So....who is YOUR pick for the BCS National title game?
ToppsCo1lector
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Against presumably Ohio State? I think the most important game yet to be played in the regular season is ND/USC, if ND wins then they along with Michigan can lay claim to being the only two 1 loss top-ranked teams that lost to the #1. Who's your pick?
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Notre Dame lost to Michigan, and USC lost to the friggin BEAVERS!!!
I gag at the thought of ND. They should have three losses and they've played crap teams (like Army today). Thanks for the choke jobs, Michigan State and UCLA.
If USC runs the table I think they're #2, end of story, primarily based on their running the gauntlet of Oregon, Cal, ND and UCLA down the home stretch. If not I think it's Florida if they win out. If USC and Florida both stumble, THAT opens the door for Michigan, Arkansas and (yecch) ND.
Having said all that, I still think Michigan is the second best team in the country over any other team not named Ohio State. And because OSU won by only three at home, that's not necessarily an open-and-shut case. I just don't think enough voters will want to give them another crack at OSU instead of USC or Florida or ND or even Arkansas if everything breaks right, even if I believe (as I do) that Michigan is a better team than ANY of them.
Laugh all you want. Yes MICh is the better team, but no one wants to see teh same game over. USC is not that great, they would be destroyed by OSU. Ark will beat Florida in the SEC champ, so I think that would be one of the more interesting games.
">"http://www.cashcrate.com/5663377"
<< <i>OSU v. Ark
Laugh all you want. Yes MICh is the better team, but no one wants to see teh same game over. USC is not that great, they would be destroyed by OSU. Ark will beat Florida in the SEC champ, so I think that would be one of the more interesting games. >>
WTF ark got killed by USC...
Come to a logical answer. If usc runs table they get in IMO
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For those filled with envy who keep bashing ND, watch the draft next spring.
<< <i>This is a tough one, Michigan certainly can lay claim to being the second best team in the country but they had their chance. What happens if they get a rematch and Michigan wins by a point? Who then deserves the national championship? Whoever wins out deserves the shot, however I don't think any team except SC has a chance to beat OSU.
For those filled with envy who keep bashing ND, watch the draft next spring. >>
The draft? What does that prove? Quinn is a product of his coaches system, he better hope weiss follows him to the NFL
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<< <i>Not only Quinn is a 1st round lock, Zbikowski is another likely first rounder, and had Jeff Samardjiza not signed with the Cubs he would also be. >>
what does this prove? FSU/MIAMI/USC/TEXAS all put out 1st round picks with usc being the biggest.
And if jarett leaves this year hes a lock for first wr taken, guy is sick, and i very much dislike usc.
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Looking for Topps rookies as well.
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<< <i>
<< <i>This is a tough one, Michigan certainly can lay claim to being the second best team in the country but they had their chance. What happens if they get a rematch and Michigan wins by a point? Who then deserves the national championship? Whoever wins out deserves the shot, however I don't think any team except SC has a chance to beat OSU.
For those filled with envy who keep bashing ND, watch the draft next spring. >>
The draft? What does that prove? Quinn is a product of his coaches system, he better hope weiss follows him to the NFL >>
Quinn is probably easily a top 10 draft pick, if not a top 3 or 5.
<< <i>ND hasn't earned it IMO. I don't see any way that they could legitimately pass Michigan.
Quinn is probably easily a top 10 draft pick, if not a top 3 or 5. >>
Even if ND beats SC and they won't they don't deserve to be in the championship game. Next year will be a down year for them but if Weiss keeps recruiting like he has the past 2 years they be a force again. This next year will finally flush out how poor a job Ty did, they are already calling for his dismissal in Washington after the Stanford loss.
