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How much is Willie Randolph's fault?

JerseyJersey Posts: 542
in Sports Talk
This Mets collapse (unless something happens quick - I hope). How much is the manager's fault? Should he be able to do something about it?
Wise men learn more from fools than fools learn from the wise.

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    JeremyDie1JeremyDie1 Posts: 2,383 ✭✭✭
    The manager should take blame if the team loses. Though he is not out on the field playing either.
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    BarndogBarndog Posts: 20,460 ✭✭✭✭✭
    aren't the NYM battling some injuries? If Randolph gets his players some rest and gets to the postseason, his team has a chance to get to the WS.
    JR Newsletter Online Edition
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    stitzenstitzen Posts: 1,771
    I think managers get way too much credit for wins and losses, especially in baseball.

    I don't see Willie holding too much responsibility for the Mets epic collapse.

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    kuhlmannkuhlmann Posts: 3,326 ✭✭
    willie is not a good manager at all. but the players like to play for him. if they fail to make playoffs he might get fired.

    but mother nature seems to be a mets fan bc i dont think that game is gonna get restarted.
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    grote15grote15 Posts: 29,536 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Mets bullpen is god-awful, and I blame Minaya for that. He's the guy signing the checks, though Willie has been criticized (fairly or not) as not being fiery or passionate enough during this slide. Personally, I think he's a mediocre manager, but the Mets quit on Howe a couple years back, too, so this is nothing new of late. Makes me realize how good a manager Bobby V was, as the Mets had far less talent back during his tenure but made the postseason three seasons in a row and the World Series in 2000.


    Collecting 1970s Topps baseball wax, rack and cello packs, as well as PCGS graded Half Cents, Large Cents, Two Cent pieces and Three Cent Silver pieces.
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    stitzenstitzen Posts: 1,771
    I have to think part of it is the media telling us (and the players who obviously watch) how great the Mets' team has been all year...that has to play into it. Listen to enough people tell you how great you are, and how you're the class of the NL, and how easily you'll roll into the playoffs, and you start to listen and lose your edge.

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    joestalinjoestalin Posts: 12,473 ✭✭
    The Phillies are just the better team. The Mets started out fast, beating up on Pitt, Wash and the NL Central, but now that all the
    games are played and the Mets had to actually play the Phils, we know who is the better team!

    JS
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    BoopottsBoopotts Posts: 6,784 ✭✭
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    grote15grote15 Posts: 29,536 ✭✭✭✭✭
    The Phillies are just the better team. The Mets started out fast, beating up on Pitt, Wash and the NL Central, but now that all the
    games are played and the Mets had to actually play the Phils, we know who is the better team!


    LOL, Newsflash to Kevin aka JS: Mets are in the same division as the Phils and played the same teams the Mets did. The "better" team will be the one that wins the division, and my money is still on the Mets. In baseball, more than any other sport, with its 162-game marathon schedule, there can be no doubt at the conclusion of the regular season at least, that the better team will be the one with the better record (especially if said team is not only in the same league but in the same division.

    But I've learned that Kevin has no concept of reality when it comes to sports--he still thinks FSU is a powerhouse and that the 4-12 Bucs will make the playoffs, so it's not hard to see where he's coming from (Mars). image At least SteveK roots for Philly through and through--I've always found it most odd how someone can root so hard for the Philadelphia Phillies, yet ridicule its sister (or brother team) the Philadelphia Eagles.


    Collecting 1970s Topps baseball wax, rack and cello packs, as well as PCGS graded Half Cents, Large Cents, Two Cent pieces and Three Cent Silver pieces.
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    stevekstevek Posts: 27,774 ✭✭✭✭✭
    N.Y. Mets 84 68 .553
    Philadelphia 84 70 .545 1

    We're getting closer!
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    ConnecticoinConnecticoin Posts: 12,543 ✭✭✭✭✭
    I blame Dusty Baker for letting the Cubs implode after the Bartman interference. He just sat on his ass and let it happen.
    *For Sale on BST* *For Sale on Ebay*
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    kuhlmannkuhlmann Posts: 3,326 ✭✭
    i cant belive almost a 3 hour rain delay. but ohh well


    and jerry mets never made the playoffs 3 years in a row.. they made playoffs 99 and 2000 not 98 or 2001!

    we goto the 9th 9-6 mets..

    PLEASE HOLD THIS DARN LEAD!!!
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    stevekstevek Posts: 27,774 ✭✭✭✭✭


    << <i>i cant belive almost a 3 hour rain delay. but ohh well


    and jerry mets never made the playoffs 3 years in a row.. they made playoffs 99 and 2000 not 98 or 2001!

    we goto the 9th 9-6 mets..

    PLEASE HOLD THIS DARN LEAD!!! >>




    I'll take a walk-off Grand Slam!
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    grote15grote15 Posts: 29,536 ✭✭✭✭✭
    and jerry mets never made the playoffs 3 years in a row.. they made playoffs 99 and 2000 not 98 or 2001!

    Correct. But my point is still the same, in that Valentine guided a less talented team than this one to the World Series.

