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What are The Greatest United States Copper Collections ?


I believe the Greatest or certainly one of the greatest was the Large Cent collection of Ted Naftzger.

I believe the half cent collection of Jim McGuigan is also one the finest quality and possibly the Finest quality of dates and varieties of half cents ever formed.

The Indian cent collection of Dr. Alan Epstein was probably the finest quality collection ever formed and may never be surpassed.I got to view his entire collection more than once.Perhaps I should have bought it intact ?

Stewart

Comments

  • dbldie55dbldie55 Posts: 7,717 ✭✭✭✭✭
    There used to be a great collection of Copper about 80 miles from me in Butte, but they mined it all out.
    Collector and Researcher of Liberty Head Nickels. ANA LM-6053
  • CladiatorCladiator Posts: 17,918 ✭✭✭✭✭
    What about the Jules Reiver Collection. I don't know much about it other than it seemed to be rather extensive from the Heritage offerings.
  • numismanumisma Posts: 3,877 ✭✭✭✭

    Define greatest. Some are impressed by completeness, while others favor quality over anything else. And of course we must mention that "quality" is a subjective term.

    I liked the John Adams collection of 1794 Cents. John Ford had an absolutely amazing collection of Fugios (they are copper!). There are many possibilities. In the recent past, there's Frankenfield, Bird, Rasmussen, etc., etc.

    I love copper!
  • numismanumisma Posts: 3,877 ✭✭✭✭


    << <i>What about the Jules Reiver Collection. I don't know much about it other than it seemed to be rather extensive from the Heritage offerings. >>



    That's my point in my post above this one; I loved the Reiver collection due to it's collector value. It was so very complete in terms of varieties and die states. Others mocked it due to the fact that it was not a "pop top" set. It was what it was and I think it was fantastic. I will never forget it (thanks in part to auction catalogs and my weak memory!).

  • RTSRTS Posts: 1,408
    ...not coins but a collection I enjoy just reading about...

    the dennis mendleson library sale the outstanding american numismatic library formed by dennis
    mendleson comprising major works on united states large cents & american auction sale catalogs with photographic plates

    image

    ...some nice collections...

    image

    Louis Helfenstein Collection of large Cents, 1793–1857. Lester Merkin, NY 1964.

    Herman Halpern Collection of Large Cents, Stacks, 1988

    The Floyd T. Starr Collection of United States large cents, United States Half Cents—Stack's, New York 1984.

    The Outstanding Collection of United States large Cents Formed by Mr. Oscar J. Pearl. Kosoff, New York 1944.
    image
  • RichieURichRichieURich Posts: 8,359 ✭✭✭✭✭
    In Half Cents, obviously there are two biggies, Jim McGuigan's and a collector from the Midwest. Jim displayed his set at the Pittsburgh ANA in 2004, which is awesome. All PCGS, has all the big varieties and the proofs also.

    In Large Cents, certainly Sheldon's was a set of note, but we know how he got some of those. image Also, Naftzger, Dan Holmes, Rasmussen, Frankenfield, and Reiver are all sets of note, but I would say that anyone that has ever completed the Sheldon series (11 people according to the Breen - Borckardt Encyclopedia) certainly had a set of significance, regardless of the grade. Frankenfield and Reiver both also had the half cents, and Reiver had more die states than anyone else.

    I don't know enough about the sets of Flying Eagle, Indian, or Lincoln cents to comment.

    An authorized PCGS dealer, and a contributor to the Red Book.

  • michaelmichael Posts: 9,524 ✭✭
    the guy down in missouri that has those hundreds of proof half cents
  • Stewart !!! You know all the answers for all the copper series !!! You just wanted to hear us all say: "All Hail Lord Master Stewart and his Small Cents !!!!!" image
  • MisterBungleMisterBungle Posts: 2,308 ✭✭✭

    > "There used to be a great collection of Copper about 80 miles from me in Butte, but they mined it all out."
    ------------------------------------------------------------------
    They mined it out of their Butte??

    image

    ~


    "America suffers today from too much pluribus and not enough unum.".....Arthur Schlesinger Jr.

  • CoxeCoxe Posts: 11,139
    In addition to those already mentioned, you have to include Robinson Brown. Didn't he complete the full Sheldon set of Large Cents twice?
    Select Rarities -- DMPLs and VAMs
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  • MisterBungleMisterBungle Posts: 2,308 ✭✭✭

    > "In addition to those already mentioned, you have to include Robinson Brown. Didn't he complete the full Sheldon set of Large Cents twice?"
    ------------------------------------------------------------------
    Yes, he did.

    The first set was sold by Superior Sept. 30th and Oct. 1st, 1986.,
    and the second set, also by Superior, was sold on Jan. 27, 1996.

