Bond's card pulled from Ebay, help
morgansforever
Posts: 8,465 ✭✭✭✭✭
I listed an 88 Score Bond's autograph card for a friend. The card is authenticated by PSA/DNA, and Ebay pulled it because of violates intellectual property rights. The card was purchased from Ebay, some time ago. I used the PAS/DNA link in the listing, so buyer's could verify the card themselves. Why doesn't anyone tell you what was violated? This is the explanation from Ebay: "The rights owner, Killer Bee, Inc. / Killer Bee Memorabilia, Inc. / Pro Access, Inc., notified eBay that this listing violates intellectual property rights. When eBay receives a report of this type of violation, we remove the listing to comply with the law". Then it goes on to say legal action could be taken. Great just what I need. Why is it a secret? What did I do wrong? I did insert a PAS/DNA link, in the listing, this was recommended by PAS/DNA. I have already contacted isitreal@barrybonds.com, waiting for a response.
Any help would be great.
morgans
Any help would be great.
morgans
World coins FSHO Hundreds of successful BST transactions U.S. coins FSHO
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Comments
I'll keep the members here updated on the results, I hope it's not a forgery.
Geordie
Dodgers collection scans | Brett Butler registry | 1978 Dodgers - straight 9s, homie
The only thing I can think of is that I used the PAS/DNA logo and link. PAS/DNA offers the HTML to use in listings, WTF
I called PAS/DNA and they said it was an 88 Score card with his sig. When you enter C42060 on the verification page, comes back as 88 card, with one sig. I don't get it.
Shane
Ebay yanked it already, but I'll give it a shot.
Up for auction is one 1988 Score Barry Bonds autograph card.
Card is authenticated by PAS/DNA, as genuine.
COA and card have matching numbers.
Card has excellent centering, sharp corners, and great color.
Bonds currently has 734 HR's 21 to tie, 22 to break the all time HR record of 755, owned by Hank Aaron.
Could he be the next HR King?
Items pictured are the ones you receive, this is not a stock pic.
Click the PSA/DNA link below to verify card.
The rest is shipping and return policy.
morgans
But it sure doesn't look like Bonds' current sig and that would be a concern.
<< <i>they yanked it because the corners are NOT sharp
I was thinking the same thing. I was wondering why it was listed as such
1994 Pro Line Live
TheDallasCowboyBackfieldProject
Killer Bee Ebay Page
Here is what it says.
Barry Bonds/Killer Bee, Inc. (KBI)
STATEMENT
Killer Bee, Inc. (KBI) is the owner and/or authorized licensor and protector of various intellectual properties including, but not limited to, the Stylized HR-Man trademark, 660 HR trademark, 700 HR trademark, the trademarked name and signature of Barry Bonds, as well as the name, nickname, likeness, and facsimile signature of Barry Bonds.
KBI is committed to protecting Mr. Bonds' fans and collectors who buy and sell memorabilia and collectibles on eBay. That is why KBI participates in the VeRO program, which allows KBI to notify eBay of auctions that are suspected to be fraudulent or unlicensed.
Fans can e-mail a picture (or web-link) of an auction item they are planning to buy or sell to IsItReal@BarryBonds.com. The item will be reviewed by a Bonds handwriting expert and, if necessary, by Mr. Bonds himself, to determine if the item is authentic prior to purchase or sale.
Should you wish to apply for a license to produce Bonds products, e-mail your proposal to IsItReal@BarryBonds.com and type KBI Licensing Proposal in the Subject line of the header.
INFRINGEMENTS
Team Bonds actively participates in eBay's VeRO program, which protects the rights of intellectual property owners, and we frequently review items on eBay claiming to be authentic Bonds product.
If a product is deemed to fall into any of the following categories of infringement, we report it to eBay and they de-list that auction:
1. Suspected counterfeit signature or product (over 95% of KBI de-listing requests);
2. Unlicensed use of Barry Bonds' name or likeness;
3. Misrepresentation of game use or game issue;
4. Suspected fake COA or hologram.
If your auction has been de-listed at the request of KBI and you feel that there has been an error, please feel free to e-mail the following information to IsItReal@BarryBonds.com for further review by Team Bonds (please bear in mind that, once your auction has been de-listed, we cannot refer back to it to obtain the requested information):
1. eBay Auction Number
2. Seller I.D.
3. Date of Removal
4. Type of Item/Description
5. Origin of Item/COA Information
6. JPEG or BMP of the Item (Image must be clear enough to review)
If, after further review, your item is deemed to be authentic, we will notify eBay to reinstate your auction.
