Help ~ Found Coins, Want to Sell ~ Advice?

mimibrandt · October 16, 2006 10:55PM

Total newbie, self-guided for a couple months. Local dealers were scary (wanting upwards of 30% of pice guide value). Had some MS65's PCGS graded hoping to increase sales potential. Checked PCGS online price guide ... then Ebay ~ guide vs. actual sales vary up and down. Is Ebay the place to sell? How do you decide on a starting bid? And, finally, can you recover from dealer for pvc residue (22 years later) and/or receiving an "altered" coin? Sorry if this is the wrong site to ask these questions ... but grateful for any and all direction. Thanks.

coinguy1 · October 16, 2006 11:06PM

<< <i>Total newbie, self-guided for a couple months. Local dealers were scary (wanting upwards of 30% of pice guide value). Had some MS65's PCGS graded hoping to increase sales potential. Checked PCGS online price guide ... then Ebay ~ guide vs. actual sales vary up and down. Is Ebay the place to sell? How do you decide on a starting bid? And, finally, can you recover from dealer for pvc residue (22 years later) and/or receiving an "altered" coin? Sorry if this is the wrong site to ask these questions ... but grateful for any and all direction. Thanks. >>

What type and dates of coins do you have? Depending upon the answer, Ebay might be a good option.

Keep in mind that price guides are often inaccurate, on the high side or the low side. No to your question about PVC residue and most likely the same for the "altered" coin.

mimibrandt · October 17, 2006 4:34AM

mimibrandt · October 17, 2006 4:44AM

Some of the coins I have:

1886 3CN at PR66
1872 nickels graded at MS65 & MS66
1927 nickel MS65
1879 dime MS65
1924-D quarter MS66
1941-D half-dollar MS66

My favorite to look at (pretty coin): 1925-D $2.50 MS65

a bunch of Morgan dollars
a few St. Gaudens $20 gold (mostly between MS64 and MS65)

There's more to the collection we found, but we limited what we sent off to PCGS. So, what part of that info determines whether to go on Ebay or elsewhere ~ and thanks for taking your time.

lkenefic · October 17, 2006 5:05AM

Ebay might be a good venue...but you also have to remember listing fees, final valuation fees, and additional fees if you elect to place a reserve on your coins. It looks like the majority of your coins are certified which is good...especially for selling on ebay. The crux might be getting good images of your coins to post with the auction. Good images of the coin can dramatically affect the bottom line. Unless you're prepared to send these off to a photographer...or have a digital imaging set-up yourself (I'm still trying to master mine) you might want to hold off selling. Selling with crappy images will definitely hurt your bottom line.

Leo

coinguy1 · October 17, 2006 5:09AM

If those are PCGS grades that sounds like a nice group of coins. I'd suggest checking the ANR and Heritage auction archives to give you a feel for what such coins have been selling for recently.

goose3 · October 17, 2006 5:25AM

Or just consign them to RUSS on here and let him worry about all of the hassle, etc...with ebay.

I would highly recommend him as I am sure others would as well.

His ebay handle is Compucheap I believe.

mirabela · October 17, 2006 5:36AM

Those are fairly serious coins. Ebay may not be the place to realize full value for them. I certainly would not suggest you sell them yourself on ebay if you do not have a well established account with hundreds or thousands of feedback and a 99.9% positive rating; you'll lose your shirt. Go with an established ebay consignment seller, or you might want to try Teletrade or another auction house. Do your homework first, because from the sounds of it you are talking about thousands of dollars and perhaps tens of thousands.

[edited for grammar]

coinguy1 · October 17, 2006 5:42AM

If the listed coins have already received those grades from PCGS, below are approximate current "retail" values. If those are uncertified grades, the coins might be worth considerably less. Please be aware that prices, even for coins of identical dates and grades, can vary considerably based upon the merits of the individual coins, as well as market conditions.

1886 3CN at PR66 $650
1872 nickels graded at MS65 $1200 & MS66 The most recent auction sale I am aware of was at $4600 in July. Some others have brought quite a bit more or less.
1927 nickel MS65 $230
1879 dime MS65 $700
1924-D quarter MS66 $600
1941-D half-dollar MS66 $190
1925-D $2.50 MS65 $4000 (These were more than $1000 higher just a few months ago.)

mimibrandt · October 17, 2006 6:05AM

So, best I can tell ~ my new "best friends" are in a 5-way tie:

Ebay
Teletrade
Auction House (Heritage?)
ANR (I don't know what this is), or
"Russ" (guessing a consignment seller?)

What everyone does agree on is "be careful" and study more. Can anyone break the tie and head me in a research direction?

Is the PCGS price guide any good as a starting point? What is a fair % of sale if you utilize a 3rd party? (And, please, don't tell me 30-40 ~ please!!!)

CarsonCityGold · October 17, 2006 6:10AM

Are they PCGS graded coins? The answer to that will help decide which direction to take.

stman · October 17, 2006 6:24AM

I think y'all ought to call each other on the phone tonight.

mirabela · October 17, 2006 6:38AM

The PCGS price guide tends to be unrealistically high. The most realistic pricing information easily available is probably the permanent auction archives at Heritage (heritagecoin.com). Set up an account there (free) and you can access it. Obviously, not all coins of a given issue in a given grade are equal -- yours might be nice or not as nice as the ones in these completed sales -- and market conditions could have changed substantially since the auctions in question, but at least they are records of actual transactions that actually took place.

