Dick Dietz or Gene Tenance ???

jaxxr

Hard to choose between these two catchers, who could hit and walk.

Both poor baserunners and barely average fielders, both stuckout more than they walked, Both have some impressive on base numbers, regardless of the fact that they were not too "dangerous" if they were on first base.

Career stats show Dietz hit for a better average by 20 points over Tenance, also got OB more by 2 percentage points, Gene had the better SLG% by 4 points , and OPS+ by 5.,
Peak seasons show Dietz had a higher OPS+ by 7 points, and drove in 107 runs one season, while Gene's best was 84, quite a difference. The RC ( runs created ) stat has a seaon high of 108 for Dick, with 86 being tops for Tenance.

Gene did hang on a few years more than Dietz. It's fairly close, perhaps Gene's time played gives him the slight edge. They both have better lifetime OB% and OPS+, than Ron Santo or Jim Rice by the way.

I believe I'd narrowly pick Dick Dietz, primarily because as a hitter, that's hitter not walker, the primary function is to get a hit , therefore Dick's BA , which was higher raw than Gene's, was also 1 point above the adjusted league average, while Gene hit at some 14 points below the adjusted average hitter.

grote15

Tell the truth, jaxxr, you just want to rile up dallas now, don't you?

Edit to say: I've been critical of Gene Tenace in certain threads in the past, but he had a far better carreer and was a much better player than Dick Dietz.

Also, Dietz played in only about 600 games, or not even four full seasons. Tenace played in more than twice that many games, scored about three times as many runs, had more than twice as many hits, three times as many home runs, twice as many RBIs, and was a 3-time World Series champion (winning the WS MVP in 1972). It's an absolutely foolish exercise, IMO, to compare these two players.

dallasactuary

I guess I have picked on George Sisler once too often. Bring it on, Jack, but you're going to have to do better than a catcher who played two - count 'em, two - full seasons.

Still, I notice that you are looking at what matters, now, and you did find a very good - if only part-time - player.

jaxxr

To be frank about it,

I was checking a site for a fantasy/simulation league, and saw Dietz actually had a higher OB plus rate than Tenance. So I looked into the stats deeper. Dick Dietz was a decent batter.

It's true Dietz had less full seasons than Tenance, but did have a better peak season , especially in those Important to the game's result, RBIs !!!

The real point is, the use of stats can imply many things, if most important is on base percentage, Dietz was better than Tenance, also better than Ron Santo or Jim Rice. Baseball, while very detailed and intricate, still values runs as the only stat in determining the best team on a given day.

Runs, driving them in and scoring them are what really counts. The final result is based on the team has the players who got the most. Some times we cant see the forrest for the trees.

Cubfan

Jack, Seeking advice for your team eh? Its probably a worthless effort as Tenace will probably be someone's number one pick .

jaxxr

Okay, you caught me Keith.

Our simulation league states the player's performance will be based on a COMBINATION of peak and career stats. Dietz did have a better peak year than Tenance, however Gene prevails over the long haul. Factor in their price and it is very close.

I'll probably go with Johnny Wockenfuss ( not walk and fuss, which boosts your OB% ), he can also help by being able to play 1B, LF, RF too, and can actually steal a base occasionally !

BobaFett72

can Rich Gedman be our other option

I've played softball with his brother, he's a heck of a nice guy. lol.