We recognize that there are many items for auction on eBay that are not authentic or are unlicensed. We are doing everything we can to de-list these auctions and protect Mr. Bonds' fans.
******************
I believe they pulled it because they believe it is fake. The way I understand it is that it looks like they are a watchdog for Bonds autographs on Ebay.
Shane
Feebay claims it's trademark misuse, nothing about the corners, thats a matter of opinion.
Yes I have, all ready e-mailed IsItReal@BarryBonds.com , waiting for a reply.
morgans
<< <i><<they yanked it because the corners are NOT sharp>>
Feebay claims it's trademark misuse, nothing about the corners, thats a matter of opinion. >>
He was just kidding about the corners being the reason it got yanked
Accurate desciptions do go a long way though.
1994 Pro Line Live
TheDallasCowboyBackfieldProject
Shane
<< <i>All right, All right, the corners are not sharp. In fact they are the ugliest corners ever, no other card in the Milky Way Galaxy is as ugly as this, is that better. The issue is Trademark. >>
Didnt mean to rile you up. No need to overgrade, or undergrade either. Just tell it how it is.
I apologize for the Galaxy comment, just irritated thats all. I punched a couple of holes in my bathroom door, feels good to let it out.
I appreciate all the input, keep it coming. Going to my girl's house be back in an hour.
morgans
Of course, I'm just guessing... but it definitely is in their best interest to cut down the number of eBay sales of cards that don't feature the current Bonds mark. Reminds me of when the movie studios squash eBay sales of the Chinese and Hong Kong versions of Jet Li films that STILL haven't been released here, just because they own the US distro rights to all possible future products.
mosaic's Nolan Ryan Basic Topps registry set
mosaic's Big 3 Nolan Ryan Run Showcase
I wanted to get Bonds to sign a photo that I took of him back in 1987 at spring training. In 1989??, he did a card show with Bobby Bonilla in King of Prussia, PA and I got the following signature, price was $10.00 back then:
A few years later, he did another card show in Willow Grove, PA and I had the same photo blown up to poster size and he signed it this way:
Both were signed right in front of me.
Ken Griffey Jr was another player that completely changed his signature early in his career.
Photos That Were Used On Baseball Cards
<< <i><<Didnt mean to rile you up. No need to overgrade, or undergrade either. Just tell it how it is.>>
I apologize for the Galaxy comment, just irritated thats all. I punched a couple of holes in my bathroom door, feels good to let it out.
>>
though they will pull anything reported. Does it look that way to anyone else?"
///////////////////////////////////////
VERO is a complicated entity. EBAY gives 100% deference to VERO reports,
and NEVER questions/investigates a VERO position, allegation or claim. In
theory - and usually in fact - VERO members do protect consumers. Sometimes,
VERO makes errors, and usually corrects them after a thorough look-see; such
corrections can take several weeks.
EBAY insulates itself from liability by claiming both ignorance of the underlying
facts of a counterfeit allegation, and reliance on third-party experts (VERO-
member reps) to validate such allegations.
.....................................................................................................
"... but it definitely is in their best interest to cut down the number
of eBay sales of cards that don't feature the current Bonds mark."
////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////
(They) may well benefit in that sense from a VERO action, but that
is NOT the intent of VERO. IP owners have an absolute right to
protect their valuable property, and collectors/consumers of "authentic"
items benefit from good-faith VERO actions.
I have spoken to alot of VERO reps on the fashion-TM side. All of them
have said that it is "really hard to know for sure" by looking at an EBAY
scan. They usually need original receipts, high-res and detailed photos of
specific areas of a suspect item, and OFTEN the item itself in order to "know
for sure." (If you send them an item that they later determine is "bad," they
destroy it.... you do NOT get it back.)
In the case of the instant card controversy, the PSA documentation may
be a compelling piece of evidence in support of authenticity. If the COA
is counterfiet, PSA/DNA can/will readily make that determination.
Regarding the subject signature: PSA has dozens/hundreds (maybe thousands)
of Bonds exemplars. If the COA is legit, we can be pretty sure that one of those
exemplars was pretty close to the sig on the card.
If PSA/DNA uses any kind of Computer Assisted Authentication ( I do not
know that they do) the software can be adjusted to confirm a match at
X%. ie: "Computer says there is a 94% probability that the sig is auth."
(It would be fun to know what % is "satisfactory" to PSA/DNA.)
As we all know, handing a card to a signatory on the fly produces a VERY
different looking auto. Often, an athlete is walking with the card cupped
in his non-signing palm while he writes his name on the memorabilia. All
that said, the signature does not look like any other that I can easily find;
it is not unreasonable that the Bond's VERO rep would want a closer look.
