my first 09 SVDB
Batman23
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My very first post... ever...
I just got this 1909 S VDB cent, my first! I was wanting to see the experts think about it.
I just got this 1909 S VDB cent, my first! I was wanting to see the experts think about it.
0
Comments
AL
Welcome here.....
little dark pics, but nice otherwise.
Too many positive BST transactions with too many members to list.
Did you buy that coin raw? Is it certified? Do you have experience with this often couterfeited/doctored coin?
Made you look! Made you look! Just kidding
Nice coin and welcome!
Recipient of the coveted "You Suck" award, April 2009 for cherrypicking a 1833 CBHD LM-5, and April 2022 for a 1835 LM-12, and again in Aug 2012 for picking off a 1952 FS-902.
What are the diagnostics for the 1909 S VDB?
This is one of those coins that you always want as a kid and finally found some cash to get one. I think I did all right but figured I would see what you say before locking him away with his buddies more many years.
If it were mine I would get it graded, it's worth the money just so you won't be nervous whenever you read about fakes. From the looks it should get a nice grade.
Also if there is a problem you can get back to the seller before a lot of time passes.
Looks like a nice coin too.
I LIKE IT~!
Enjoy.
May I ask where you bought the coin from?
-Paul
<< <i>Welcome!
If it were mine I would get it graded, it's worth the money just so you won't be nervous whenever you read about fakes. From the looks it should get a nice grade.
Also if there is a problem you can get back to the seller before a lot of time passes.
Looks like a nice coin too. >>
I would have it in to PCGS next week if I had another four coins to meet the five coin minimum... I will have to wait... a long time...
I like the look of the coin, just a little something around "united" on the reverse. You can see it in the scan much better than in hand.
<< <i>Welcome!
What are the diagnostics for the 1909 S VDB? >>
For one, hit the mint mark with a credit card and see if it omes off. You have to see if there is a seam between the mintmark and the coin.
Congrats on a nice coin. It's definietly one that most collectors aspire to have (including me!)
--Christian
Welcome aboard brother, how you?
Brother, I must say, if the s-vdb is your very first coin, then you are starting off with a heavy stroke. What are you going to do for an encore?
<< <i>Welcome aboard brother, how you?
Brother, I must say, if the s-vdb is your very first coin, then you are starting off with a heavy stroke. What are you going to do for an encore? >>
This is not my first "coin", but it it my first 09SVDB. I have almost all his buddies, missing the 14-d. It only took me 15 years to get this one... I think that this IS the encore... Hope I am wrong tho
I just wish my 09svdb looked as nice as Speety's. VERY NICE!!
The reason I would get it graded is there's so many ways they faked these.
added mintmark (might fall off with a nudge or acetone)
die struck fakes (most have a depression on lower O of ONE)
cast fakes (might have some bumps)
Some diagnostics of real ones are a die gouge along the rim between RU of TRUST or a die chip in the upper inside of the B of LIBERTY. But there are 4 dies so even without these it can be real.
You might just send it to ANACs so even if that area is corroded it still gets slabbed. (others might bag it for corrosion). You can send just one coin.
It would end your concern over it.
I like the look of the coin. As far as authentic, I will leave it to the pro's.
Congrat's
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i hope it certifies.
some recomended to send it to ANACS....i'd agree. they are reputable for that coin and grade and will certify (slab) it if it's authentic regardless of corrosion or whatever is there on reverse.
When I looked at the picture for the first time, the mint mark looked funny to me. After comparing it to a picture of an added mint mark 1909-S VDB found on page 79 of LOOKING THROUGH LINCOLN CENTS, the coin pictured in this thread as the same style mint mark as the one on the book. And the book clearly states that the added mint mark pictured in the book has the wrong style.
Edited to add- Also, never just look at the location of the mint mark to assess if a coin is authentic or not. Mint marks were hand punched into the dies during this time, and it would be completely normal to find different authentic 1909-S VDB cents with mint marks in slightly different possitions.
Sorry to say, but it looks like you got an altered 1909 VDB cent.
-Gabe
WS
Welcome.
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mclark202@insightbb.com
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Thanks for all the replys. I have learned a lot... buy PCGS and forget the rest! Sleep will come much easier.
I will now be sending it off to ANACS for grading and authentication... Lots of tossing and turning at night till the results come back.
