Joe Orlando's SMR column
colebear
Posts: 886 ✭✭
if you have not already done so, check out Joe Orlando's card grading urban legend statements on page 14 in the newest SMR. It is a nice little insight into our thoughts on card grading.
0
Comments
Looking for Jonny Gomes cards, especially Triple Threads and printing plates. Will consider all cards, though. Got something? Contact me at c_u_l_1@yahoo.com
<< <i>Thanks for the link. Now I understand why so many altered cards get through. >>
find the invisible wrinkles/creases that turn
my 10s into 5s?
Shane
Raw: Tony Gonzalez (low #'d cards, and especially 1/1's) and Steve Young.
10) The first three digits of the cert# identifies who graded a card and when -No Comment
My eBay Store
BigCrumbs! I made over $250 last year!
<< <i>9) There is a "grader of death" - True
10) The first three digits of the cert# identifies who graded a card and when -No Comment >>
They can say what they want about the cert # thing, but I think it's curious that the only people I've ever seen with cards that have certs starting with '81..' are 4SC.
However some articles regarding issues in the hobby (trimming, recoloring, etc.) would be nice. The grading companies have the most exposure to altered cards and could help the collector by further educating us on how to spot alterations. They have done some pieces on autos in the past, why not altered cards?
SGC had an article on this subject. I have not seen it.
We need more articles published to help the collector. Seeing everyone's collection is great and we have some fantastic SMR contributors from this board, but for my annual fee I would like to see articles with more substance.
Keith
Keith, you're absolutely right. Educational articles on altered cards would be phenomenal and enthusiastically received. I would pay a higher subscription fee for quarterly "white papers" on these kinds of subjects as long as they were detailed and not "watered down" like most of the stuff I see in these publications.
Seeking primarily PSA graded pre-war "type" cards
My PSA Registry Sets
34 Goudey, 75 Topps Mini, Hall of Fame Complete Set, 1985 Topps Tiffany, Hall of Fame Players Complete Set
Justin
NAXCOM
<< <i>
<< <i>9) There is a "grader of death" - True
10) The first three digits of the cert# identifies who graded a card and when -No Comment >>
They can say what they want about the cert # thing, but I think it's curious that the only people I've ever seen with cards that have certs starting with '81..' are 4SC. >>
Don't forget wcsports1
<< <i>Wouldn't this provide a walkthrough on how to make counterfeits BETTER?
Justin >>
Examples of alterations can be shown without compromising the hobby.
Techniques for recognizing these alterations can be shared.
Card doctors will always find new ways to steal from collectors and try to fool the grading companies.
The more that we all know about how to spot a doctored card the better. As new doctoring procedures are used we can all become educated.
Less of these will be sent to the grading companies and more will be taken off the market.
find the invisible wrinkles/creases that turn
my 10s into 5s?"
Good question. Maybe there are certain sets which are more prone to surface creases and they use a glass for these.
I always knew that someone related to Stevie Wonder or my mother -in- law(not blind , just acts like it ) , was grading some of my cards. No magnifying glass or loupe , WOW. On a more realistic thought , that probably explains why some of my lower graded cards, look much better , up close.
I need more 10's , I wonder who I submit through or contact.
Never Get Cheated,
Joe Orlando
Well now that's one heckuva ending to a letter Joe. Your card isnt louped but dont feel cheated now ! Where do I send my check?
Wow!
I can actually save his sig!!!
Now that's pretty darn cool - the sig has it's own URL!
"All these lies i'm telling you are the absolute truth"---True
Sincerely,
Raw: Tony Gonzalez (low #'d cards, and especially 1/1's) and Steve Young.
Over the years, 16 to be exact, there have been many theories offered about the PSA grading process. While it is pure speculation in most cases, some of those theories have become Urban Legend in the hobby. Most of the time, the rumors are honest misunderstandings about the process.
Here are the five biggest misunderstandings about the PSA card grading process.
