Does it surprise you? CNG is very conservative anyway, and this particular one must have gotten an extra point or two due to its colour and eye appeal. Very pretty.
<< <i>Does it surprise you? CNG is very conservative anyway, and this particular one must have gotten an extra point or two due to its colour and eye appeal. Very pretty. >>
It's not just CNG I've seen the same thing with a few other dealers as well.
<< <i>Does it surprise you? CNG is very conservative anyway, and this particular one must have gotten an extra point or two due to its colour and eye appeal. Very pretty. >>
It's not just CNG I've seen the same thing with a few other dealers as well. >>
Ah yes, but it sold for an NGC MS64 value ($632.50 including the commision).
<< <i>Does it surprise you? CNG is very conservative anyway, and this particular one must have gotten an extra point or two due to its colour and eye appeal. Very pretty. >>
It's not just CNG I've seen the same thing with a few other dealers as well. >>
Ah yes, but it sold for an NGC MS64 value ($632.50 including the commision). >>
The coin is now listed for $950 and I'm sure it has something to do with the MS64.
Here's another from CNG :1875 5 drs, sold for $2185 incl. com. (estimate $750) , slabbed later as NGC MS64 and resold for $3950. Something tells me that we're talking about the same shop.
The coin is now listed for $950 and I'm sure it has something to do with the MS64.
Of course it has. There's a risk involved when buying a raw coin, and not all gEFs slab at 64. And there's plenty of buyers who don't have the time or the knowledge to cherrypick these coins, so they prefer and can afford to buy them slabbed at a premium from a shop that they trust, it's only fair for the shop, and frankly, I do not find the markups unethical at all. In the case of the Greek coin, if it slabbed at 62 it would have been a $1000 coin, but as a 64 its (second) price was legit.
<< <i>The coin is now listed for $950 and I'm sure it has something to do with the MS64.
Of course it has. There's a risk involved when buying a raw coin, and not all gEFs slab at 64. And there's plenty of buyers who don't have the time or the knowledge to cherrypick these coins, so they prefer and can afford to buy them slabbed at a premium from a shop that they trust, it's only fair for the shop, and frankly, I do not find the markups unethical at all. In the case of the Greek coin, if it slabbed at 62 it would have been a $1000 coin, but as a 64 its (second) price was legit. >>
I think the decriptions they use are sometimes a bit unethical. I see too much of the price guide only goes to EF and no price for uncirculated.
Caveat emptor! Well, hopefully we decide what is worth the price and what is not. This coin is a little early for me but does not seem that exciting & the new premium will dissuade the educated buyer but not, perhaps the buyer shopping for slab grades. This is a real issue but if we are careful perhaps there are still relative "bargains" to be found.
Love that Milled British (1830-1960) Well, just Love coins, period.
<< <i> I think the decriptions they use are sometimes a bit unethical. I see too much of the price guide only goes to EF and no price for uncirculated. >>
I am not convinced that the descriptions are a bit unethical, I am more convinced that gEF has a broader range than most collectors think and sometimes an unc grade is appropriate.
In this instance, a 1723 Shilling is a fairly common date and readily available in high circ grades and even unc. I would not pay $900 for a 64... too much for that date.
Experience the World through Numismatics...it's more than you can imagine.
Coinkat & Syracusian, I guess I'm a little too tough on the grading companies sometimes. This also wasn't just directed at any one dealer, I just see too much of this on ebay anymore.
<< <i> I think the decriptions they use are sometimes a bit unethical. I see too much of the price guide only goes to EF and no price for uncirculated. >>
I am not convinced that the descriptions are a bit unethical, I am more convinced that gEF has a broader range than most collectors think and sometimes an unc grade is appropriate.
