Why doesn't PCGS recognize this hub variety ...

Sunnywood

1892 was the first year of production for the dimes, quarters and halves designed by Charles Barber. In the quarter series, dies from the new reverse hub went into production at all three mints (Philadelphia, San Francisco and New Orleans). However, the hub was redesigned during the year to enlarge the eagle on the reverse, with the effect that the eagle's wingtips cover more of the legend.

Thus all three 1892 quarters, the -P, the -S, and the -O come in two varieties, generally known as "Type I" and "Type II." Quite often, when any 1892-dated quarters come up at auction, the cataloguers do note the reverse hub variety, and it is certainly considered a noted variety worthy of collecting. Why doesn't PCGS attribute the hub variety on the insert as "Type I" or "Type II"? With PCGS now certifying all sorts of microscopic varieties, VAMs, etc, it seems to me that a well known and oft-described variety like this should be noted on the certification insert.

Here are pictures of an 1892-P Type I and an 1892-P Type II. Look at the eagle's left wingtip, and you can see that in Type I more of the "E" is visible. In particular, the middle part of the "E" is visible just above the wing. In Type II this part of the "E" is covered. Some cataloguers use the phrase "Now you see it, now you don't" to remember which is which. I would love to see these coins properly identified as "Type I Reverse" and "Type II Reverse" on the insert.

Leiana

Interesting, I didn't know that!

Thanks for teaching me something new.

-Amanda

NumisOxide

Interesting and good point.

BTW, those two are real beauties.

JRocco

Ask Ron on the Q&A board.

Maybe you have to call it a birthdot or birthmark E to get it recognized





Nah ---- this one looks like a real variety---it doesn't have a chance....

TahoeDale

To David Hall and Ron Guth:

Sunnywood has spoken, very clearly as is always the case.

I promise to send in for re-slabbing and attribution all my 1892 Barber coinage, and Steve Duckor, Peter Shireman, and The Barber dimes guys( Stewart and the Law collection) will do the same.

If you business men will also expand the die varieties for the other types( s/s, o/o, etc), no telling how much money the company will generate.

Do the numbers, and announce your decision.

WoodenJefferson

I can't get past the beautiful colors to notice the difference! WOW

Overall good question for Q&A with Mr. Guth

Sunnywood

Thanks all, I will submit this to the Q&A Board, and we'll see what happens !!

Best,
Sunnywood

airplanenut

Holy crap that first coin is amazing!

TomB

They are both amazing.

stman

There he goes showing that 2nd one again Seen it in person twice..... the one I couldn't pull the trigger on.

Sunnywood

By the way, it is completely incomprehensible to me that the second coin posted above is only graded MS66 by PCGS !! By comparison, here are two additional ordinary Barber quarters from my collection, again demonstrating the difference between the two reverse hubs. First pictured below is an 1892-S Type I Reverse, and second is an 1892-O Type II Reverse. Nice coins to be sure, but those two above blow them away ... that's the difference between nice coins and true monsters !!








Best,
Sunnywood

stman

Sunnywood, I thought "our" coin was a very nice 66 at minimum. Blazing luster, and very clean surfaces. Did I ever mention I liked that one? LOL.

Sunnywood

stman, you can have honorary joint ownership
I'll put you on the Board of Trustees, or perhaps the Advisory Council LOL
and as you know, I paid solid MS67+ money for that coin !!
... no way is that an MS66 in my book, holder be d*mned !!!!!

RichieURich

Super coins again, Sunnywood! I always enjoy looking at the coins you post.

A good way to distinguish between the two types is that on Type 1, the serif on the middle part of the E is visible, while on Type 2, the middle serif is completely covered.

eyoung429

Even though Barbers are not my specialty....I still collect them and yet again....This is the reason I love this forum....amongst all the threads you can still learn something new!!!!

btw....Sunny and ST ......Those are some B!t@hen coins!!!!!!!!

Thank you for sharing them again!!!!

MFH

Having all the die varieties of 1892 Quarters ( P- O & S ) , I too would love to see PCGS include them in a "With Varieties" category. What about the hub varieties of 1900 and 1901; the 1901-O DDR's as well ?

Also, the Halves should have the the 1892 TDR & 1907-S/s.

As mentioned in other posts, most of my Dimes are still locked away in a Dansco album, but I'd be willing to have that set holdered as well if PCGS did designate the Quarter and Half dollar varieties ! That submission alone would generate over $2,000 in submission fees.

Sunnywood...your quarters are amazing !!!