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SHIPPING Practices by some sellers

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I gotta b**tch again! I am getting tired and frustrated again when I buy cheaper cards and pay $2-$4 shipping
and I get the card in a regular envelope with ABSOLUTELY NO PROTECTION and a 55 cent stamp on it.

It is happening more and more frequently.

And, I might add I don't want to hear crybabies talking about the card only brought BLAH BLAH BLAH and they
don't make money if they have to pay more for shipping the card! I NEVER NEVER have and l NEVER NEVER
will, in any future auctions, cut corners, just because my card brought less than what I thought in order for me to
make money. This is NOT an acceptable practice under ANY circumstances. This is just poor business!

I've done this long enough to know how this should be done and it is expected, especially if I pay the full
boat on the shipping!

Tony

Comments

  • MorrellManMorrellMan Posts: 3,238 ✭✭✭
    That kind of utilization of your shipping charge is certainly a poor business choice and it's on you if you ever buy from the guy again - but the important question is: did your card arrive safely? If it didn't, you should be ripping this seller a brand new one.
    Mark (amerbbcards)


    "All evil needs to triumph is for good men to do nothing."
  • I agree complete. I just received a card that arrived with a cracked case. It was shipped in a too big bubble mailer with no other protection (Charged me $2.99 for shipping, included delivery confirmation).I didn't even bother reporting it to the seller as I would have got the you-should-have-bought-insurance line. Even if he offered a refund, what's the point when the card only cost $5?

    While we're whining... what's up with these guys that think scotch tape protects the card? All it does is make it hard to open.
  • jeffcbayjeffcbay Posts: 8,948 ✭✭✭✭
    I just ran into a seller who snuck in the phrase "$3.00 plus insurance". At a glance I thought the shipping was $3.00, which is fair for a graded card, but usually insurance is optional and I never use it because it's only a $10 card, and I'll take my chances (I've bought 300+ PSA cards without any damage in the mail). So I'm paying $4.30 for shipping now. Lets just hope they actually put the insurance on it.
  • FBFB Posts: 1,684 ✭✭
    I've been picking up some SGC graded cards from the early 70's from a guy who states " $4.00 shipping - ABSOLUTELY NO COMBINED SHIPPING ON GRADED CARDS.

    At least he states it upfront. Of course when I win 4 cards - he charges $16.00 and then packages the 4 cards in the same bubble mailer for $2.29. The upside is that because he states this so boldly in his ads, I've been able to pick up 1971 SGC 88's for less than $2.00 each.

    I can complain - but at least I know upfront and can choose to bid or not. Its the guys who DON'T state what their shipping rates are and then charge ridiculous money that I can't stand.

    Frank
    Frank Bakka
    Sets - 1970, 1971 and 1972
    Always looking for 1972 O-PEE-CHEE Baseball in PSA 9 or 10!

    lynnfrank@earthlink.net
    outerbankyank on eBay!
  • In my opinion most people are way too reticent to leave negative feedback on EBay for fear of "retribution". As someone who will leave negative feedback quite a bit I can say I have yet to encounter this problem. Lack of critical feedback really robs the "star" system of any real meaning other than noting the # of transactions a particular Seller has been involved with. For most the Seller has to outright rob them before they'll leave a negative, even if there were a lot of undesirable aspects of the transaction.

    EBay is changing its feedback system so that while leaving a "positive" for someone it will be possible to criticize things like excess shipping costs or "was item as described" through a 1-5 rating in different categories.

    All I can say is why did it take them more than 10 years to come up with that?

    Recently I purchased a .99 card that required $1.35 insurance + another $5 for shipping. Sure this was posted in the auction, but as much as I am buying I rarely stop and smell the roses on any $1 auction. I left negative feedback because thats what you deserve for that kind of price gouge policy stated or not.
  • GOODLIEUGOODLIEU Posts: 629 ✭✭
    "Recently I purchased a .99 card that required $1.35 insurance + another $5 for shipping. Sure this was posted in the auction, but as much as I am buying I rarely stop and smell the roses on any $1 auction. I left negative feedback because thats what you deserve for that kind of price gouge policy stated or not"


    Your just kidding Right?


  • FBFB Posts: 1,684 ✭✭
    I hope he's kidding too...