In this instance, a 1723 Shilling is a fairly common date and readily available in high circ grades and even unc. I would not pay $900 for a 64... too much for that date. >>
Frankly, many Brit and Euro dealers could stand to use more top-tier TPGs to hold their feet to the fire, if nothing else. Scrutiny is good. It's easy to be a lazy auctioneer or dealer and call 90% of the truly uncirculated coins gEF, and then exclaim, "Look how much this coin realized in our auction!!!" In a fully aware market, the coin(s) will generally realize their true "value", notwithstanding the auctioneer's opinion.
Some people of late have complained about Heritage, etal. not fully disclosing all the "warts" on many given lots. Well, the same is so much more true in auctions 'across the pond'. I recently received a coin which had a nice image, albeit small, and a glowing "report". This coin will be going back. Even NGC, would have BB'd this coin because of the mechanical damage. ANACS might be gracious and net it out at AU53.
Also, my NGC MS64 value comment earlier was based on the same date (but much less WOW colour) which had approx. a $695 ask ($$ sold for maybe less). I would presume that the buyer of the subject coin knew full well that it would at least go "64" based on previous graded submissions, and purchased accordingly. Even it only sells for $8-825 then that will keep some vittles on the plate, eh.
There is always someone who will spend more than what you want for what you have to sell; most of the time, only the current subjectivity of auction buyers will tell.
I don't believe TPG's control everything, yet. Certainly, some rare TPG's like CNG may decide to sell a particular coin based on what they paid for it, rather than what it's market value is. it's a good way to build a valuable reputation:conservative grading and prices. That only goes so far, however...
Beautiful coin, but only one way to ascertain true value- certainly no less than 3 quality mainstream dealers should look at this coin, take current market grading into consideration and then go from there. If it should be slabbed in a general direction, then so be it.
Certainly go to eBay and see what it brings with your minimum satisfactory bid- I mean, what are you risking? ...a couple of dollars and maybe you get lucky?
I see many buyers paying unconscious prices on eBay, a lot of which I attribute to lack of market knowledge, but a lot with the knowledge of very up-to-date regional scarcity which we may not aware of yet..
I have an eBay friend who sells 800 year old books in the $20 to $250K price range without worrying about auction houses (exceptions certainly exist), so why not really valuable coins?
ed for punc/spl
One of the penalties for refusing to participate in politics is that you end up being governed by inferiors. – Plato
But I am concerned that maybe some may not know the difference between a coin that is a POS that has the issues of which you speak and another that is terrific. How can both be gEF? That part does not pass the straight face test... yet it is happening as we write.
Experience the World through Numismatics...it's more than you can imagine.
Comments
myEbay
DPOTD 3
<< <i>Does it surprise you? CNG is very conservative anyway, and this particular one must have gotten an extra point or two due to its colour and eye appeal. Very pretty. >>
It's not just CNG I've seen the same thing with a few other dealers as well.
<< <i>
<< <i>Does it surprise you? CNG is very conservative anyway, and this particular one must have gotten an extra point or two due to its colour and eye appeal. Very pretty. >>
It's not just CNG I've seen the same thing with a few other dealers as well. >>
Ah yes, but it sold for an NGC MS64 value ($632.50 including the commision).
<< <i>
<< <i>
<< <i>Does it surprise you? CNG is very conservative anyway, and this particular one must have gotten an extra point or two due to its colour and eye appeal. Very pretty. >>
It's not just CNG I've seen the same thing with a few other dealers as well. >>
Ah yes, but it sold for an NGC MS64 value ($632.50 including the commision).
The coin is now listed for $950 and I'm sure it has something to do with the MS64.
myEbay
DPOTD 3
Of course it has. There's a risk involved when buying a raw coin, and not all gEFs slab at 64. And there's plenty of buyers who don't have the time or the knowledge to cherrypick these coins, so they prefer and can afford to buy them slabbed at a premium from a shop that they trust, it's only fair for the shop, and frankly, I do not find the markups unethical at all. In the case of the Greek coin, if it slabbed at 62 it would have been a $1000 coin, but as a 64 its (second) price was legit.
myEbay
DPOTD 3
<< <i>The coin is now listed for $950 and I'm sure it has something to do with the MS64.
