Grade Revealed -- 1899-S PCGS AU-58 $20 Gold Liberty Double Eagle -- Please Post Grading Comments

Stuart

I invite you to Guess the Grade of this 1899-S $20 Gold Liberty Double Eagle, and to please post your observations and comments to keep this thread lively and active.

techeff

That's a 63.

123cents

I think MS-63 too. Nice Double Eagle.

Julio

64. jws

phantom1701

It's a borderline 64. It's a PQ 63 for sure though!

mikeJ

A few bag marks , large scratch at the forehead , rim ding at 12 on the reverse sure take away from the grade. A beautifully struck peice none the less Ms62

roadrunner

A choice MS63+. Possibly a shot to 64.

This is the kind of coin Stuart routinely finds in a MS62 holder.

roadrunner

Longacre

solid 63

circulated

MS63

prooflike

that's a solid 63 all day long.

Mojoe

Very choice 63.

BloodMan

Looks MS63 to me.
The listed Greysheet values are:
MS62-$775
MS63-$1450
MS64-$2600

dizzlecc

I voted au58.

It looks like a see a hint of wear in the fields in front of the nose and maybe even on the nose.

It would be an ms64 in a ngc holder.

jpkinla

I am also going to grade it a MS63 but a "pq" 63......

PerryHall

MS63 If I could examine it in hand, I may reach a different conclusion.

Mesquite

I voted 65. That coin has great luster, a good strike and minimal hits. I own a PCGS MS64 1904. Stuart's coin appears to me to be a notch above mine. If not a PCGS MS 65, then MS64 PQ. That is a very nice $20 DE Stuart.

ziggy29

<< <i>I voted au58. ... It would be an ms64 in a ngc holder. >>


HEY, KOOL-AID!!!

JJM

63 PQ for the grade, nice luster,...nice coin

ttown

MS64

1907Quarter

4

09sVDB

Judging from the pictures(which are always hard to grade from) I would say MS63. I see an average amount of marks and no rub. IMHO

KurtHorn

Too many distracting marks in prime focal areas for a 64. It's an MS 63. So, if it's in a 63 or higher holder leave it there.

Stuart

This has been a great "Guess the Grade" thread with 59 votes and 21 posts so far. The Forum average grade to this point is MS-63, with approximately 90% of the votes between MS-62 and MS-64, giving us an unusual and tightly consistent grading standard deviation.

I'll give everybody one last opportunity to guess the grade on this 1899-S $20 Gold Liberty before posting the answer when this thread sinks back down to page 2 or 3 CU Forum oblivion.

Stuart

This pretty 1899-S $20 Gold Liberty Double Eagle is graded -- PCGS AU-58. Thanks to all who participated in this enjoyable episode of "Guess the Grade".

Disclaimer: Please do not try this at home without either experience or proper adult supervision

ziggy29

Yep -- I was right. Had this been someone else's coin, I would have probably went MS on this one. But I know you have an eye for the supersliders.

I bought a PCGS AU-58 1899-S double eagle a couple weeks ago as well for my type set, and for less than $40 over melt. Looks like this date may get chewed up less frequently than most $20 Libs?

Stuart

Original seller's auction photos in PCGS slab provided below for your reference.

What attracted me to this specific coin in addition to the minimal contact marks was the very strong strike (all stars exhibiting full radial lines) combined with gorgeous strong cartwheel luster.

Mesquite

This is why I leave the grading to the professionals. I find it hard to believe that I screwed the pooch that badly and, in effect, down graded my own coin to an AU57!

Stuart

Mesquite: Thanks very much for your post. Clearly not all AU-58's are equal. In fact, it is surprising how much eye appeal variation one can find between several coins of the same type -- all in PCGS/NGC AU-58 certified slabs.

I have found that PCGS generally does not grade a coin AU-58 unless it has superior eye appeal in addition to having the slightest technical rub. However, I've seen coins in NGC AU-58 holders that range from a high-end of the PCGS AU-58 grading standard, to what PCGS would more typically grade AU-55.

In my personal opinion, an AU-58 should be a coin with full mint luster and the eye appeal of a mint state coin, with only a few minor luster breaks due to minimal circulation.

So, if the coin appears to be circulated at first glance, I usually start by assigning the AU-55 grade and work my way down to the proper grade.

ziggy29

<< <i>In my personal opinion, an AU-58 should be a coin with full mint luster and the eye appeal of a mint state coin, with only a few minor luster breaks due to minimal circulation. >>

I agree. The way I see grading -- at least technical grading -- is that if you can plainly see the wear just from a digital image, it's no better than 55.

Stuart

<< The way I see grading -- at least technical grading -- is that if you can plainly see the wear just from a digital image, it's no better than 55. >>

Ziggy: I agree with your above quoted comment 100%.

clackamas

I voted for Au58.

pragmaticgoat

I voted au58 because it looks like it has been dipped.

Stuart

pragmaticgoat: Thanks for your post. This coin has the eye appeal of an MS-63+ $20 Gold Liberty Double Eagle, with very strong cartwheel luster.

The surfaces appear original to me and the coin does not seem to have been dipped, or at least the luster is strong enough that if it had been dipped a long time ago, the luster has not been discernably diminished from it.

techeff

is that if you can plainly see the wear just from a digital image, it's no better than 55.


You clearly haven't seen enough MS60/61 Liberty Double Eagles...

darktone

light rub and original luster usually gets a low MS grade- light rub and signs of cleaning or mis-handling usually put the coin in the AU58 range.

mhammerman

Sometimes we forget what an honest 58 20 lib looks like, or what an honest eagle looks like either. Nice coin for a nice price...I sense a moderate vacuum near your person.

Coin ON!

Stuart

<< light rub and original luster usually gets a low MS grade- light rub and signs of cleaning or mis-handling usually put the coin in the AU58 range >>

DarkTone: I agree wiith your above quoted comments. This coin has neither any signs of cleaning nor mis-handling...

darktone

Stuart, I was not really talking about any particular coin but just making a statement.

Stuart

<< Stuart, I was not really talking about any particular coin but just making a statement. >>

Darktone: I interpreted your above quoted comment the way that you had intended, and was only providing some additional descriptive information about how this specific coin fits your (and also my) definition of a lower grade mint state $20 Gold Liberty Double Eagle.

No harm, and no foul...

circulated

Has this coin been submitted more than once (that you are aware of)?

The details on both sides are MS60 + ... look at the hair on the obverse and the wings and tail on the obverse. I think its a bad grade and if resubmitted would have, essentially, no downside risk. It's not coming back a 55. Great shot at 62+

Stuart

<< Has this coin been submitted more than once (that you are aware of)? >>

Circulated: Thanks for your post. In reply to your above quoted question, I do not know the history of this particular coin, which I recently purchased from an eBay auction.