On EBAY, VERO trumps a PSA/DNA COA at the outset, but the pulling of
a legit auction is ONLY step one in the process. Once VERO is convinced
that there is not a problem, the auction can be relisted; usually from
scratch because EBAY has carp-canned the original into cyber-space.
Good Luck !
storm
Theres a bunch of PSA/DNA Bonds sigs on Ebay, why aren't they pulled, they look fake to me. Wish I could get Killer Bee to get on this forum, and explain what the issue is.
morgans
/////////////////////////////////////////
They will explain the issue(s) in their first response to your email inquiry.
They will tell you what docs you need to provide them to "satisfy" their
concerns.
Bonds sig
morgans
Bonds sig
Bonds Sig
Not accusing/implying that your's is fake, just giving an unbiased observation.
No offense taken, I'm sure every Bonds sig is authentic, except mine.
I'm not sure what this is all about but you're item is "protected" by it's authenticity from PSA/DNA.
Why not just follow the description style like one of these PSA/DNA ebay auctions and relist your item?
Good luck
mike
The card is in a simple screw down holder with a sticker on the back, right?
Even if the numbers do correspond, what prevents you from switching cards?
Again, not accusing you of doing this and honestly hope it works out
////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////
"Reasonable suspicion" by a VERO member is all that is needed.
Many VERO pulls happen when a third-party tells a VERO rep
that a listing "is a problem." If anybody sees other problem
Bonds' sigs on EBAY, they are free to report them. (More
reports are not likely to expedite the resolution of the current
challenge. The more reports filed, the more paperwork to handle,
the more time it takes to get to your own complaint.)
The title of this thread is: "Bond's card pulled from Ebay, help..."
If the operative word is "help," here is some more of that:
Comply with the process, and when VERO asks for docs, simply
provide whatever they ask for.
It may seem like "guilty until proven innocent," but that is the
ONLY way that consumers can be protected under the VERO scheme.
They cannot wait until after the auction is concluded to act; that
would be pointless.
I have personally been at the edges of MANY VERO claims, and I
know that they are not interested in harming legit sellers. When
they are given a chance to solve a problem, they usually do it.
I have seen numerous sellers take a confrontational stance with
VERO, and NONE of those sellers have gotten their problem solved.
Complaints against sellers who are mean and nasty to the IP-owners'
VERO reps ALWAYS get "lost," and are never resolved in the sellers'
favor. (When you read horror stories about "appeals never being
resolved," you can be pretty sure that the seller either did not
furnish the requested docs, or the seller was mean to the rep. The
reps are not interested in being yelled at, and when that happens,
the "round-file" is where the appeal goes.... forever.)
Sellers who are polite and humble in their dealings with VERO, usually
prevail, if their position is correct.
morgans
"Why not just follow the description style like one of these PSA/DNA ebay auctions and relist your item?"
///////////////////////////////////////////////////
Relisting a VERO pull will result in the seller's suspension from EBAY.
It will also lead to a VERY nasty letter from VERO and the IP-owner's
lawyers.
The process in place WORKS. It justs takes alot longer than we all
wish that it did. Weeks, not days, usually.
VERO "trumps" PSA/DNA in any dispute, UNLESS the VERO rep is willing
to "accept" the expert's opinion. The IP-holders' VERO reps are also "experts"
in the items they oversee. Experts often disagree with each other.
My experience with the process is mostly of the fashion side, but the process
is identical on the collectible side.
storm
So don't relist it? I'm confident it was pulled because I used the word rookie, apparently the Vero folks are touchy, I'll get them a tissue.
////////////////////////////////
Your friend's opinion about the word "rookie" could be the problem,
I guess, but I doubt it.
In order to relist the card, under EBAY's TOS, you will need VERO
to notify EBAY that the issue has been resolved.
VERO folks usually only respond to inquiries Monday through Friday.
If Bonds' rep is "busy," it could take a while for him/her to get back
to you.
Relisting w/o VERO's OK is an invite to trouble. The voice of experience
is speaking to you, now.
<< <i>Look at this bs, where's the Killer Bee's?
Bonds sig
morgans >>
that one is signed by Barry Bone..
<< <i>
<< <i>Look at this bs, where's the Killer Bee's?
Bonds sig
morgans >>
that one is signed by Barry Bone.. >>
Yes, the famed adult film star.
This whole thing is just silly, I can't say this or that, because it's Baroid Bonds. I'll be glad to see him out of baseball, he's probably only got a year left, see ya Baroid.