The teams being discussed for the championship game are:
Michigan - which lost by 3 to #1 Ohio State at Columbus. They had close games (within a touchdown or less) to Penn St (8-4) and at home to Ball St. (4-7). They crushed Notre Dame (10-1 /BCS) at South Bend 47-21, and also played Central Michigan (7-4) and Vanderbilt (4-8). So they didn't play any 1AA teams out of conference and their worst foe was either a crappy SEC team (Vanderbilt) that barely lost to Florida and Arkansas or the MAC West leading Central Michigan.
USC - which lost to Oregon State (7-4) and had close games (within a touchdown or less) with Washington State (6-6), at home against Washington (5-7) & Arizona (6-5). They demolished Arkansas (10-1/SEC West leader) in the preconference 50-14. They also beat Nebraska (8-3) and have an upcoming game with Notre Dame (10-1/BCS).
Notre Dame - doesn't really belong in the equation at all in my opinion simply because they got crushed by Michigan at home. They did beat Penn St (8-4) and Georgia Tech (9-2), but had to come back late to beat Michigan St (4-8/lost 8 of last 9 games). They do have USC (BCS) upcoming.
Florida -Arkansas or them will suffer their second loss in the SEC championship. Lost to a two-loss team @ Auburn. Had close games (within a touchdown or less) with Georgia (7-4), Vanderbilt (4-8) and S. Carolina (6-5). They haven't beaten any quality teams out of conference, playing Southern Miss (7-4), UCF (3-8) Western Carolina (1AA / 2-9) and upcoming Florida State (6-5). Way for them to put it on the line, eh Joe?
Arkansas -Doesn't really belong in the equation unless USC loses again. Florida or them will suffer their second loss in the SEC championship. Got smoked by USC 50-14. Had close games(within a touchdown or less) with Vanderbilt (4-8), Alabama (6-6) & S. Carolina (6-5). Besides the USC beating they took, their other non-conference games were against Utah State (1-10), Southeast Missouri St. (2-6) and Louisiana-Monroe (2-8).
The only teams that really played anybody out of conference at all and won are Michigan and USC. Both won their biggest games handily. My beef with USC is simply that they lost to a 7-4 team that hasn't beaten anybody good and has gotten beat up by the quality teams that they did play. USC also had close games to 3 teams with a .500 or worse record. Michigan lost to unbeaten OSU. They did have a close game with Ball State which doesn't help, but their only other close game was Penn St (8-4). They also handed Wisconsin (10-1) their only loss of the season, 27-13.
I hear people saying that they feel that Michigan is the second best team, but they just don't want to see a rematch. But isn't the championship supposed to be a matchup of the two best teams, period? I don't wanna see a rematch of last years Bowl game between OSU and Notre Dame either, but if ND had beaten Michigan this year that would have been the likely scenario and I would have dealt with it. Lets face it. If your team (or even your conference of choice) isn't represented in the game, you really don't care when you watch it unless you are just hoping for a particular team to lose. Ohio St has been ranked #1 all year by a large margin. Michigan lost to them by 3 in Columbus. At a neutral site, things could be different. But the question is, are they the most deserving team based on the numbers? I don't think that can be argued...
<< <i>I hear people saying that they feel that Michigan is the second best team, but they just don't want to see a rematch. But isn't the championship supposed to be a matchup of the two best teams, period? >>
It's not that I don't want to see a rematch, but I don't want to see the controversy it could create.
What if Michigan beat OSU by 1 in the rematch? Both have one loss. Both lost to each other once and beat each other once.
Who is #1? Michigan? Why, because they won the last game instead of the second-to-last game? Even though OSU beat Michigan by more points (admittedly at home) than Michigan beat them by (on a neutral site)? Seems like it would be another disputed mythical national championship.
<< <i>
<< <i>I hear people saying that they feel that Michigan is the second best team, but they just don't want to see a rematch. But isn't the championship supposed to be a matchup of the two best teams, period? >>
It's not that I don't want to see a rematch, but I don't want to see the controversy it could create.
What if Michigan beat OSU by 1 in the rematch? Both have one loss. Both lost to each other once and beat each other once.
