Early capped and draped bust halves and original skin/luster???

dizzyfoxx

Just how tough is it to find an early capped or draped bust half (Pre-1830) with a little, some, a lot, or all of the original skin and decent luster still intact?

fengk

A lot of it depends on what grade you're looking in. An original high-AU coin is really hard to come by, since most have been dipped out. Same with mint state coins. Original coins are much more prevelant in the low to mid circulated grades, but even then most coins have been cleaned at some point or another.

OKbustchaser

This one still has a lot of originality left. I really prefer the "grey dirt" look.



The next 2 still have quite a bit of original luster left, but have spent a lot of years in Kraft envelopes.



Anyway, they are available with a lot of looking.

Edit to replace pic of 1810 to show closer color rather than red/brown scan.

CommemDude

I have seen only a few truly original draped bust halves. One came from Evan Gale, it was an AU55 with uniform but dark gold-brown and somewhat uninviting toning, but underneath the full cartwheel was intact and it was a coin that most people glance at would pass over. We both agreed that it was a rare bird that had not been played with yet by the doctors, and it is one of those coins I regret selling.

mozin

A truly original 200 year old silver coin normally would be VERY darkly toned, way too dark for most people to enjoy. I have no problem with a quick dip, placing the coin in an environment where it can tone, and then left for some years to develop nice toning.

My old eyes have a hard time seeing details on a darkly toned coin. Edgar Souders, who wrote BUST HALF FEVER, much prefers darkly tone Busties because he believes that is the way they should look after 200 years.

stman

My man Dizzy, there are very few that are completely original. I believe you have more of a chance of it being so in lower circulated condition.
There are some that are more original than others, original now, original look etc. Just as long as they are not blast white in the centers with my "Favorite Blue" around the periph, and look somewhat original I'm good with them. The blast white centers with the blue around the periph, just don't look right for coins around 200 years old. This is just my worthless opinion.

Some of these blast white centers with my favorite blue might have occurred naturally after a cleaning..... and some have been boinked with.

coinkat

Very tough...

TomB

You aren't going to find many of them and those that you do find will be unappealing to you.

roadrunner

One's chances dramatically improve after 1810 due to hoards of bust halves put aside. Prior to that, very very slim.

I recall having a pair of super slider orig busties about 5 years ago that had a very uniform light grayish tint. At the time I had no clue how special these were and I paid under $200 each for them (and then sold them for an obscenely tiny profit of $25 each). They were not dipped or cleaned and appeared to be no different than an orig 1917 quarter would look that had not been kept in a sulfur environment.

roadrunner

rhedden

Original, crusty bust halves are not all that rare. The problem is that 99% of them are already owned by forum members, and they are not letting go.

tradedollarnut

I have only seen two or three completely original full skinned capped bust halves. One of them is even white.

TahoeDale

I am going to take out the series and report back. Of the over 100 MS draped and bust halves I own, I can only remember 10 that I can say appear to be original and untouched.

I will try to get images of the 10, and exhibit them here, and at the ANA in Milwaukee.

fivecents

This one has no luster of course, but plenty of original skin....

Nysoto

For those who have extensive collections of early halves, some believe 100% have been messed with in some way, others 95%, or somewhere in-between. Collectors have been intentionally toning bust halves for decades in kraft envelopes or albums (how many colorfully toned coins have you pulled out of circulation?). I have a set of Mercs that I pulled from circulation in 1964, they are still light grey after 43 years, and I would expect the same after the next 50 years if they are continued to be stored away from sulfur and other contaminents.

Buy what appeals to you, avoid abrasively cleaned coins. I have around 100 halves 1794-1807, and don't get overly concerned with originality, because the truth is, nobody knows for sure. That crusty and dark bust half you think is 100% original may be AT'ed to hide defects, I have seen this done.

This one has certainly spent some time in an envelope, was owned by Robbie Brown and Dr. Gerald Shertz, it is a nice coin that is one of the best for this impressive variety, I could care less about opinions of originality:

LanLord

"Buy what appeals to you, avoid abrasively cleaned coins. I have around 100 halves 1794-1807, and don't get overly concerned with originality, because the truth is, nobody knows for sure. That crusty and dark bust half you think is 100% original may be AT'ed to hide defects, I have seen this done."

Truer words I have never read.

Great post Nysoto.

dizzyfoxx

<< <i>"<STRONG>Buy what appeals to you, avoid abrasively cleaned coins.</STRONG> I have around 100 halves 1794-1807, and <STRONG>don't get overly concerned with originality, because the truth is, nobody knows for sure. That crusty and dark bust half you think is 100% original may be AT'ed to hide defects</STRONG>, I have seen this done."

Truer words I have never read.

Great post Nysoto. >>

oldcameoproofsguy

I think that a good original look is important. Lately, I like them crusty; if it is too light in color... I dunno.

I stay away from any that have parallel hairlines in the fields and on the smooth parts of the devices. It just makes the coin look like it had an abrasive cleaning at one point in its life. A retoned dip job is not too difficult to spot, so I stay away from that too.