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Question on team of the 90's football registry

drewsefdrewsef Posts: 1,894 ✭✭
in PSA Set Registry Forum
I can't figure out the reasoning behind some of the card choices in this(among others)set. For instance, I understand that Randall McDaniel has no 89 Score card, so his pro set is used, but why is the same reasoning not applied to Dermontti Dawson, whereas they use the Score supplemental card. The same thing goes for Cortez Kennedy, why is his Score supplemental card used when he has regular issues of the same year out there? Also, one more question, is the condition sensitivity of the 93 Bowman foil card the reason why it is chosen over the 93 SP for Willie Roaf? Seems like there is no rhyme or reason to this registry game.

Comments

  • JasP24JasP24 Posts: 4,645 ✭✭✭
    I can answer these questions for you...

    The MOST VALUABLE ROOKIE CARD of each player is the card chosen for ALL the Key Card and HOF Football sets. Since none of these cards are listed in the SMR, the value/price is taken from Beckett at the time the set was requested. For each specific card you questioned:

    McDaniel- Correct he has no Score, and the Pro Set is his most valuable.

    Dawson- The Score Supplemental is the most valuable. In 1989, the Score cards are the most valuable set from that year...

    Kennedy-Score Supp is most valuable. Yes, he has a regular issue score RC, but the Supplemental was issued in his rookie season, and is the most valuable.

    Roaf- The Bowman is more valuable than the SP, I suppose because it is foil and his SP card is not foil.

    There is a rhyme and a reason...Not only for this set, but for all the Key Card and HOF sets...Just takes some reading, that's all...

    Here's the posted PSA standard:

    HOF and Key Card Sets:
    Additions to the HOF and Key Card sets are possible. Every year new HOF inductions are made. In addition, some players may have performed well enough in recent years to warrant addition to All-Time sets. In some cases only one card will qualify for addition to the set. In some cases, several cards may qualify and members participating in the set will be polled for their opinion. The majority vote will determine which card is added. If less than 50% of the members polled respond, then experts at PSA will select the card for addition. If a rookie card is to be added, the card selected must be considered one of the most popular and no autographed, jersey or insert cards will qualify.

    Hope this helps,
    Jason
    I'm here to question, not to inspire or build up. To live how I want, as I see fit,
    according to my values and my needs. Nothing holds dominion over me, I stand alone as the ruler of my life.
  • shagrotn77shagrotn77 Posts: 5,582 ✭✭✭✭
    I agree with some of your concerns drewsef. I think the mistake that was made here is that Score Supplemental cards for players who had regular issue Score cards are being considered rookie cards, when in fact they are not. I mean, how could they be if they are not even the first Score cards of that player? I found this to be an issue with the All-Time Defense set where Junior Seau's Score Supplemental card is used, which I do not agree with.
    "My father would womanize, he would drink. He would make outrageous claims like he invented the question mark. Sometimes he would accuse chestnuts of being lazy. The sort of general malaise that only the genius possess and the insane lament. Our childhood was typical. Summers in Rangoon, luge lessons. In the spring we'd make meat helmets. When we were insolent we were placed in a burlap bag and beaten with reeds - pretty standard really."
  • JasP24JasP24 Posts: 4,645 ✭✭✭
    I guess the real question here is...Which card is more desirable/popular/valuable? The Score Supplemental cards (to include the Emmitt Smith RC, which is considered his BEST RC) are widely considered all of the above...Or the .05 cent regular Score issues? Or do you choose a card that is less valuable/popular because it came out 2 months earlier?

    I've never heard anyone say the Score Supp. wasn't Emmitt's RC, and its from the same set as Seau..Emmitt has other cards from other companies that came out earlier in the year than the Supplemental. Yet, that card is the most valuable/popular of all Emmitt's rookies...

    What's your take on that?