Who is #1? Michigan? Why, because they won the last game instead of the second-to-last game? Even though OSU beat Michigan by more points (admittedly at home) than Michigan beat them by (on a neutral site)? Seems like it would be another disputed mythical national championship. >>
There could be controversy in other possible matchups as well. What if Notre Dame played Ohio St and thumped them? Does that mean that ND is the best team, even though they got thumped by a team that OSU beat? If you look at it from many scenarios, the BCS will always have controversy with the championship winners as we did before the BCS (ie: 93 Florida St/ND). Even if there were a playoff system which many think is the answer, there would still be controversy because of the teams "on the bubble". If OSU loses in their bowl to a 1-loss team like USC, don't they still have an arguement (like the '93 scenario) that they lost to a higher ranked team than USC did? There's always going to be someone arguing about the final outcome. But if you put the two best teams together and the winner is crowned the champion, that's what this is supposed to be about. If the situation were reversed, I would expect the same... There have been so many disputes over the old and new systems in college football, why should this year be any different?
UM #2 and #3.
If USC wins out, I don't see how you don't put them in the title game against OSU.
If USC wins out, I don't see how you don't put them in the title game against OSU.
What, he makes the rules now? Of course we would expect you to claim USC as you usually do, but again... they did lose to OSU like Michigan did. Unfortunately for them, it was Oregon State which hasn't beaten a soul worth mentioning. Further, USC's lackluster stretch of barely beating three .500 or worse teams in a row should also indicate something. I'll concede that they possibly should be in the game over Michigan if they can dominate Notre Dame as Michigan did. Again, they still did lose to mediocre team which shouldn't be the mark of a title contender, but it's the BCS and it's still about the money.
<< <i>
What, he makes the rules now? Of course we would expect you to claim USC as you usually do, but again... they did lose to OSU like Michigan did. Unfortunately for them, it was Oregon State which hasn't beaten a soul worth mentioning. Further, USC's lackluster stretch of barely beating three .500 or worse teams in a row should also indicate something. I'll concede that they possibly should be in the game over Michigan if they can dominate Notre Dame as Michigan did. Again, they still did lose to mediocre team which shouldn't be the mark of a title contender, but it's the BCS and it's still about the money. >>
But if they win out, they'll have beaten:
Arkansas, who is 10-1 and ranked #6 in BCS
Nebraska, 8-3 who is ranked 22nd
Cal, 8-3 and ranked 19th
ND, 10-1 and ranked 5th
Yes they had a bad loss, but UM has had an easier road to their spot. They've beaten ND, PSU, and Wisconsin.
I'd give the nod to USC at this point.
<< <i>Personally, I think USC has to get the shot if they run the table. If they rip Notre Dame and UCLA I'd have to think they have the inside track. There are probably enough voters who will think a different team deserves ONE crack at OSU more than Michigan deserves a *second* crack. Not that I necessarily agree with the logic, but that's what I think they'd do. >>
I wouldn't be shocked at all if they get it even if they struggle in either of those games simply because the BCS is still all about money. One conference getting all of the money and publicity for the championship game wouldn't bode well for the people who stand to benefit from the game. But if they're basing their decision on that logic (not allowing a rematch), Florida and Arkansas mainly played some crappy out of conference games, but they both did lose to a ranked opponent. USC would have the nod over Arkansas (if both win out) by that logic, but Florida would have the nod over USC (if both win out) and I don't see that happening. Simply put, I just don't think any team that lost to an unranked team should be in the championship game, let alone a team that often struggled to beat other bad teams as well.
USC = overrated
<< <i>
USC = overrated >>
So their wins over tough, tough teams this year still have you thinking they are overrated?
<< <i>
<< <i>
USC = overrated >>
So their wins over tough, tough teams this year still have you thinking they are overrated? >>
More that their struggles with bad teams have me thinking that!
lost to Oregon State (7-4) and had close games (within a touchdown or less) with Washington State (6-6), at home against Washington (5-7) & Arizona (6-5)
They lost to a team that is 7-4, and had a few close games, true. Why are you so hesitant to give them props for beating the top quality teams they've beaten?