    To give a negative when everything was spelled out to begin with is just plain obnoxious. No one forces us to bid on anything. But, when we do, we should damn well be willing to take responsibility for knowing what we're getting in to.

    Frank
    Frank Bakka
    Sets - 1970, 1971 and 1972
    Always looking for 1972 O-PEE-CHEE Baseball in PSA 9 or 10!

    lynnfrank@earthlink.net
    outerbankyank on eBay!


  • << <i>As someone who will leave negative feedback quite a bit >>


    That's where you lost me.
  • Might be a good idea COF if you give everyone here your ebay handle....lol
  • "Might be a good idea COF if you give everyone here your ebay handle....lol"

    I don't think we'll need his ebay handle since most ebay seller's filters will not allow buyers with the kind of feedback rating he's going to end up with to bid on their auctions anyway.


    Mark B.

    Seeking primarily PSA graded pre-war "type" cards

    My PSA Registry Sets

    34 Goudey, 75 Topps Mini, Hall of Fame Complete Set, 1985 Topps Tiffany, Hall of Fame Players Complete Set
  • dudedude Posts: 1,454 ✭✭
    I've run across several eBay sellers over the years who sell graded cards that sell for $7-$15 and ship them in bubble mailers with fees ranging from $6.95 to $10.00. To me their business model is focused on just getting a sale so that they gouge someone on shipping rather than make their money on the item that's for sale. In general principal, I don't give these kinds of dealers any business, unless I can get the card significantly below market value.
  • jradke4jradke4 Posts: 3,573 ✭✭✭
    the worst at the people that most have stock in 3M. they use about half a roll on the package, then more on the card holder. you have to break out a knife and fear running the card.
    Packers Fan for Life
    Collecting:
    Brett Favre Master Set
    Favre Ticket Stubs
    Favre TD Reciever Autos
    Football HOF Player/etc. Auto Set
    Football HOF Rc's
  • colebearcolebear Posts: 886 ✭✭


    << <i>"Might be a good idea COF if you give everyone here your ebay handle....lol"

    I don't think we'll need his ebay handle since most ebay seller's filters will not allow buyers with the kind of feedback rating he's going to end up with to bid on their auctions anyway. >>



    How do you block all buyers with feedback below a certain %? I only know how to block certain buyer, buyers with feedback below zero, and buyers with non-payer complaints against them
  • twileytwiley Posts: 1,923
    I think not only the shipping is an issue but the feedback system in general is completely flawed. I sell and buy on ebay and I dont like the feedback system especially when buying from people. The one thing that gets to me is when an auction or sale ends. I won and I pay the person right away they hold my feedback hostage even though my part is complete and done. So I dont leave them feedback. I have had one seller(gametimecollectables) block me cause I wont leave feedback casue my feedback is still being held hostage... Its a joke. It should be a seller should leave feedback as soon as you pay them. Holding your feedback hostage until you leave feedback for them is wrong and should not be allowed on ebay... When I sell as soon as I notice I been paid I leave the person feedback. I think sellers who charge high ship rates and hold feedback hostage are lame sellers reguardless of what they have for sale...
  • <<<It should be a seller should leave feedback as soon as you pay them. Holding your feedback hostage until you leave feedback for them is wrong and should not be allowed on ebay... >>>

    In a different, more perfect world, nobody would disagree. Unfortunately, there are just too many stories out there where decent sellers have been burned by leaving feedback first and then getting nailed by unscrupulous buyers. If the buyers were all like you twiley, it would be a different story perhaps. Walmart can survive bad publicity or a few disgruntled customers. An ebay seller with 100 positives and 10 (or far less) negatives can be severely impacted.
    Mark B.

    Seeking primarily PSA graded pre-war "type" cards

    My PSA Registry Sets

    34 Goudey, 75 Topps Mini, Hall of Fame Complete Set, 1985 Topps Tiffany, Hall of Fame Players Complete Set
  • WinPitcherWinPitcher Posts: 27,726 ✭✭✭
    they hold my feedback hostage even though my part is complete and done.

    I disagree, your part is done when you have the item and are satisfied, then you are done. Then you as the buyer should leave feedback, email or just move on.

    As a seller I leave feedback first for my regular customers. New people I wait and see what happens.

    As for shipping charges I gladly combine it and will max out at 5.00 no matter how many cards you win. My regulars know this and I get higher bids because of it. I at times eat the shipping and charge them a token buck.