1) Graders Measure Each and Every Card With a Ruler – False
When a card is evaluated by a grader, they may or may not choose to physically measure the card. Many people are under the false impression that locating evidence of trimming, for example, is a simple product of measurement and nothing could be further from the truth. Graders will measure the card if they think the card needs to actually be measured. Their eyes, due to their experience, are much more crucial than a ruler.
2) Graders Consider the Population Report or the Marketplace When Grading – False
This is a conspiracy theorist favorite. The people who believe this statement think that if a card is scarce in a particular grade or hot in the marketplace that the graders will be extra tough on it. The graders consider one thing and one thing only when grading the card – the card!
3) From Time to Time, Graders are Ordered to be “Looser” or “Tighter” in Company Meetings – False
I hear this one a lot. We do not have meetings where I or anyone else asks the graders to loosen up or tighten up on the grading line. We do meet about grading and discuss particular grading issues but never and I repeat – NEVER – do we instruct the graders to do such a thing. The grading process works best if they have autonomy.
4) Graders Use Magnifying Glasses or Loupes to Grade Every Card – False
Do graders utilize these tools to assist in grading when they feel the need to use them? Of course, but the vast majority of cards are graded with the naked eye. Yes, I said it – the naked eye. In order to be a full-time grader, you need to have an extraordinary eye and these tools can, at times, distort aspects of the card.
5) Graders are Heartless Robot Minions Who Have Been Sent from the Future to Kill Your Submissions and Sarah Connor – Partially True – Kidding
Alright, this one was just thrown in for kicks but the point here is that the graders approach their job with neutrality. They are not trying to help or harm anyone like The Terminator; they have to focus on the characteristics of the cards. If they can justify 100 PSA 10’s out of 100 cards, they will. There’s no rationing of grades based on the overall outcome of an order or anything of that nature that occurs. They just grade the cards, for better or worse, as they see them.
I hope this clears up some of the misunderstandings that exist in the graded card marketplace and helps put to rest some of the urban legends that still roam the hobby. For a more detailed breakdown of the grading process, please visit our website at www.psacard.com for our grading video demonstration.
Never Get Cheated,
Joe Orlando
Editor In Chief
<<< The grading process works best if they have autonomy. >>>
I think I understand everything except what does looking at the sky through a telescope have to do with the grading process?
<< <i><<< The grading process works best if they have autonomy. >>> >>
<< <i>I think I understand everything except what does looking at the sky through a telescope have to do with the grading process? >>
Coming to a planetarium near you.
Comet Joe - Bopp
Ron
Buying Vintage, all sports.
Buying Woody Hayes, Les Horvath, Vic Janowicz, and Jesse Owens autographed items
you forgot to put TRUE at the end of your statement
<< <i>That column was full of more crap than a men's room in a Mexican restaurant >>
Care to elaborate?
Or maybe true?
I find it funny that the only card I had rejected in my last order was a GAI crackout 1955 Spahn.
Most of the other cards graded just as I expected. And I used no loupe either.
Steve
<< <i>That column was full of more crap than a men's room in a Mexican restaurant >>
Are you implying that -
1) men's rooms tend to contain more fecal matter.
or
2) Mexican restaurant bathrooms are full of more defacation.
Which is it, racist or sexist? A little of both maybe.
How about the restrooms at SGC? As if they don't stink?
Never get cheated,
I have not gotten it back yet. All i know is it is the only card to get that and it was a GAI crackout.
Steve
<< <i>The expiration date of my membership can't arrive fast enough. >>
However, this presents no hazard to collectors unless you plan on cracking out your collection.
<< <i>
<< <i>That column was full of more crap than a men's room in a Mexican restaurant >>
Are you implying that -
1) men's rooms tend to contain more fecal matter.
or
2) Mexican restaurant bathrooms are full of more defacation.
Which is it, racist or sexist? A little of both maybe.
How about the restrooms at SGC? As if they don't stink?