    Jsaon
    I'm here to question, not to inspire or build up. To live how I want, as I see fit,
    according to my values and my needs. Nothing holds dominion over me, I stand alone as the ruler of my life.
  • shagrotn77shagrotn77 Posts: 5,582 ✭✭✭✭
    The Score Supplemental is Emmitt's first Score card, so I have no problem with it being considered a true rookie card. But when a Score Supplemental card is a player's second Score card, I don't think it can be viewed as a true rookie card. I'm sure a lot of others agree with me. There is a similar issue in baseball for Cal Ripken's rookie card . His most valuable card is 1982 Topps Traded, but since Cal had a 1982 Topps regular issue, that is his true rookie card. I ran a poll on this issue here on CU, and of more than 60 responders, nearly 80% believed the '82 Topps regular issue is Cal's true rookie card. That such a high percentage agreed with me there is why I think many would feel the way I do about the Score Supplemental issue too. Don't get me wrong - I'm not losing sleep about it image - just stating my opinion.
    "My father would womanize, he would drink. He would make outrageous claims like he invented the question mark. Sometimes he would accuse chestnuts of being lazy. The sort of general malaise that only the genius possess and the insane lament. Our childhood was typical. Summers in Rangoon, luge lessons. In the spring we'd make meat helmets. When we were insolent we were placed in a burlap bag and beaten with reeds - pretty standard really."
  • JasP24JasP24 Posts: 4,645 ✭✭✭
    I guess my question would be, what's the difference between Emmitt having or not having a first SCORE card?It was his first SCORE card, but not his first ROOKIE card...

    He has a Pro Set card, which came out around the same time as the initial Score set. If the argument is to use the card that came out FIRST, then wouldn't the Pro Set Emmitt be THE card?

    The Supplemental set is still part of the 1990 Score issue. If you look at the 1989 Score Supplemental, the numbers even run concurrently. PSA actually lists the 1989 Score Supp. on its Pop report as 1989 Score. If 1990 Score were number sequentially following its regular issue, I assume those cards would also be listed all a part of one large 1990 Score set.

    I guess it's all matter of opinion, but with Seau, the choice to me is pretty clear. His Score Supp. card is FAR AND AWAY the most popular/valuable of his rookie cards. Regardless of what part of the year it came out, it still came out in 1990. I've never heard it, nor any other rookie from the Score Supp. referred to as not being a true rookie card.

    I'm not losing any sleep either..Just trying to answer the question that was posed.

    Jason
    I'm here to question, not to inspire or build up. To live how I want, as I see fit,
    according to my values and my needs. Nothing holds dominion over me, I stand alone as the ruler of my life.
  • shagrotn77shagrotn77 Posts: 5,582 ✭✭✭✭
    Jason,

    In a nutshell, I think a player's most valuable true rookie card should always be used. That would be defined as a player's first issue from a company during the year his rookie cards were issued, regardless of when they were issued during the year. For Seau, the following would be considered true rookie cards:

    1990 Topps
    1990 Score
    1990 Action Packed Update
    1990 Fleer Update
    1990 Pro Set

    And the following would not, because they are the second issue from Topps and Score:

    1990 Score Supplemental
    1990 Topps Traded

    I understand Score Supplemental is Seau's most valuable and desirable card from 1990. Just like Ripken's Topps Traded is from 1982. I just don't consider either true rookie cards, just like a lot of collectors don't. Obviously such a large group of collectors can't always agree on everything, thus concessions have to be made in certain areas from time to time. Hopefully this clears it up.

    Shag
    "My father would womanize, he would drink. He would make outrageous claims like he invented the question mark. Sometimes he would accuse chestnuts of being lazy. The sort of general malaise that only the genius possess and the insane lament. Our childhood was typical. Summers in Rangoon, luge lessons. In the spring we'd make meat helmets. When we were insolent we were placed in a burlap bag and beaten with reeds - pretty standard really."
  • JasP24JasP24 Posts: 4,645 ✭✭✭


    << <i>Jason,

    In a nutshell, I think a player's most valuable true rookie card should always be used. That would be defined as a player's first issue from a company during the year his rookie cards were issued, regardless of when they were issued during the year. For Seau, the following would be considered true rookie cards:

    1990 Topps
    1990 Score
    1990 Action Packed Update
    1990 Fleer Update
    1990 Pro Set

    And the following would not, because they are the second issue from Topps and Score:

    1990 Score Supplemental
    1990 Topps Traded

    I understand Score Supplemental is Seau's most valuable and desirable card from 1990. Just like Ripken's Topps Traded is from 1982. I just don't consider either true rookie cards, just like a lot of collectors don't. Obviously such a large group of collectors can't always agree on everything, thus concessions have to be made in certain areas from time to time. Hopefully this clears it up.

    Shag >>



    And which card would be Emmitt Smith's true rookie???

    The best answer I can give is that these sets are not relagated to only TRUE rookie cards. All rookie cards were considered and in the end, the most IMPORTANT variable being popularity and/or value. Which to me popularity and value go hand in hand..The cards that are more valubale, tend to be the most desirable. And the goal for the sets is to collect the BEST rookie card of each player.