Of course it has. There's a risk involved when buying a raw coin, and not all gEFs slab at 64. And there's plenty of buyers who don't have the time or the knowledge to cherrypick these coins, so they prefer and can afford to buy them slabbed at a premium from a shop that they trust, it's only fair for the shop, and frankly, I do not find the markups unethical at all. In the case of the Greek coin, if it slabbed at 62 it would have been a $1000 coin, but as a 64 its (second) price was legit. >>
I think the decriptions they use are sometimes a bit unethical. I see too much of the price guide only goes to EF and no price for uncirculated.
Well, just Love coins, period.
<< <i> I think the decriptions they use are sometimes a bit unethical. I see too much of the price guide only goes to EF and no price for uncirculated. >>
I am not convinced that the descriptions are a bit unethical, I am more convinced that gEF has a broader range than most collectors think and sometimes an unc grade is appropriate.
In this instance, a 1723 Shilling is a fairly common date and readily available in high circ grades and even unc. I would not pay $900 for a 64... too much for that date.
Experience the World through Numismatics...it's more than you can imagine.
directed at any one dealer, I just see too much of this on ebay anymore.
<< <i>
<< <i> I think the decriptions they use are sometimes a bit unethical. I see too much of the price guide only goes to EF and no price for uncirculated. >>
I am not convinced that the descriptions are a bit unethical, I am more convinced that gEF has a broader range than most collectors think and sometimes an unc grade is appropriate.
In this instance, a 1723 Shilling is a fairly common date and readily available in high circ grades and even unc. I would not pay $900 for a 64... too much for that date. >>
Frankly, many Brit and Euro dealers could stand to use more top-tier TPGs to hold their feet to the fire, if nothing else. Scrutiny is good. It's easy to be a lazy auctioneer or dealer and call 90% of the truly uncirculated coins gEF, and then exclaim, "Look how much this coin realized in our auction!!!" In a fully aware market, the coin(s) will generally realize their true "value", notwithstanding the auctioneer's opinion.
Some people of late have complained about Heritage, etal. not fully disclosing all the "warts" on many given lots. Well, the same is so much more true in auctions 'across the pond'. I recently received a coin which had a nice image, albeit small, and a glowing "report". This coin will be going back. Even NGC, would have BB'd this coin because of the mechanical damage.
Also, my NGC MS64 value comment earlier was based on the same date (but much less WOW colour) which had approx. a $695 ask ($$ sold for maybe less). I would presume that the buyer of the subject coin knew full well that it would at least go "64" based on previous graded submissions, and purchased accordingly. Even it only sells for $8-825 then that will keep some vittles on the plate, eh.
I don't believe TPG's control everything, yet. Certainly, some rare TPG's like CNG may decide to sell a particular coin based on what they paid for it, rather than what it's market value is. it's a good way to build a valuable reputation:conservative grading and prices. That only goes so far, however...
Beautiful coin, but only one way to ascertain true value- certainly no less than 3 quality mainstream dealers should look at this coin, take current market grading into consideration and then go from there. If it should be slabbed in a general direction, then so be it.
Certainly go to eBay and see what it brings with your minimum satisfactory bid- I mean, what are you risking? ...a couple of dollars and maybe you get lucky?
I see many buyers paying unconscious prices on eBay, a lot of which I attribute to lack of market knowledge, but a lot with the knowledge of very up-to-date regional scarcity which we may not aware of yet..
I have an eBay friend who sells 800 year old books in the $20 to $250K price range without worrying about auction houses (exceptions certainly exist), so why not really valuable coins?
ed for punc/spl
is that you end up being governed by inferiors. – Plato
I agree with you...
But I am concerned that maybe some may not know the difference between a coin that is a POS that has the issues of which you speak and another that is terrific. How can both be gEF? That part does not pass the straight face test... yet it is happening as we write.
Experience the World through Numismatics...it's more than you can imagine.