield Point proves to be the most useful to us in this case. The shield point is directly over the center of the 8 in the date for the V2 and V3, it is over the left side of the 8 for the V1, V4, and V6, and it is over the right side of the 8 only for the V5. On your coin, I believe that we can see the shield point over the right side of the 8, making it a V5.
To confirm this, we can look at the date numerals relative to the dentils below. For the V5, the 1 is centered over the right half of a dentil, the 8 is centered slightly right of the center of a dentil, the upright of the 4 is centered over a dentil, and the 0 is centered over a space between dentils. With the coin in hand, you are better able to make these determinations, but from what I can see your coin agrees with these diagnostics, taken from enlargements of the Valentine plates and from confirmed examples of the V5 in my reference collection.
It is nearly impossible to attribute the reverse die, as all devices and letters were part of the hub, making all reverse dies essentially identical, at least until repeated use caused them to fatigue or break. But lacking any die state deterioration on your coin, we can only assume that it is the same reverse die pictured for the Valentine V5.
So from that analysis, I believe your coin to be an example of the Valentine V5. I have found the V5 to be somewhat difficult to locate above VF grade, and extremely difficult to locate in beautifully toned AU-58, such as your coin. I recently sold a nice, original EF-40 example of the V5, at the ANA - Milwaukee, to Lynn Ourso, which is still in his inventory, as listed here, if anyone is interested:
http://www.neworleansrarecoins.com/halfdimes.htm
I was hoping that your coin would turn out to be either a V1 or V2, both of which I am seeking to upgrade, and both of which I have found to be very difficult above EF-40.
Should you be seeking a nice home for your 1840 ND V5, I would be pleased to offer it a nice home with many of her friends.
I hope this helps.
Fortunately the seller was told by a dealer expert that the cracks were not "strong" enough to be worth much. While that may ultimately be true, it didn't cost me anything extra. And besides, I thought the cracks were plenty bold. If I had to pay extra money for all my seated coins that had die cracks, it would be hopeless!
roadrunner
From your description, your MS-64 coin is an example of the Valentine V6, in very late die state (VLDS). It is described and pictured in the Valentine 1931 reference, and is perhaps one of the most severely shattered obverse dies in the Liberty Seated half dime series. I have never seen an early die state, or perfect obverse die, without the bisecting die crack for the V6. The late die state you describe is quite scarce, with the horizontal die crack which intersects the vertical die crack, and extends to the right. There is an even later die state, with another die crack which intersects the vertical die crack and extends to the left, effectively quartering the obverse die.
I have ten (10) examples of the V6 in my reference collection, but only one as you describe, and just one in the later die state, with the quartered obverse die.
Great pics of a great coin.
my bid is 225...lol....just kiddin
Al
This got me thinking of a cracked obv MS67 1840 half dime that appeared in Goldberg's June 2002 LB sale. It was an excellent coin quality-wise so it has been engrained in my memory ever since.
The coin was listed as a LDS V-2, which seems to be erroneous based on your discussion above. Probably the V6. The coin had a heavy crack from 12 to 6:00 going through the 8 of the date. And a faint crack heading towards 3:00 from the center of the other one.
From my crude drawing in the catalog, the east-west crack only went partially into the right obv field. Though I could have missed a fainter line going all the way to the rim. Regardless, it was a great ND type coin. That LB sale had a large number of great MS half dimes for sale. A fellow forum member told me how he paid very strong for one of the branch mint coins, and did receive a 2 point upgrade via an ogh holder. I consider this sale to be the last great ogh holdered auction for seated material. From half dimes to halves, Goldbergs had a great sale. And in hindsight, it was even better than I had thought. There were dozens of neat coins that have since doubled or tripled in price from that sale. It also had the only full head 1842-0 half dime I'd ever seen (PCGS MS65 new holder). I recall when Heritage broke a hoard of "gem" flat heads
(5 pieces?) back in the mid-80's. Those are still around today in MS64 holders.
FYI Legend bought that V6 LDS 1840 MS67 (ogh) coin for stock at $5700.
roadrunner
President, Racine Numismatic Society 2013-2014; Variety Resource Dimes; See 6/8/12 CDN for my article on Winged Liberty Dimes; Ebay
That was in 2002? I know the cataloger for the Goldbergs during that period. I will have to speak to him.
A photo is worth 1000 words. This from the above mentioned 2002 June Long Beach sale.
roadrunner