    Nice to see some of my fellow Mets fans finally coming out of the woodwork, too, to combat the Stalin-SteveK Sillies Axis. We need your support! image

    Lead holds at 1.5! Magic number now down to 8!


    Collecting 1970s Topps baseball wax, rack and cello packs, as well as PCGS graded Half Cents, Large Cents, Two Cent pieces and Three Cent Silver pieces.
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    kuhlmannkuhlmann Posts: 3,326 ✭✭
    as much as i would like booby v back also. i dont think it would ever happen. him was the scapegoat for phillps debacle. so booby and wilpon dont see eye to eye.

    now we have a couple of guys in the booth that id love to see in the dugout. hernandez and darling no alot about baseball. willie lacks leadership skills to me. he doesnt stick up for his players like bobby cox. and to me that means alot.


    but 1.5 up. take care of biz next 5 games and it will be over. phils are gonna have a hard time with atlanta. hudson and smoltz in that series.
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    joestalinjoestalin Posts: 12,473 ✭✭
    I love how Mets fan is in denial. The Phillies take the Mets to the shed 8 straight times, yet they can still say that the Mets are
    better..LMAO. Just think if Hamels didn't go down, or Utley for extended periods of time, heck we might be 10 game up on the Mets
    and not even having this conversation!

    Padres finally lose last night, took almost an act of God, but we will take it!

    JS
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    kuhlmannkuhlmann Posts: 3,326 ✭✭
    Just think if Hamels didn't go down, or Utley for extended periods of time


    lol Jerry alow me.

    Just think if pedro sanchez alou beltran delgado list goes on and on and on... we would of had the division wraped up in august.
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    joestalinjoestalin Posts: 12,473 ✭✭
    Phillies have had WAAAAY more injuries than the Mets. You can't compare Pedro to Hamels, and you can't compare Howard and
    Utley to Sanchez and Alou....please. Check our opening day pitching roster..count how many of those guys are now on the
    roster!

    JS
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    kuhlmannkuhlmann Posts: 3,326 ✭✭
    You can't compare Pedro to Hamels

    couldnt agree more. i mean how can you compare a hall of fame pitcher who is 3-0 in 4 starts. to a rookie who had 26 starts.

    imagine pedro had 26 starts. yep division would of been wraped up in august.

    and alou stats for just 78 games played are amazing. not even half a season. gonna be nice next week when everyone is healthy.
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    stevekstevek Posts: 27,774 ✭✭✭✭✭
    There's gonna be a "Farewell 2007 season" party coming very soon for the Pets. The "Farewell Willie" party will come shortly thereafter.
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    grote15grote15 Posts: 29,536 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Kevin you are truly delusional, so much so that I often wonder if your absurd posts are done tongue-in-cheek, because no one could be that dense, could they? image

    The baseball season is a 162-game season, a marathon season compared to any other sport. Injuries are part of the game, and the Mets have had their fair share of them this year, but unlike you, we don't use them as excuses.

    Actually, if you look at it, the Sillies have been better off since Hamels got hurt. Maybe he was actually a detriment to the team, as they've been far better without him since he went down! (See, I can post ridiculous assumptions, too, LOL!).

    Bottom line is over a 162-game season, if two teams are in the same division, the team with the better record is the better team, simple as that. I'm willing to concede if the Sillies win the East, they are the better team, but you are already making excuses because you know the Mets will prevail! image


    Collecting 1970s Topps baseball wax, rack and cello packs, as well as PCGS graded Half Cents, Large Cents, Two Cent pieces and Three Cent Silver pieces.
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    joestalinjoestalin Posts: 12,473 ✭✭
    Hamels was a Cy Young contender and a sure 20 game winner, Pedro can't speak English and is over the hill. Utley is an MVP
    canidate, while those other guys you mention don't even classify as a semi star in the latest beckett.

    JS
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    perkdogperkdog Posts: 29,541 ✭✭✭✭✭


    << <i> while those other guys you mention don't even classify as a semi star in the latest beckett.

    JS >>





    image
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    grote15grote15 Posts: 29,536 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Utley is an MVP
    canidate,

    And David Wright may win the MVP if the Mets win the East!


    Collecting 1970s Topps baseball wax, rack and cello packs, as well as PCGS graded Half Cents, Large Cents, Two Cent pieces and Three Cent Silver pieces.
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    stitzenstitzen Posts: 1,771


    << <i>Utley is an MVP
    canidate,

    And David Wright may win the MVP if the Mets win the East! >>



    Uhm, no he won't.

    Keep dreamin'!
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    grote15grote15 Posts: 29,536 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Uhm, no he won't.

    Ummm, who asked you?


    Collecting 1970s Topps baseball wax, rack and cello packs, as well as PCGS graded Half Cents, Large Cents, Two Cent pieces and Three Cent Silver pieces.
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    stitzenstitzen Posts: 1,771


    << <i>Uhm, no he won't.

    Ummm, who asked you? >>



    I didn't realize you feel a comment like 'david wright is mvp' is a question...