<< <i>The stuff on the rear UNI appears to be hard and part of the surface of the coin. How do I determine if the mintmark is an add on? I do not see anything out of place around the mintmark. You guys now have me real nervous.
Thanks for all the replys. I have learned a lot... buy PCGS and forget the rest! Sleep will come much easier.
I will now be sending it off to ANACS for grading and authentication... Lots of tossing and turning at night till the results come back. >>
If you listen to yourself and buy PCGS and forget the rest you will be missing out on a LOT of great coins in other plastic holders.
You are so new-please put down the Kool-Aid, take a step backwards and then take a deep breath and allow rational thought back in.
Thanks.
<< <i>Actually, in a great many cases he'd be better off with PCGS pieces only. You may not like it, but this veers from mere opinion into practical fact - particularly until he becomes more comfortable with his own development at grading. Ask shylock, for example, to explain the differences if he started to get interested in high-grade Indian cents as certified by NGC. >>
I did not name NGC.
Some plastic companies, PCGS INCLUDED, can be very erratic in their grading while some plastic companies, PCGS INCLUDED, can be overly tight or overly loose in their grading. This can also vary from series to series.
YOU KNOW THAT, I KNOW YOU DO.
Let me ask you a question---straight answer please....
Take a coin, put it in a PCGS 64 holder and value it at $1000
Crack out the coin...
Put THE SAME COIN in an NGC 66 holder and value it at $1000
Which coin is the better coin ????
edited for spelling
A little while later they honored the downgrade review and paid me my money back, $1600.
What you do have is the most common alteration in US coins, and the most common type of the most common alterations. There were hundreds of these made at one time, and there are still many of them out on the market. The chief diagnostic is that they are made with a mintmark from what appears to be a 1940S style. The serifs and size of the mintmark are completely wrong for a 1909 cent, and fortunately the person or people responsible for this batch of alterations did not know that. Also unfortunately there are a LOT of collectors that don't do their home work before purchasing such coins and tend to miss the dozen or so different places where warnings about these exact altered coins are published. My book is only one of those places.
Best thing to do at this point is not waste another second taking that coin back to where it came from for a refund. Short of that, you have an expensive lesson in doing research before spending loads of money on potentially worthless coins. I hate to hit hard with it, but the 1909S VDB cent is NOT something for people who don't do their research first. This tends to be a common yet very expensive rookie mistake, and it bugs me more every time I see it. Not only because they are still out there, but because looking into this sort of thing is SO much easier than it used to be, yet people still let themselves get burned.
By the way, people, "counterfeit" is not the right word to use for this coin. It is very highly likely a real 1909 cent, it just has an extra letter that found its way onto the coin after it left the Philadelphia mint. Counterfeit pieces were never real coins to begin with - like the tens of thousands of base metal trade dollars coming from our friends over in the orient. The coins that are real coins, but deceptively different from their original state are called "altered" - like this one.
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It appears that the slanted lower serif is a definate indicator of a fake and can not in any way be authentic? If anyone has a different view please post.
I want to thank you guys for helping me realize this now and not having a rude awakening many years from now. Talk about a bad learning experiance.
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Note how the dot after the "D" is centrally located between the "D" and "B" on the real coin and on yours it's not. IMO it's a 1909-VDB with an added mint-mark.
<< <i>The way I learned to tell a real S-VDB from an added mint-mark, was to look at the reverse. Here's a real one juxtaposed with yours:
Note how the dot after the "D" is centrally located between the "D" and "B" on the real coin and on yours it's not. IMO it's a 1909-VDB with an added mint-mark. >>
This doesn't make any difference. Once again, the VDB part of his coin is real, it's the mintmark that's not. The VDB was hand engraved into the dies, so each die is a little different.
The Lincoln cent store:
http://www.lincolncent.com
My numismatic art work:
http://www.cdaughtrey.com
USAF veteran, 1986-1996 :: support our troops - the American way.
Batman- look at my post to this thread on page 2, where I state that it was my opinion that this coin had an added mint mark. It is not only the serifs that are off, but the whole mint mark is off. The mint mark is not the correct style for 1909, so it can't be a true 1909-S VDB.
Also, take a q-tip and dip it in acetone and then roll the q-tip over the mint mark. I'm sure that the mint mark should fall right off the coin, if it was glued into the mint mark.
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