By the way Vote Darren McFadden for Heisman.............
(If you want peace, prepare for War).........Semper Fi
I think they went ahead and saved everyone the hassle and handed it to Smith last nite in Columbus.
<< <i>Like OSU coach Tressel said prior to the game, the title game should have conference champions in it...which knocks out UM.
>>
What a shock. He was hoping Rutgers would get through undefeated.
<< <i>
<< <i>OSU v. Ark
Laugh all you want. Yes MICh is the better team, but no one wants to see teh same game over. USC is not that great, they would be destroyed by OSU. Ark will beat Florida in the SEC champ, so I think that would be one of the more interesting games. >>
WTF ark got killed by USC...
Come to a logical answer. If usc runs table they get in IMO >>
Consider the games and not the end result. That was ARKS first game and had not established a running game. They tried to play with some horrible QB by passing. After that game, they switched QBs and changed to running. I've been watching the team. They have run the table on every game besides their first. They WILL beat florida in the SEC. Florida is good, but cannot compete with this team. UT lost to Florida by one, Ark ran the floor with UT..it was pathetic to watch.
If Ark goes to BCS champ, they will give OSU a run for their money.
PS...usc blows this year.
">"http://www.cashcrate.com/5663377"
<< <i>
<< <i>
<< <i>
USC = overrated >>
So their wins over tough, tough teams this year still have you thinking they are overrated? >>
More that their struggles with bad teams have me thinking that!
lost to Oregon State (7-4) and had close games (within a touchdown or less) with Washington State (6-6), at home against Washington (5-7) & Arizona (6-5) >>
Lest we forget, Michigan didn't exactly roll up all their crappy opponents either.
<< <i>
Consider the games and not the end result. That was ARKS first game and had not established a running game. They tried to play with some horrible QB by passing. After that game, they switched QBs and changed to running. I've been watching the team. They have run the table on every game besides their first. They WILL beat florida in the SEC. Florida is good, but cannot compete with this team. UT lost to Florida by one, Ark ran the floor with UT..it was pathetic to watch.
If Ark goes to BCS champ, they will give OSU a run for their money.
PS...usc blows this year. >>
I've heard this argument before - 'Arkansas hadn't established their running game!' In case you didn't know it, USC's QB (Booty) was making his first collegiate start - what's your point?
USC blows this year? They absolutely CRUSHED Arkansas, with a QB making his first start. If they beat ND and UCLA, they absolutely deserve to be in the title game.
They lost to a team that is 7-4, and had a few close games, true. Why are you so hesitant to give them props for beating the top quality teams they've beaten?
Well I would agree if it happened once or maybe twice, but they had a 4-game stretch where the the best team they played is now a 7-4 team. They won by 6 at Washington St (6-6), won by 6 AT HOME to Washington (5-7), won by 7 AT HOME to Arizona St and then finally lost at Oregon St (7-4) by 2. USC has beaten a couple good teams and I will say kudos. That's giving credit to Cal (as well as Arkansas) only because people have Cal rated fairly well even though they haven't really beaten anybody and recently lost to Arizona. The best team they have beaten is 7-4 right now, so I think the jury is really out on how good they are IMO. Same goes for Nebraska. They did have a fairly decent win in a game with Texas A&M, but that's it and A&M hadn't beaten a quality team up to that point either.
Lest we forget, Michigan didn't exactly roll up all their crappy opponents either.
Well with the exception of their Ball State game which they only won by 8, their next closest game to a team with a .500 or less record was 14 points. Michigan & Carr are known for never "rolling up" the score, but I'd say a 14 point win is decisive enough within ones conference.
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Let's ask Stalin what's going to happen. We'll then know the answer. The EXACT OPPOSITE of whatever he says.