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    kuhlmannkuhlmann Posts: 3,326 ✭✭
    I didn't realize you feel a comment like 'david wright is mvp' is a question...

    your kidding right? 30 30 club 100 runs scored 100 rbis nah voters wont even think about giving him a vote!

    wow axtell i no everyone on here thinks your annoying.. you dont bother me. but come on man.. this is the dumbest thing i have ever seen you post..

    david wright is an mvp candidate! no matter how you want to spin this look at his numbers on a team in first place.

    phillies fans you guys will see what i have seen for 15 years! the f@cking braves. that is what is gonna do you guys in. they have smoltz and hudson lined up for that series and mets seem to be waken up... better hope the pads keep losing..

    id love to see the phils and mets in the nlcs. a bumpy road to the series is what its all about! i think it will be one heck of a series! but will the phils get there?
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    grote15grote15 Posts: 29,536 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Well stated, Kuhlmann. Wright also has 40 doubles and a .320 BA to go along with the impressive stats you noted. He's definitely a contender for NL MVP, without a doubt.


    Collecting 1970s Topps baseball wax, rack and cello packs, as well as PCGS graded Half Cents, Large Cents, Two Cent pieces and Three Cent Silver pieces.
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    stitzenstitzen Posts: 1,771
    I never said he wasn't a candidate, my point was that a statement was made, I commented, then I was told 'nobody asked'...to which I replied that what was posted wasn't a question, so how could I have been asked?

    Anyways, semantics, and no, Wright won't be in the top 5, even with the NY media bias.

    Matt Holliday, Prince Fielder, Chase Utley, Ryan Howard, Alfonso Soriano are all more worthy candidates.
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    grote15grote15 Posts: 29,536 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Anyways, semantics, and no, Wright won't be in the top 5, even with the NY media bias.

    image


    Collecting 1970s Topps baseball wax, rack and cello packs, as well as PCGS graded Half Cents, Large Cents, Two Cent pieces and Three Cent Silver pieces.
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    stitzenstitzen Posts: 1,771
    Meanwhile the Phils keep winning and the mets are only 1.5 up.

    Where will the so-called 'mets' fans go if their team doesn't make the playoffs? Oh I know! The yankees bandwagon, then claim they've been a 'fan' of both NY teams for a long time to justify it!

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    kuhlmannkuhlmann Posts: 3,326 ✭✭
    axtell... you will never hear that from me! METS FAN DIE HARD! ONLY TEAM I TRULY HATE WITH A PASION IS THE BRAVES!!!!! other then that i really dont care!
    phillies win ill be happy for some of the good guys on this board!

    the fans of eagles and sillies are actually good guys on this board! its fun to jab at one another... but like i said smoltz and hudson in that 3 game set might do them in!

    i really hope they get the wild card and mets get the division! bc that nlcs will be jacked up and alot of fun! this is what its all about! i hope it happens! give us fans heart attacks and stuff like that! i cant wait!
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    stitzenstitzen Posts: 1,771
    Kuhlman, that's good to hear, but there's a loudmouth mets 'fan' who is known for hopping to the yanks bandwagon often.

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    grote15grote15 Posts: 29,536 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Kuhlman, that's good to hear, but there's a loudmouth mets 'fan' who is known for hopping to the yanks bandwagon often.

    The only "loudmouth" on this board is you, Axtroll.

    Do us Philly and Mets fans both a favor, and go pollute some other thread. I'm sure there are plenty of them that you've already soiled with your inane and riduculous observations. In case you haven't noticed, no one wants you here, LOL!


    Collecting 1970s Topps baseball wax, rack and cello packs, as well as PCGS graded Half Cents, Large Cents, Two Cent pieces and Three Cent Silver pieces.
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    stitzenstitzen Posts: 1,771
    No one wants me here but people respond...hilarious how that works.

    What's the matter groteboy? Upset I called you out on your bandwagon riding?
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    grote15grote15 Posts: 29,536 ✭✭✭✭✭
    I pity the front-running, bandwagon fan who has no connection to a team, just to a win. They are more consumed with a win than the team, root more for the win than they do the team. It's a pathetic, miserable sports existence.

    Pathetic miserable existence? Sounds like you Axhole. Bandwagon? LOL! This coming from the guy who started rooting for the Bucs after they won the Super Bowl, and the M's after they win 116 games only to get bounced by the Yankees in the playoffs.


    Collecting 1970s Topps baseball wax, rack and cello packs, as well as PCGS graded Half Cents, Large Cents, Two Cent pieces and Three Cent Silver pieces.
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    stitzenstitzen Posts: 1,771
    Uhm you're wrong on both accounts, but thanks for playing, clown!
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    kuhlmannkuhlmann Posts: 3,326 ✭✭
    Is it all over but the crying. 2.5 games up with a week left. hmmm
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    grote15grote15 Posts: 29,536 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Magic number down to 5!


    Collecting 1970s Topps baseball wax, rack and cello packs, as well as PCGS graded Half Cents, Large Cents, Two Cent pieces and Three Cent Silver pieces.
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