Do we now know what the production numbers were for 1980s/1990s baseball cards?

Estil

As most of the veteran collectors here know, back in the 1980s/1990s, no one (not Topps, Donruss, Fleer, anyone) ever made public what the production numbers were for their cards. In fact, it was probably easier to get access to the Coke and Kentucky Fried Chicken recipies than to get access to those production figures; that's how secret they were (maybe).

Well, as you all know, all that changed with the 1993 Finest cards announced at 4000 cases (all hobby only). Later other companies would follow suit. For example, 1994 Donruss was announced at 12,500 cases of each series (Jan or Feb 1994 Beckett Baseball Card Monthly); their lowest production run since 1985. 1995 Topps was announced as their lowest print run since 1966 (due to the 1994 strike). What were some other production numbers that were announced and did we ever find out what the production numbers for the 1980s cards were? That'd be quite handy to see for sure which cards were the most/least produced. Everyone knows that the legendary 1984 Donruss (and 1985 to a lesser extent) was the most limited main 1980s set, but exactly how many cases were produced? 100,000? 50,000? 25,000?

Lothar52

Good question..anybody have any insider info?

Loth

jradke4

tons, you can still get unopened material easy. not cheap but its easy to find. even the "short" 86-87 fleer basketball can still be found as unopened cases.

bobsbbcards

a googol

Stone193

This is trite...

TOO MANY!

mike

RipublicaninMass

one million gazillion cards

fandango

But not as many as the 2006 Topps Mantle HR card #1.......heard there were 75,000,000 of these!!!!

way to turn "mantle" into a throw away card....

nflhof

I heard the number was around Tree fiddy

RonBurgundy

Every so often this question gets posed, and every time no one has an answer. One would think that the hobby would take this more seriously, as scarcity driving the market is a hallmark of economics. Take 50's and 60's high numbers for example. If the market prices for high numbers is 4x low numbers, shouldn't there be some correlation between that price and the production runs of both? Same with 80's and 90's cards. We all know Donruss produced less of its 1984 series than other years (and the other mfgrs. in 1984). But how much less and is the pricing truly reflective of its scarcity?

But no one ever offers up any concrete basis to argue this; instead the production run question is largely ignored or mocked (as is the case here).


Stay classy,


Ron

1989FleerBillRipkencollector

I have a few articles from Beckett stating they initially estimated 80K of the 89 Fleer FF were printed. They then retracted and said at least 100K were made. The FF was only printed for 2 weeks exactally too !!! Unsure how Beckett knew to give a est., but Im sure their guess is as good as mine. I laugh when sellers say "Rare FF for sale" Well I dont really laugh because some 15 yo is getting duped. I have the articles on our website I think and if not there contact me and I'll get them to ya.

mikeschmidt

<< <i> If the market prices for high numbers is 4x low numbers, shouldn't there be some correlation between that price and the production runs of both? >>



Correlation, yes, but not a price linear correlation. Just as there is not a linear correlation re: population of cards and their relative prices. PSA 9 Mantles are more than twice as rare than PSA 8 counterparts, but a PSA 9 (from 1951/1952) will typically only set you back twice as much.

And, just on the same token, there are numerous cards/sets that are so rare that many collectors will not collect them other than as a type example. So the prices of those are relatively low in comparison to how rare they are compared to contemporary counterparts...

~ms

Brian48

One HUNDRED BILLION!

RonBurgundy

Mike,


Solid post. I agree the correlation won't be linear.

I do think it's surprising that production run numbers aren't readily available at least for Topps issues. In the antique car world (I know, apples and oranges), production figures for certain automobiles are widely available. I would think someone with a historical knowledge of Topps would know how many cases of product were made, particularly when figures for rare test issues are known.


Ron

frankhardy

I would bet that they know. They are just not releasing it. Probably because it would scare us to death.

larryallen73

Muy mucho.

sfmays24

Does it really matter if it's 8 Billion or 800 Billion... bottom line, anyone collecting during that period know the presses ran 24-7 and even the limited issues were overproduced.

Twinsthreepeat

You could ruff numbers for some issues. Example if you knew what the pack ratio was on 1991 Donruss Elites. Say 1 in 72 and there are a total of 92,500 elite cards(8-10,000, 1- 7500, 1 5000) That would give you 6,660,000 packs. 15 cards per pack. 99,900,000 cards. I'm guessing that those numbers are low

Stingray

Infinity plus one!!

RonBurgundy

You want to make money on late 80's/early 90's stuff? Go out and buy a few hundred cases of, say, Topps product from a given year. Then, call a press conference and announce you are destroying it all. Burn it, shred it, heck, pull a Sy Berger and say you're dumping it in the ocean. Then sit back and watch the market work itself into a fit.



Stay classy,


Ron

Boopotts

<< <i>Does it really matter if it's 8 Billion or 800 Billion... bottom line, anyone collecting during that period know the presses ran 24-7 and even the limited issues were overproduced. >>



Yeah, I don't know what use this kind of information could be. You already know what's important, and that's that there is still far, far more supply than demand for junk wax. Whether that supply will dry up in 2075 or 2150 is kind of irrelevant.

NickM

We won't know the final production numbers on some of those sets until they stop printing them.

Nick

1989FleerBillRipkencollector

<< <i>We won't know the final production numbers on some of those sets until they stop printing them.

Nick >>

dtsa

sources close to topps, fleer, and donruss estimate that there were at least eleventy million cases of each produced. They actually considered numbering each card but had to stop because the numbering machine broke at 9.

Estil

Please, no more joke responses like "a trillion gazillon" or "enough for every man, woman, and child". Only serious production numbers please.

Here's another few taken from Beckett's annual guide; 1989 Upper Deck was originally planned at one million of each card, but was increased (up to double that amount) due to the exploding popularity of the product, so even Griffey's most sought after rookie card (at least until the Topps Tiffany sets started to catch on), has somewhere between one million to two million copies.

1989FleerBillRipkencollector

oh c'mon

blindflyer

Estil,

Why does it matter how many were produced?

I mean, we know it's tens upon tens of thousands. Do we really need to know exactly how many millions were made.

-t

themetalsign

I could tell you for sure that they made enough of them to still be around in abundance 26 years later.

Estil

<< <i>Estil,

Why does it matter how many were produced?

I mean, we know it's tens upon tens of thousands. Do we really need to know exactly how many millions were made.

-t >>



Yes, because inquiring (and curious!) minds want to know.