Interesting new ACG holder.

ajaan

I wonder what the token would have graded if the ICCS tag wasn't there.

ACG/ICCS slab

ksteelheader

That's really a great idea, regardless of who is doing it.

3Mark

<< <i>I wonder what the token would have graded if the ICCS tag wasn't there.

ACG/ICCS slab >>




MS67Red as it has good strike and luster3Mark

Numismatics

I like the idea, but not really useful.

wildjag

How many sides does that coin have anyway, as 3 different photos are shown

sliderider

<< <i>I wonder what the token would have graded if the ICCS tag wasn't there.

ACG/ICCS slab >>



So what is happening here?? Is ACG now reholdering other services coins with the tags that the other service gave it?? And ICCS doesn't have quite the bad reputation as some other grading services I could mention. In fact, most of the holdered Canadians I have seen have been in ICCS flips and have been nice coins.

coinpictures

Ripe for fraud, and given ACG's reputation, I think that's *exactly* their intent: How do you know that the ICCS slip in the ACG holder corresponds to *that* specific coin?

You don't. Swap in a lower-quality coin and point to the ICCS slip saying "See! They say it's MS84!"

sliderider

<< <i>Ripe for fraud, and given ACG's reputation, I think that's *exactly* their intent: How do you know that the ICCS slip in the ACG holder corresponds to *that* specific coin?

You don't. Swap in a lower-quality coin and point to the ICCS slip saying "See! They say it's MS84!" >>



That's just what I was thinking. If ICCS is going to start slabbing their coins, they certainly shouldn't trust someone else to do it for them, and certainly not ACG. I'd rather they kept on with the flips.

MrEureka

I doubt that Accugrade has the credibility in the marketplace to make this fly. On the other hand, I wonder if it might work for a more trusted third party. After all, there is an advantage to uniform packaging.

ajaan

<< <i>How do you know that the ICCS slip in the ACG holder corresponds to *that* specific coin? >>


I also thought about this.

SYRACUSIAN

Look closely to the right of both holders: there's a piece of tape!

JZrarities

tape?

sliderider

Slabs held together with cello tape isn't exactly confidence inspiring, is it?

Hmmm...there's no mention on the ASA-Accugrade website about changing the slabs or reholdering of ICCS coins. The slab shown in the pictures and the tag above the coin do bear a strong resemblance to Accugrade's sports card holders, though.

kuhli

Ummm, I am confused. The front tag gives it a "ACCS" certification number, and the reverse has a label for "American-Canadian Certification Service", so where does ACG/Accugrade fit into the equation??

MrEureka

Look at the upper right hand corner of the slab.

Burks

If you look at where I boxed you can see what looks to be tape:

lathmach

ICCS is a Canadian company based in Toronto. I wonder what the connection is.

Ray

AuldFartte

Doubt there is any connection. The slab folks obviously just taped the old ICCS tag to the outside of the slab. Who knows why.

By the way, without the ICCS tag, that's an easy 70

sliderider

<< <i>Doubt there is any connection. The slab folks obviously just taped the old ICCS tag to the outside of the slab. Who knows why.

By the way, without the ICCS tag, that's an easy 70 >>



By whose standards??

AuldFartte

<< <i>

<< <i>Doubt there is any connection. The slab folks obviously just taped the old ICCS tag to the outside of the slab. Who knows why.

By the way, without the ICCS tag, that's an easy 70 >>



By whose standards?? >>



Why, the slabbers, of course

MrEureka

The slab folks obviously just taped the old ICCS tag to the outside of the slab.

I don't think so. I think the tag is in the holder and the tape has nothing to do with anything. Remember, ACG owns the equipment. They can put anything they want in the slabs. They don't need to tape anything to the outside of the holder, and they don't need to tape the holder shut.

MrEureka

BTW, I especially like the disclaimer at the bottom of the ICCS tag.