    ~


    "America suffers today from too much pluribus and not enough unum.".....Arthur Schlesinger Jr.

  • CoxeCoxe Posts: 11,139
    The second catalogue is a great keeper. I refer to it and the Wes Rasmussen one generally when I am dealing with a large cent. I wasn't hip to Brown's first set, learning about it when the second set hit the block.
    Select Rarities -- DMPLs and VAMs
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    SSDC - Life Member
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  • How did Sheldon acquire his collection? Well, in order to improve the collection he built himself, he stole coins from the ANS by swapping them for his inferior specimens. He did the same with the collection of a close friend who was dying of cancer. Some of the ANS coins were double-swapped, and ended up in the friend's collection. When it was sold, the ANS coins came to light, and it was eventually realized that Sheldon must have done the double swap (first upgrading his inferior specimen by swapping it with the ANS coin, and then swapping the ANS coin for a still better specimen in his friend's collection).

    Those who are interested can go back and find my thread entitled something like "The Truth about Dr. William Sheldon" ...

    Best,
    Sunnywood
  • MyqqyMyqqy Posts: 9,777
    He did the same with the collection of a close friend who was dying of cancer.

    Sounds very classy....
    My style is impetuous, my defense is impregnable !
  • JulianJulian Posts: 3,370 ✭✭✭
    The MO collection does not have hundreds of proof half cents, but the proofs are complete by date and variety, only missing one.
    PNG member, numismatic dealer since 1965. Operates a retail store, also has exhibited at over 1000 shows.
    I firmly believe in numismatics as the world's greatest hobby, but recognize that this is a luxury and without collectors, we can all spend/melt our collections/inventories.

    eBaystore
  • BarndogBarndog Posts: 20,454 ✭✭✭✭✭


    << <i>How did Sheldon acquire his collection? Well, in order to improve the collection he built himself, he stole coins from the ANS by swapping them for his inferior specimens. He did the same with the collection of a close friend who was dying of cancer. Some of the ANS coins were double-swapped, and ended up in the friend's collection. When it was sold, the ANS coins came to light, and it was eventually realized that Sheldon must have done the double swap (first upgrading his inferior specimen by swapping it with the ANS coin, and then swapping the ANS coin for a still better specimen in his friend's collection).

    Those who are interested can go back and find my thread entitled something like "The Truth about Dr. William Sheldon" ...

    Best,
    Sunnywood >>



    That thread has been TTT'd ... moments ago


  • << <i>SO HOW DID SHELDON ACQUIRE HIS COPPER COLLECTION? >>



    Because of the research he was doing he was allowed access to the American Numismatic Society collections - seems after Dr. Sheldon viewed the collection for his research, what used to be a very nice ANS coin became a different and much lower grade coin - presidigitation - or the old "switcheroo" seemed to be the order of the day - Sheldon sold his very nice collection to another important collector and then litigation ensued and the coins were finally returned to ANS.

    I'll look for a link -

    Edited to add: Apparantly there already is a link posted here - should finished reading the thread before posting image
    Collecting eye-appealing Proof and MS Indian Head Cents, 1858 Flying Eagle and IHC patterns and beautiful toned coins.

    “It ain't what you don't know that gets you into trouble. It's what you know for sure that just ain't so.” Mark Twain
    Newmismatist
  • elwoodelwood Posts: 2,414


    There are two other Half Cent Collections that compare to Jim McGuigen's. The MO Collection and the other is in NY.

    Walter H. has a pretty nice Large Cent Collection.

    Please visit my website prehistoricamerica.com www.visitiowa.org/pinecreekcabins
  • STEWARTBLAYNUMISSTEWARTBLAYNUMIS Posts: 2,697 ✭✭✭✭

    There is a wonderful collection of half cents in Long Island.I mean it is very high end. There is also a Gem Uncirculated Brasher Dubloon to keep them company.

    There is also a very astute half cent collector living somewhere in New England.Some people know of his collection as the black hole.In other words noone really knows what is in his collection.

    There is also a New York dealer/collector from Brooklyn who owns without question the finest collection of Fugios ever formed.

    I also met a collector from New Jersey who owns without question the finest collection of Lincoln Memorial cents.

    Stewart
  • Some guy in NYC is rumoured to have a nice penny collection image

    Also, if you're lucky, you might meet a very well versed Doctor (as in Medical Doctor) from Pennsylvania that has an outstanding collection of 1794 Large Cents -
    Collecting eye-appealing Proof and MS Indian Head Cents, 1858 Flying Eagle and IHC patterns and beautiful toned coins.

    “It ain't what you don't know that gets you into trouble. It's what you know for sure that just ain't so.” Mark Twain
    Newmismatist
  • BigMooseBigMoose Posts: 1,466 ✭✭✭
    As far as Large Cents, Ted Naftzger had virtually the best of everything--early dates, middle and late dates and proofs, until he sold in 1990 or so.

