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How common are "inked" New Jersey coppers?

LongacreLongacre Posts: 16,717 ✭✭✭
I was taking a look at the CoinRaritiesOnline website, and this coin caught my eye. I cannot tell if they are goofing on us when they refer to "inked" New Jersey coppers. The coin is interesting, but I am curious as to how frequently attributions are written on the coin itself. I assume it is not common, but again, I don't know if I am just not part of an inside joke. Does anyone know?

Here is the text from the website and the picture:

1788 New Jersey Copper

Choice XF [Uncertified]


Maris 67-v. Considered to be Rarity-1 as a variety, but genuinely scarce in the choice condition seen here.

And this is an extremely wholesome coin, made even more charming by the '67/V' die attribution artfully written in white ink in the right obverse field.

Inked NJ coppers aren't terribly rare, but we don't recall ever seeing one as aesthetically pleasing and attractive as this piece. In all, a lovely example of 'museum quality coinage'.


image

image
Always took candy from strangers
Didn't wanna get me no trade
Never want to be like papa
Working for the boss every night and day
--"Happy", by the Rolling Stones (1972)

Comments

  • numismanumisma Posts: 3,877 ✭✭✭✭

    They are less common than inked Connecticut coppers. Beautiful New Jersey copper!
  • PistareenPistareen Posts: 1,505 ✭✭✭
    Connecticuts with ink or "PDVS" (i.e. "painted die varieties) are far more common than NJs, perhaps by a 5-1 or greater margin.

    That stated, NJ coppers with ink do turn up. Most are probably traceable to one of a handful of collections that were formed before the turn of the 20th century. Common isn't the word for them, though. Maybe I've seen two dozen in my life? Three dozen? Certainly way under 100.

    Bad news for coin doctors: though the ink is removable, the toning under them is hard to change and becomes black with time. Thus, a coin with nice ink like this offers an extra defense of originality.

    Admission: I have handled this exact NJ before and really liked it when it was on my desk. I don't own it or anything, though.
  • LongacreLongacre Posts: 16,717 ✭✭✭


    << <i>Connecticuts with ink or "PDVS" (i.e. "painted die varieties) are far more common than NJs, perhaps by a 5-1 or greater margin.

    That stated, NJ coppers with ink do turn up. Most are probably traceable to one of a handful of collections that were formed before the turn of the 20th century. Common isn't the word for them, though. Maybe I've seen two dozen in my life? Three dozen? Certainly way under 100.

    Bad news for coin doctors: though the ink is removable, the toning under them is hard to change and becomes black with time. Thus, a coin with nice ink like this offers an extra defense of originality.

    Admission: I have handled this exact NJ before and really liked it when it was on my desk. I don't own it or anything, though. >>




    Great info, as always. I have never heard of inked coppers. In the colonial or EAC field, are these pieces seen as desirable as an uninked piece, or is there some sort of price adjustment for inked coins? Very interesting.
    Always took candy from strangers
    Didn't wanna get me no trade
    Never want to be like papa
    Working for the boss every night and day
    --"Happy", by the Rolling Stones (1972)
  • PistareenPistareen Posts: 1,505 ✭✭✭
    In terms of pricing, some people like them more (history! pedigree! romance!), some people like them less (what?? I can't slab it??).

    So, a net push I guess? It depends on the coin -- a PDV might double the price of a crummy $25 colonial and reduce the prize of an amazing $5000 one.

    I'd be interested in CCU's take on that question.
  • numismanumisma Posts: 3,877 ✭✭✭✭

    A problem I have encountered in the past is with counterfeit inked Connecticuts. In other words, some bozo (maybe more than one) was painting CTs to increase the value. The logic being that some would want a CT that was out of an old collection. At one point I pursued PDV colonials and almost all were Connecticuts. I sold most of them and I can tell you that there are modern day collectors who collect them, including one member of this forum other than me.
  • ColonialCoinUnionColonialCoinUnion Posts: 10,087 ✭✭✭


    << <i>In terms of pricing, some people like them more (history! pedigree! romance!), some people like them less (what?? I can't slab it??).

    So, a net push I guess? It depends on the coin -- a PDV might double the price of a crummy $25 colonial and reduce the prize of an amazing $5000 one.

    I'd be interested in CCU's take on that question. >>



    I would agree with the answer of 'net push'.

    For most of the current crop of colonial guys who started collecting after the advent of slabbing (keep in mind colonial slabbing didn't begin until the later 1990s) and who participate in the registry, ink is a strange and mysterious thing. PCGS doesn't slab these and instead categorizes them as 'Altered Surfaces' (though I have seen a couple in their holders that somehow slipped through the cracks). As such, raw, it obviously makes it a harder sell to a slab buyer.

    For traditionalists, this might add a bit of a value, but not much.

    We bought this coin primarily because it was inked, and was among the most aesthetic of such pieces we've seen. We figured it was a way to introduce inked copper to our customer base and show a really historic, original looking coin.




  • LongacreLongacre Posts: 16,717 ✭✭✭


    << <i>

    << <i>In terms of pricing, some people like them more (history! pedigree! romance!), some people like them less (what?? I can't slab it??).

    So, a net push I guess? It depends on the coin -- a PDV might double the price of a crummy $25 colonial and reduce the prize of an amazing $5000 one.

    I'd be interested in CCU's take on that question. >>



    I would agree with the answer of 'net push'.

    For most of the current crop of colonial guys who started collecting after the advent of slabbing (keep in mind colonial slabbing didn't begin until the later 1990s) and who participate in the registry, ink is a strange and mysterious thing. PCGS doesn't slab these and instead categorizes them as 'Altered Surfaces' (though I have seen a couple in their holders that somehow slipped through the cracks). As such, raw, it obviously makes it a harder sell to a slab buyer.

    For traditionalists, this might add a bit of a value, but not much.

    We bought this coin primarily because it was inked, and was among the most aesthetic of such pieces we've seen. We figured it was a way to introduce inked copper to our customer base and show a really historic, original looking coin. >>




    Thanks for the comment. As I said earlier, I have never heard of these, so I learned something today!

    Now let's get back to talking stickers instead of ink. image
    Always took candy from strangers
    Didn't wanna get me no trade
    Never want to be like papa
    Working for the boss every night and day
    --"Happy", by the Rolling Stones (1972)

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