Conder101

I suspect this is NOT an Accugrade product. Yes the SHELL is an Accugrade shell, but for over three years now Accugrade has had as a side business an encapsulation service. You purchase a license from ACG and then for 2 to 3 dollars per coin they will encapsulate coins with YOUR company name and what ever you want on the label. You supply the grades, the ACG staff never looks at the coins, they go straight the the encapsulation dept and were sealed in ACG shells. (They started doing this back about the same time as the very first Coin World shells started appearing.)

At that time it wasn't possible to buy generic shells on the market and this was the cheapest way for someone who wanted to start a grading company to do so. No expense for a sonic welder or the tens of thousands of dollars it would cost to have you own shells made up.

I was told that about 14 companies were using the ACG encapsulation service but I have only been able to trace about 6. This would make seven and this is the only one I have seen using the ACG photoslab shells. The most commonly seen company is CCC Coins, Cards, & Collectibles (Might be Coins, Cards, & Currency, I forget.) Many of us have seen him set up at shows, owner is Bruce Magg. Most of his stock is CCC and ACG slabs. (He was named in the first ACG suit as one of the people whose patronage ACG had lost because of the actions of the Defendants. In reality Bruce stopped submitting because he stopped using ACG's grading service and switched to the encapsulation service which let him assign his own grades, get his product out on the market, and it was cheaper than the slabbing fees. So the original suit was wrong on two counts, he did NOT lose his patronage, and it was an ACG business decision than caused him to change not the defendants.)

This is also a very new company apparently. All of the ACG encapsulation products start with serial #10001 so this persons actions have the second and fourth coins produced. I woud say what this guy is probably doing is buying ICCS certified coins and then for a couple dollars more getting the coins out of the PVC flips and into a slab. Of course it does raise the question as to whether or not the coin has been switched.

SYRACUSIAN

That's very interesting Conder, thanks.


You purchase a license from ACG and then for 2 to 3 dollars per coin they will encapsulate coins with YOUR company name and what ever you want on the label. You supply the grades, the ACG staff never looks at the coins, they go straight the the encapsulation dept and were sealed in ACG shells. (They started doing this back about the same time as the very first Coin World shells started appearing.)

At that time it wasn't possible to buy generic shells on the market and this was the cheapest way for someone who wanted to start a grading company to do so. No expense for a sonic welder or the tens of thousands of dollars it would cost to have you own shells made up.



How much does this licence cost? And is there any other way to do this now? Like perhaps sealing World Coin shells and printing a different label than the one provided with them?

SYRACUSIAN

So the original suit was wrong on two counts, he did NOT lose his patronage, and it was an ACG business decision than caused him to change not the defendants.)



What ACG decision was that? The way I understood your reply, it was his decision to switch from slabbing to encapsulating only.

sliderider

<< <i>So the original suit was wrong on two counts, he did NOT lose his patronage, and it was an ACG business decision than caused him to change not the defendants.)



What ACG decision was that? The way I understood your reply, it was his decision to switch from slabbing to encapsulating only. >>



What he meant was that by offering an encapsulating only service, the dealer in question switched from grading and encapsulation to encapsulation only. Had ACG not offered an encapsulation only service, this dealer likely would have continued using ACGs grading and encapsulation service. So both sides are right, it depends how you look at it. The more profitable grading and encapsulation service lost him as a customer, but the new encapsulation only service gained him as a customer, but ACG still loses money on the deal because one of their large volume dealers is now paying less money to them because he is doing his own grading now. It also results in a loss of reputation (don't say it, you know who may be watching) to ACG because some of their other large accounts who may have had doubts about ACGs grading will now use their encapsulation only service and provide their own grades, resulting in an even bigger loss of income for ACG. It also puts ACG in the position of having yet another slab on the market to compete with. If enough of ACGs big clients jump ship and start doing their own grading, at least some of those dealers will end up doing a better job of it than ACG is and people looking to buy will trust the private label slabs more than ACGs. So no matter how you look at it, ACG loses.

FilamCoins

<< <i>How much does this licence cost? >>



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