    Steve
    Good for you.
  • Downtown1974Downtown1974 Posts: 6,690 ✭✭✭✭✭
    An honest seller has no reason to hold feedback until they receive it first. I know when I sell something, it matches my desription, it is packed well, and shipped promptly.

    I also feel that when I buy from ebay and a seller leaves feedback after I pay, the seller is confident in his item and the way he followed through on the transaction.

    I can see holding feedback if there was a problem with payment or something.

    COF, I dont understand your ebay ethics at all.

    Kaline, I completely agree with you on the whole shipping BS too.
  • twileytwiley Posts: 1,923
    Thus this is my point on how the feedback system is broken on my first post... I will always continue to leave feedback as soon as I am paid. If I get bad feedback from some knucklehead oh well. Its still no excuse for me to hold someones feedback hostage especially after I been paid...
  • cardbendercardbender Posts: 1,831 ✭✭


    << <i>I think not only the shipping is an issue but the feedback system in general is completely flawed. I sell and buy on ebay and I dont like the feedback system especially when buying from people. The one thing that gets to me is when an auction or sale ends. I won and I pay the person right away they hold my feedback hostage even though my part is complete and done. So I dont leave them feedback. I have had one seller(gametimecollectables) block me cause I wont leave feedback casue my feedback is still being held hostage... Its a joke. It should be a seller should leave feedback as soon as you pay them. Holding your feedback hostage until you leave feedback for them is wrong and should not be allowed on ebay... When I sell as soon as I notice I been paid I leave the person feedback. I think sellers who charge high ship rates and hold feedback hostage are lame sellers reguardless of what they have for sale... >>



    Great post. I couldn't agree more.

    I too have won a few cards from Gametimecollectibles on ebay. They do play feedback hostage. On my last three purchases from them: I paid with paypal within three days of auction closing date on the first item, they then took 21 days to ship item and gave a lame excuse of some well-known priest dying as the reason for their shipping delay. Apparently this seller is a religious fanatic. They don't end items on Sundays fo this reason too. ...whatever. They then had the ball$ to ask me to post feedback for them before posting it for me. To which I responded, as a buyer I only post it for sellers after they post it for me after my reasonably quick payment. They didn't post feedback for me on this item either.

    Next item, I paid w/pp again within a couple of days of auction end date, on this one they took 18 days to ship. Excuse: sickness in the family. During this transaction while waiting for them to ship the card on about the 10th day after paying, I won yet another item (the third one).

    I thought I would wait until the second item arrived before making payment. They then sent me a payment reminder after the 4th day for this item. I emailed back and said I would be happy to pay them as fast as they ship. Once the second card arrived, I made a paypal payment for the third item. That one arrived within a week, no delays. I live in Wisconsin, they live in Minnesota. Shipping should take 2 days via USPS.

    I decided to be cool about the delays and the feedback hostage situation and post pos. feedback for them on one of the items I won. They did post me pos. fb in return but still held the other two transactions hostage.

    Funny thing is they tout themselves on their listings as having over 18,000 positives and no negatives. When in my mind they probably have deserved a few negs for some for the lame excuses given for the shipping delays, the slow shipping, shoddy packaging, and feedback hostage they use.

    As far as I know I'm not blocked from bidding with them yet.
  • WabittwaxWabittwax Posts: 1,984 ✭✭✭
    One thing to remember is that just because a seller doesn't leave feedback right away, doesn't mean they are holding it hostage. I generally will leave feedback every week or 2 for all my completed auctions. It saves me a lot of time. I'm always honest and would never leave a neg because a buyer did. It just makes my life easier to do it that way. I'm sort of in between a casual ebay seller (who would have no problem seeing who paid each day for the 5 items he listed that week) and a big ebay seller (who requires an automated feedback system to keep track of it all). If I wind up getting much bigger on ebay someday, I'll have to look into an automated system, but last thing I need is another auction service to pay fees to.
  • WinPitcherWinPitcher Posts: 27,726 ✭✭✭
    An honest seller has no reason to hold feedback until they receive it first. I know when I sell something, it matches my desription, it is packed well, and shipped promptly.

    What happens if the buyer does not agree that you sent an item that matched the description, wasnot packed well, or was not shipped promptly?
    What happens if it gets lost in the mail? You have left feedback and the buyer is a freak?