    Jason
    I'm here to question, not to inspire or build up. To live how I want, as I see fit,
    according to my values and my needs. Nothing holds dominion over me, I stand alone as the ruler of my life.
  • JasP24JasP24 Posts: 4,645 ✭✭✭
    Here's the definitions I have found for ROOKIE CARDS..Which is what these sets are comprised of:

    Beckett: Rookie Card - A player's regular issue card from an officially licenced brand issued in the first year the player is eligible to appear on a trading card.

    PSA: rookie card
    A players first year of cards, whether or not it is his rookie season. Players may have one or dozens of rookie cards, depending on how highly touted he was as a youngster and in which year his rookie card was issued.

    The 1990 Score Supp. Seau clearly falls into both categories...So its a rookie, and it's the most valuable and desirable of his rookie cards. Thus the reason it is included in the sets above say his 1990 Topps card...lol

    Jason
    I'm here to question, not to inspire or build up. To live how I want, as I see fit,
    according to my values and my needs. Nothing holds dominion over me, I stand alone as the ruler of my life.
  • ssgunnipssgunnip Posts: 335
    Slow day at work guys?
  • shagrotn77shagrotn77 Posts: 5,582 ✭✭✭✭


    << <i>Slow day at work guys? >>



    image
    "My father would womanize, he would drink. He would make outrageous claims like he invented the question mark. Sometimes he would accuse chestnuts of being lazy. The sort of general malaise that only the genius possess and the insane lament. Our childhood was typical. Summers in Rangoon, luge lessons. In the spring we'd make meat helmets. When we were insolent we were placed in a burlap bag and beaten with reeds - pretty standard really."
  • JasP24JasP24 Posts: 4,645 ✭✭✭


    << <i>Slow day at work guys? >>



    Can always find time to talk football and/or football cards...Too bad there aren't more football rlated discussions around here...

    Did you guys happen to notice the updates set #20 made on the NFL HOF RC Registry this weekend? His updates in one day cost more than what I have spent on my entire collection over the last 7 years..lol

    Jason

    I'm here to question, not to inspire or build up. To live how I want, as I see fit,
    according to my values and my needs. Nothing holds dominion over me, I stand alone as the ruler of my life.
  • shagrotn77shagrotn77 Posts: 5,582 ✭✭✭✭
    Yup, I saw. Amazing additions. Guy has to be a millionaire. Hopefully he'll start scanning some of his cards so that we can all drool over them. LOL.
    "My father would womanize, he would drink. He would make outrageous claims like he invented the question mark. Sometimes he would accuse chestnuts of being lazy. The sort of general malaise that only the genius possess and the insane lament. Our childhood was typical. Summers in Rangoon, luge lessons. In the spring we'd make meat helmets. When we were insolent we were placed in a burlap bag and beaten with reeds - pretty standard really."
  • JasP24JasP24 Posts: 4,645 ✭✭✭


    << <i>Guy has to be a millionaire. >>



    You mean like his yearly salary, right???lol

    Jason
    I'm here to question, not to inspire or build up. To live how I want, as I see fit,
    according to my values and my needs. Nothing holds dominion over me, I stand alone as the ruler of my life.
  • shagrotn77shagrotn77 Posts: 5,582 ✭✭✭✭


    << <i>You mean like his yearly salary, right???lol >>



    Oh yeah. If you're right about him landing the Nagurski 8, that alone will will go for multiples of what my entire collection is worth, and I think I have a pretty good one!
    "My father would womanize, he would drink. He would make outrageous claims like he invented the question mark. Sometimes he would accuse chestnuts of being lazy. The sort of general malaise that only the genius possess and the insane lament. Our childhood was typical. Summers in Rangoon, luge lessons. In the spring we'd make meat helmets. When we were insolent we were placed in a burlap bag and beaten with reeds - pretty standard really."
  • JasP24JasP24 Posts: 4,645 ✭✭✭
    Hey if I ever win the lottery, you can give the ebay hobby up..lol..I will own everything football!!lol

    Nothing wrong with having money...Can't fault a guy for using his resources..

    Jason
    I'm here to question, not to inspire or build up. To live how I want, as I see fit,
    according to my values and my needs. Nothing holds dominion over me, I stand alone as the ruler of my life.
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