What I am implying is that a restroom (whether men's, ladies, or unisex) when located inside of an establishment that serves traditional Mexican cuisine will contain on average a larger proportion of human waste material (i.e. "crap") than an eatery of another variety. This is of course due to the often spicy and volatile nature of the Mexican cuisine which tends to cause a noticable amount of indigestion and/or stomach ailments in non-Hispanic individuals who more often than not do not frequent establishments such as those and therefore have not tempered their digestive systems to be able to handle such culinary delights.
Now, as for the restrooms located within the confines of SGC of Parsippany, New Jersey, I cannot elaborate on that.
<< <i>
<< <i>
<< <i>That column was full of more crap than a men's room in a Mexican restaurant >>
Are you implying that -
1) men's rooms tend to contain more fecal matter.
or
2) Mexican restaurant bathrooms are full of more defacation.
Which is it, racist or sexist? A little of both maybe.
How about the restrooms at SGC? As if they don't stink?
What I am implying is that a restroom (whether men's, ladies, or unisex) when located inside of an establishment that serves traditional Mexican cuisine will contain on average a larger proportion of human waste material (i.e. "crap") than an eatery of another variety. This is of course due to the often spicy and volatile nature of the Mexican cuisine which tends to cause a noticable amount of indigestion and/or stomach ailments in non-Hispanic individuals who more often than not do not frequent establishments such as those and therefore have not tempered their digestive systems to be able to handle such culinary delights.
Now, as for the restrooms located within the confines of SGC of Parsippany, New Jersey, I cannot elaborate on that. >>
How about the men's room in a donut shop? Bet those are pretty nasty.
It was a joke and rhetoric. No offense.
<< <i>
It was a joke and rhetoric. No offense. >>
As was my reply, none taken!
FALSE
Never get cheated,
Joe
<< <i>Thanks for the link. Now I understand why so many altered cards get through. >>
You are a friggin' riot!!!! LOL chaz
Some of us grade cards for :
picking out alterations/trimming
set registry participation, competition
re-selling
adding value to the card (again with reselling it)
security in buying graded cards sight unseen
cardboard preservation in a slab,
etc.....
If and when getting a card graded decreases value on a consistent basis to that card or cards, then grading will end. When, for example, a '81 Montana RC that grades PSA 9, SGC 96, or GAI 9, starts selling under the high beckett price of say $100, you will see grading fall by the wayside. Until that time grading is here to stay. Value added to the card is why most of us grade them.
Does anyone feel most commons from the 1960's and 1970's would be getting graded unless grading it added value to the card? The answer is no.
So I highly doubt PSA would share info with any of us on how to pick out alterations if that means a drop in submissions for grading and a drop to their business bottomline.
Also, why give the crooks out there anymore info on how to go about scamming PSA?
<< <i>It's a shame the c---suckers of the hobby have even made authentication necessary. >>
Couldnt agree more. There is no honor among thieves
Every time I read about another scam, I just shake my head.
joe
<< <i>It's a shame the c---suckers of the hobby have even made authentication necessary. >>
I remember the days before any grading. I walked into a coin shop to buy some supplies, and the experienced coin shop owner had just been scammed and showed me the coin. A 1909-S penny had been altered to make a 1909-S VDB. Back then, normally a 1909-VDB, about a 75 cent coin, was altered to put the S on front to try to make it a 1909-S VDB, a $200 coin. "Nobody" would alter a 1909-S and add the VDB on the back because that is harder to do and the 1909-S was about a $25 coin so nobody wanted to risk messing up a $25 coin. But that's exactly what happened - someone came in with the coin, the dealer carefully inspected the S, determined it was genuine and paid the scammer - the dealer didn't figure out until later the VDB had been added.
Cards back then were just as bad with alterations, coloring, etc, and excellent quality fakes. The 63 Rose rookie fakes are still fooling people - somebody obviously in the printing business made new plates and counterfeited them to look just like a real card. I've never seen one but have been told that at first glance they are very difficult to tell from an original and that even some experienced collectors get fooled by these 63 Rose fakes.
Steve