    I too do all the things listed above, i just do not feel the transaction is done simply when payment is made.

    The transaction is completed when the buyer has the item, is satisfied and lets me know. They can let me know with feedback, an email or just silence.


    Steve
    Good for you.
  • twileytwiley Posts: 1,923


    << <i>

    << <i>I think not only the shipping is an issue but the feedback system in general is completely flawed. I sell and buy on ebay and I dont like the feedback system especially when buying from people. The one thing that gets to me is when an auction or sale ends. I won and I pay the person right away they hold my feedback hostage even though my part is complete and done. So I dont leave them feedback. I have had one seller(gametimecollectables) block me cause I wont leave feedback casue my feedback is still being held hostage... Its a joke. It should be a seller should leave feedback as soon as you pay them. Holding your feedback hostage until you leave feedback for them is wrong and should not be allowed on ebay... When I sell as soon as I notice I been paid I leave the person feedback. I think sellers who charge high ship rates and hold feedback hostage are lame sellers reguardless of what they have for sale... >>



    Great post. I couldn't agree more.

    I too have won a few cards from Gametimecollectibles on ebay. They do play feedback hostage. On my last three purchases from them: I paid with paypal within three days of auction closing date on the first item, they then took 21 days to ship item and gave a lame excuse of some well-known priest dying as the reason for their shipping delay. Apparently this seller is a religious fanatic. They don't end items on Sundays fo this reason too. ...whatever. They then had the ball$ to ask me to post feedback for them before posting it for me. To which I responded, as a buyer I only post it for sellers after they post it for me after my reasonably quick payment. They didn't post feedback for me on this item either.

    Next item, I paid w/pp again within a couple of days of auction end date, on this one they took 18 days to ship. Excuse: sickness in the family. During this transaction while waiting for them to ship the card on about the 10th day after paying, I won yet another item (the third one).

    I thought I would wait until the second item arrived before making payment. They then sent me a payment reminder after the 4th day for this item. I emailed back and said I would be happy to pay them as fast as they ship. Once the second card arrived, I made a paypal payment for the third item. That one arrived within a week, no delays. I live in Wisconsin, they live in Minnesota. Shipping should take 2 days via USPS.

    I decided to be cool about the delays and the feedback hostage situation and post pos. feedback for them on one of the items I won. They did post me pos. fb in return but still held the other two transactions hostage.

    Funny thing is they tout themselves on their listings as having over 18,000 positives and no negatives. When in my mind they probably have deserved a few negs for some for the lame excuses given for the shipping delays, the slow shipping, shoddy packaging, and feedback hostage they use.

    As far as I know I'm not blocked from bidding with them yet. >>



    WOW I notice a trend here. I won a card from them paid them within 5 minutes of auction end thru paypal. 3 weeks go by no card. I email asking if I did something wrong on the payment I made. I got the same reply as you about the priest and how all cards that have been paid for that week have been shipped. I still have the envelope with the actual date it was shipped and the email with date and time. The email reply was on Nov 23. The card was not shipped until Dec 4th. So he out right lied... Doesnt matter to me he blocked me cause I will not buy from him again...

    Steve D - Sorry but dissagree far as feedback goes. My end far as feedback is done when I paid and I should receive feedback after I pay the seller. There is no reason for the seller to hold my feedback hostage until I leave feedback for them especially after they have the money...

    There are a few sellers out there that do leave feedback before you get your card. One that comes to mind is 4_sharp_corners however they are very steep on the topic of shipping. They are now charging 4 bucks for shipping on 1 card and 2 dollars additional for each card up to 6 cards then its 25 cents a card there after. Even though they are steep they still have killer deals on high quality cards so I cant complain to much about the 3-5 bucks extra I pay in shipping when I score a 200 dollar card for less then 1/2 the SMR...


  • cardbendercardbender Posts: 1,831 ✭✭


    << <i>An honest seller has no reason to hold feedback until they receive it first. I know when I sell something, it matches my desription, it is packed well, and shipped promptly.

    What happens if the buyer does not agree that you sent an item that matched the description, wasnot packed well, or was not shipped promptly?
    What happens if it gets lost in the mail? You have left feedback and the buyer is a freak?

    I too do all the things listed above, i just do not feel the transaction is done simply when payment is made.