Ax, if the rolls were reversed and Michigan had dumped a game early to a team like Purdue (8-4) and USC went undefeated until late, but barely lost to and undefeated Notre Dame team at South Bend you would be complaining about how they (USC) lost a close game to a good time while Michigan dumped theirs to a subpar team. Further, if Michigan struggled against all of the bad teams that USC has, you'd claim that they shouldn't even be considered for the game. You know it, I know it and the rest of the board knows you would too. Not sure why I'm even discussing this whole thing right now though. If USC dumps it to the golden dummies, the debate is moot.
As far as having to beat a team they already beat, it's happened before and as recently as the 1996 season when Florida got beaten by FSU at the end of the season, but beat them in the championship game and was declared the champion.
It'd be unfair to Ohio State to have to replay them, and it would be unfair to the rest of the 1 loss (or, i guess some people would say no-loses, also...)
Would like to see either:
USC
Florida
Notre Dame
Arkansas
West Virginia
anywho. NO REMATCH!
Why don't you guys discuss this in a couple of weeks. Past scores do not mean chit. Its who's playing well at the end of the season and who has the speed. IMO the Big Ten is slow compared to others.
Ken
(If you want peace, prepare for War).........Semper Fi
If USC wins out, they deserve to go. If USC does not win out, then I think the winner of the SEC championship game should play Ohio State. Why?
Because as unbeatable as they look, I still have one nagging doubt (albeit a small one) regarding Ohio State (and Michigan, for that matter). I'm still a bit skeptical about their schedule. Am I convinced that OSU is better than anyone in the Big 12? Yep. Am I convinced that they're better than Notre Dame? Yep. Better than anyone in the Pac 10? Would like to see them play USC, but if Notre Dame beats USC, then yep. Am I convinced that they're better than the best in the SEC? Actually, not quite.
Personally, for me to be completely satisified that OSU is the best team, they have to beat the best from the south (and that's the SEC this year). Otherwise, for me to believe that OSU and Michigan are clearly the 2 best teams, then using that same logic, I have to believe that Wisconsin is clearly the 3rd best team, as they lost only to the skunkbears in the Big Outhouse, and it was fairly close. And I just don't believe that Wisconsin is all that good.
Probably doesn't make any sense, but that's how I feel.
Good post. At the beginning of the season I shared your view of the Big 10... it just may not be what folks think. Well, this conference is a strange place. Michigan is a good team... worthy of a top 3 ranking. Wisconsin needs to win in whatever bowl they go to...end of discussion there. The rest of the conference did not live up to what it should have done... Iowa, Penn State, Minnesota, MSU among others...Illinois may be the best 2-10 team in the country, but after reading about their performance against Northwestern, I am not even able to say that with the conviction after the Ohio State game.
While Arkansas has moved to the SEC years ago, it is really unfortunate that the rivalry with Texas is not what it was. I remember the 1969 game with Texas that was great. College Football is not what it was because folks are more concerned with numbers and statistics and who is number one instead of just enjoying the season for what it should be... and that is the sad part. The BCS is a bunch of crap (edited to be politically correct). It really is hard to get excited about something that has replaced tradition for a false sense of proclaiming a national champion.
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You have #1 losing to #2, but both teams now would have 1 loss.
Ohio st. say`s HEY, our only loss is to the #2 (now #1) USC team
And USC lost to the Oregon st. beavers (not sure if ther ranked) !!
Ohio st will could say that they are the best 1 loss team ?????????
LEE
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<< <i>OKAY... lets see if we can get this right at least once in this thread... it is the Oregon State Beavers... that is the team that beat USC this year and then there is the Oregon Ducks... >>
Don't be so harsh on these fellas, how many of them do you think have ever seen a beaver?
<< <i>OKAY... lets see if we can get this right at least once in this thread... it is the Oregon State Beavers... that is the team that beat USC this year and then there is the Oregon Ducks... >>
The Oregon Ducks beat USC?
Well at least that's better than being beat by the Oregon St Beavers.
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