    Today, I believe the two best collections of Early Date Large Cents, both of which are quite astonishing to view in person, belong to Dan Holmes and Walter H. of Calif.( who I get to share a table with at the yearly EAC Conventions ).

    With regard to business strike Indian Cents and Lincoln Cents, it has to Lord Master Stewart Blay.
    TomT-1794

    Check out some of my 1794 Large Cents on www.coingallery.org


  • << <i>With regard to business strike Indian Cents and Lincoln Cents, it has to Lord Master Stewart Blay. >>



    Tom - isn't that why Stewart started this thread - (it took over 8 posts before Sunnywood mentioned his name! and my oblique reference and your confirmation) - maybe there's going to be some Lincoln pennies for sale soon! image
    Collecting eye-appealing Proof and MS Indian Head Cents, 1858 Flying Eagle and IHC patterns and beautiful toned coins.

    “It ain't what you don't know that gets you into trouble. It's what you know for sure that just ain't so.” Mark Twain
    Newmismatist
  • BigMooseBigMoose Posts: 1,466 ✭✭✭
    Stewart Blay is the kindest, warmest, most generous person I have ever met in my entire life.

    I just finished watching The Manchurian Candidate on HBO.
    TomT-1794

    Check out some of my 1794 Large Cents on www.coingallery.org
  • CoxeCoxe Posts: 11,139
    I have a very nice braided hair half cent set....at least until January as I consigned it to Heritage's FUN sales. Not in the greatest league and with no pedigreed coins though. I am missing it already but other folks need to appreciate them.
    Select Rarities -- DMPLs and VAMs
    NSDR - Life Member
    SSDC - Life Member
    ANA - Pay As I Go Member
  • RichieURichRichieURich Posts: 8,359 ✭✭✭✭✭


    << <i>. . .In Large Cents, certainly Sheldon's was a set of note, but we know how he got some of those. image >>



    When I wrote this comment, I implicitly assumed that everyone knew the story behind Sheldon and his collection. That assumption was clearly in error and I apologize for my error. image Sometimes these stories are repeated so often that one assumes everyone has heard them. Sorry about that!

    However, everyone who has read this thread and/or the well-written Sheldon thread, now knows the story.

    An authorized PCGS dealer, and a contributor to the Red Book.

  • I also met a collector from New Jersey who owns without question the finest collection of Lincoln Memorial cents.

    Stewart, I love reading things like this on the boards. Sometimes as collectors/registry set holders...we often forget that more sets exist raw out there...many of which would blow the top registered set out of the water in terms of quality.

    It would be really cool to see a collection like that....someone who has not been caught up in the hype and inflated prices...someone just concentrating on finding the FINEST lincolns RAW.

    When you met the guy did you get to see his collection?
    image
  • orevilleoreville Posts: 11,772 ✭✭✭✭✭
    The finest raw lincoln cent collection I have ever seen belongs to a fine collector from Massachussetts. He has no interest in getting his set slabbed.

    The finest slabbed lincoln cent collection I have seen (at least parts of it) belongs to a fine collector from Connecticut.

    A Collectors Universe poster since 1997!
  • <<The finest slabbed lincoln cent collection I have seen (at least parts of it) belongs to a fine collector from Connecticut.>>

    I think you meant NY. If you think it is someone else besides Lord Master, I would bet against your pick. It may seem at first Stewart posts threads like this to have his ego stroked, but that is not the case. He is a true collector with a true passion, and is always curious what is out there that would make our mouths water.

    I love the mystery that goes along with the history and joy of being a coin collector. The mysteries will never end. We will never live long enough to see all the secrets that come about as time goes on.

    Lloyd

    The Accumulator - Dark Lloyd of the Sith

    image




  • I love the mystery that goes along with the history and joy of being a coin collector. The mysteries will never end. We will never live long enough to see all the secrets that come about as time goes on.

    I agree with Lloyd, not only because of what he posted, but because he's cool.image

    Seriously, the mystery is definitely there, especially for Lincolns. Back in the 60's, collecting "pennies" was all the rage. I started in 1970 when my dad would bring home bags from the bank for me to search. I often wonder how many super high end "Gem BU" sets were put together back then. How many awesome sets of raw Lincolns are there out there that have long been forgotten? Lloyd is right in that we will continue to see coins and beautiful collections, many uncertified, come to the market over the years. I mean wouldn't it be great to see a penny board all with superb gem examples? Or what about when I find the PCGS graded 27-D in 66RD that Stewart is looking for? I can jump up and down screaming, "It's all mine, mine I say, all mine!!!"image


    Jack


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