    The transaction is completed when the buyer has the item, is satisfied and lets me know. They can let me know with feedback, an email or just silence.


    Steve >>



    Hi Steve,
    I understand both sides of the fence. I just choose as a seller to post fb after I get paid. Sure, I know I leave myself open to negs or neutrals but that's the dice I'm willing to roll. I just had a guy email me last night asking where his card was. He paid via PP on April 9th, I shipped on April 10th and left him a positive. I checked USPS and they said the card was delivered on April 14th. This guy lives in Beverly Hills, CA.

    His pp confirmed address was different than his buyer's address. Like it was being mailed to his girlsfriends or maybe his wifes' address with a diff. last name. I followed the pp guidelines and mailed the item to the confirmed pp address. So at this point maybe I'll get a negative. I could really care less since I got paid and did my job. I shipped quickly and the card was well packaged. USPS did their job and delivered it. He can't do a charge back because I shipped with DC to his confirmed pp address. Maybe this buyer need's to check with his house mates for the whereabouts of the package. It's now on them.

    If I get a neg. for this transaction, I'll block him from bidding or buying from me in the future. I have 150 knuckleheads on my blocked bidder list currently, so adding another one won't bother me or my business at all. I'm the kind of guy who trusts people until they screw me over, then I won't do business with them in the future.

    Sure, sellers who post fb right away leave themselves open to negs, but frankly I think it's a fairly good business practive to follow and I'm sure that most sellers who do this have already thought out the consequences of their actions. It's mostly called goodwill and trust.

    Also, anyone use the new ebay fb feature yet? It's a real pain. It's optional to leave detailed fb but now when you click on feedback you only see like 10 trans. at a time instead of the old 25 at a time. Ebay again messes up something that wasn't broken.

    Rich
  • Downtown1974Downtown1974 Posts: 6,690 ✭✭✭✭✭


    << <i>An honest seller has no reason to hold feedback until they receive it first. I know when I sell something, it matches my desription, it is packed well, and shipped promptly.

    What happens if the buyer does not agree that you sent an item that matched the description, wasnot packed well, or was not shipped promptly?
    What happens if it gets lost in the mail? You have left feedback and the buyer is a freak?

    I too do all the things listed above, i just do not feel the transaction is done simply when payment is made.

    The transaction is completed when the buyer has the item, is satisfied and lets me know. They can let me know with feedback, an email or just silence.


    Steve >>



    Steve, I have no control over how the seller will react to a sale, or how the postal system operates. All I can tell you is that when a sale is made two things happen. 1) The buyer pays for the item. 2) The seller sends item buyer paid for. If the buyer pays promptly, what else is he responsible for? Nothing. So I give a + FB when I get paid.
    I agree that there are scum bags out there who will neg you over something stupid. I guess I take my chances that the item wont get damaged in transit or lost in the mail.

  • DerekDDerekD Posts: 388 ✭✭


    << <i>

    Steve, I have no control over how the seller will react to a sale, or how the postal system operates. All I can tell you is that when a sale is made two things happen. 1) The buyer pays for the item. 2) The seller sends item buyer paid for. If the buyer pays promptly, what else is he responsible for? Nothing. >>



    Hi Bob,

    Do you not think the buyer is responsible for being honest about receiving the item and the condition the item was in when they received it?

    I'm mostly a buyer (100:1), and I definitely believe my responsiblities go well beyond me just paying.

    Just my thoughts,
    DD
  • twileytwiley Posts: 1,923
    Isn't the purpose of the seller leaving feedback for the buyer mainly about the buyers actions on the payment of the auction/sale?

    Ebay feedback system is flawed as well as the shipping there is no doubt. I think for all the fees ebay charges for using their site the least they can do is correct these issues. They can easily require sellers to ship for cost and not make extra $ on the shipping. They can require sellers to put in weight demensions etc etc and determine the shipping costs automatically. They also need to redo the entire feedback system. Maybe have it so a seller is required to leave feedback before they can receive possitive feedback from the buyer. Have it so the buyer can't give feedback until they recieve feedback from the seller. The can also have a section where the buyer can report an item as missing/stolen and go thru the process before they can leave negative feedback. They can also have a section if the item is not paid for where the seller can go thru the process before leaving negative feedback. You would see a LOT of possitive changes on ebay thats for sure. I know it can be done cause I did something similar on my website...

    As a buyer I feel I am done when I made payment providing the seller did not leave me feedback prior to receiving the card. If the seller leaves me feedback before I get my item I dont concider my end done until I leave that seller feedback. I been using ebay for only 4 years now and have bought many many items but my feedback is very low 150ish. The reason is 9 out of 10 sellers are still holding my feedback hostage. Like I said before its a joke...
  • <<< I been using ebay for only 4 years now and have bought many many items but my feedback is very low 150ish.>>>

    twiley....I think you answered your own question. Either you buy from or sell to the same people frequently or you take away the incentive to leave feedback for you by providing your feedback before the buyer does.

    EBAY is not like a retail store where you physically handle the items you buy before you pay. A transaction is not complete until both parties are happy and the only way to conclude that both parties are happy is to receive feedback from the buyer first. You can continue to take what you consider to be "the high road" but don't complain about the low FB totals. That's reality and EBAY is not going to force sellers to leave FB first just because they get paid. Too many bad things can happen after the check is cashed. I could list them all but it would take me all day.

    Mark B.

    Seeking primarily PSA graded pre-war "type" cards

    My PSA Registry Sets

    34 Goudey, 75 Topps Mini, Hall of Fame Complete Set, 1985 Topps Tiffany, Hall of Fame Players Complete Set
  • twileytwiley Posts: 1,923
    FWIW I only buy from certain sellers who dont jerk me around in anyway what so ever.. Like hold my FB hostage... I buy more then I sell on ebay. I could careless on my total FB or what my % is... Like i said its flawed and 100% inaccurate anyway...
  • "FWIW I only buy from certain sellers who dont jerk me around in anyway what so ever"

    you have your answer about feedback totals. feedback only counts once from the same buyer or seller. In terms of you not caring what your fb % is, your days as a reputable seller may be short lived, buddy.
    Mark B.

    Seeking primarily PSA graded pre-war "type" cards

    My PSA Registry Sets

    34 Goudey, 75 Topps Mini, Hall of Fame Complete Set, 1985 Topps Tiffany, Hall of Fame Players Complete Set
  • twileytwiley Posts: 1,923
    I have known how it works for the past 4 years...LOL I posted my FB total to show how lame FB hostage blackmailing is...


    >>your days as a reputable seller may be short lived, buddy

    I highly doubt that...As a seller I give full detailed description with front and backs pictures of all the cards I sell. I get paid, I leave FB, I mail the next day. I only started to sell a 3 months ago. Most who have bought from me come back cause they know.... I treat the buyers the way I would like to be treated... I dont see how that will be short lived...

    I said all I needed to..

    have a good day...
  • As of today I noticed the new feedback system for sellers was in place. Hopefully this helps shed light on the true nature of a seller.
  • fiveninerfiveniner Posts: 4,109 ✭✭✭


    << <i>image

    I gotta b**tch again! I am getting tired and frustrated again when I buy cheaper cards and pay $2-$4 shipping
    and I get the card in a regular envelope with ABSOLUTELY NO PROTECTION and a 55 cent stamp on it.

    It is happening more and more frequently.

    And, I might add I don't want to hear crybabies talking about the card only brought BLAH BLAH BLAH and they
    don't make money if they have to pay more for shipping the card! I NEVER NEVER have and l NEVER NEVER
    will, in any future auctions, cut corners, just because my card brought less than what I thought in order for me to
    make money. This is NOT an acceptable practice under ANY circumstances. This is just poor business!

    I've done this long enough to know how this should be done and it is expected, especially if I pay the full
    boat on the shipping!

    Tony >>



    Tony,

    I fully agree with you 100%

    The Other Tony
    Tony(AN ANGEL WATCHES OVER ME)
  • WinPitcherWinPitcher Posts: 27,726 ✭✭✭
    3/4 of the time I too leave feedback upon payment. it is the 1/4 of the time that i wait and see if the buyer is ok with the deal.

    The transaction is not done as far as the buyer is concerned when he pays. It is done when he gets it and is happy. Then it is done. I do not hold feedback 'hostage' i wait until I know that the buyer is happy. Again I know this if they leave me an email, feedback or just nothing. If it is 'nothing' after a few weeks I leave it then.......maybe.

    Steve
    Good for you.
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