You are talking about fairly worthwhile coins, so you might figure 15-20% back from those auction closing prices as a fair place to start with a dealer, if you go that route.

ANR is American Numismatic Rarities, a New England auction house that recently merged with Stacks'. Russ is an ebay consignment seller with a reputation for fair play, close margins, and excellent photographic skills.

Russ · October 17, 2006 9:04AM

mimibrandt,

You should enable your PM function to facilitate communication. And, in case you're interested, here's a link to my recent auctions, (since I was mentioned):

Click here.

Russ, NCNE

lkenefic · October 17, 2006 9:29AM

Russ does take some of the best images I've ever seen.

RedTiger · October 17, 2006 3:14PM

<< <i>Some of the coins I have:

1886 3CN at PR66
1872 nickels graded at MS65 & MS66
1927 nickel MS65
1879 dime MS65
1924-D quarter MS66
1941-D half-dollar MS66

My favorite to look at (pretty coin): 1925-D $2.50 MS65

a bunch of Morgan dollars
a few St. Gaudens $20 gold (mostly between MS64 and MS65)

There's more to the collection we found, but we limited what we sent off to PCGS. So, what part of that info determines whether to go on Ebay or elsewhere ~ and thanks for taking your time. >>

It sounds like they were graded at one time by some person, some company, and now some are off to PCGS. Unfortunately, many times the grading results in these cases brings some upsetting news. I wish you well, but often times the other person's grades, the other company's grades are not anywhere near the PCGS grades. Unfortunately the value of the coins will depend a lot of that PCGS opinion.

As others have said PCGS price guide is usually very high. Heritage and Ebay are closer to true market value. Tough to sell on Ebay without establishing a history and taking excellent photos. Learning that can take a ton of time plus buying a camera and other equipment. That route is not something I would suggest to a new seller unless they wanted to take on another hobby (photographing coins).

Wolf359 · October 17, 2006 3:30PM

Russ absolutely.

mimibrandt · October 21, 2006 7:40PM

Thanks to all of you. Every coin is PCGS graded. They were originally graded by David Hall back in the mid 80's ... when we "found" them, we decided to let PCGS certify some ~ which include all those I listed.

Enable PM?

Much info to digest. This is my first outing into any forum. Feeling pretty good about it.

Steve27 · October 21, 2006 8:26PM

"Enable PM?"

PM means private messages. If you look in the right-hand corner of each post, everyone who has enabled their PM function has the "lock" icon showing. Just go into your profile and look for it.

TwoSides2aCoin · October 22, 2006 12:44AM

call me ... I'll help ya !

I wouldn't mind being on the list of your new best friends

coinguy1 · October 22, 2006 12:55AM

<< <i>Thanks to all of you. Every coin is PCGS graded. They were originally graded by David Hall back in the mid 80's ... when we "found" them, we decided to let PCGS certify some ~ which include all those I listed.

Enable PM?

Much info to digest. This is my first outing into any forum. Feeling pretty good about it. >>

What do you mean when you say that you "found" the coins?

In order to "enable" your private messages ("PM"), go to "Profile" near the upper right of your screen, then scroll down until you see "Allow Private Messages" and click the "on" option. This will allow you to send and receive private messages to/from other forum members if they have enabled their private messages too. You can see a

at the upper right of a member's post if their private messages are enabled. When you click on that, it will open a window in which you can type a private message to that person. If you have received private messages they will show in the upper left hand corner of your screen.

ABC123 · October 22, 2006 1:41AM

eBay !

JeffersonFrog · October 22, 2006 2:36AM

...

coinguy1 · October 22, 2006 2:45AM

<<Heritage: One of the most prestigious auction firms around, can get very good $ for premium coins, and sometimes average $ for average coins (they attract serious coin buyers who aren't necessarily looking for common dates). I think their commission is 5%, and depending on what auction your coins get into, it could take 3-4 months to get $ in hand.>>

Heritage, like most major auction houses, has a 15% "buyer's" premium (apart form any seller's commission or rebate). That so called "buyer's premium" usually ends up coming out of the SELLER'S pocket in the form of lower hammer prices upon which consignors/sellers are paid. If you don't understand how that works, let me know and I can give some specific examples.

mimibrandt · October 22, 2006 3:26AM

Newbie, remember?! I like the 5% commission; I have no idea what you mean by "lower hammer prices upon which consignors/sellers are paid."

I'm in no hurry to sell, but also have no intention of keeping them. When I say we "found them," I meant they were in a safe and we'd forgotten about them completely ... coming upon them during a big house cleaning! Shameful, really. A testament to my husband losing interest in collecting.

After getting all this help, I'm leaning toward Heritage ~ obviously need more education. Anything you can share would be appreciated.

And I've enabled PM and hope to, upon advice, "listen to" Russ.

You're all great ~ and your thoughts truly appreciated. Thanks.

coinguy1 · October 22, 2006 3:42AM

<< <i>Newbie, remember?! I like the 5% commission; I have no idea what you mean by "lower hammer prices upon which consignors/sellers are paid." >>

When you consign to an auction house, you are paid an agreed upon % of the hammer price realized for each lot. The 5% figure (or in some cases 0% commission or even small amount over hammer) is highly misleading in my opinion. Here is an old post and example of mine on "buyer's premiums", which explains why:

<<...this is what I mean when I say that in most (not all) cases, the "BUYERS' premiums" come out of the SELLERS' pockets:

Let's say I decide I am willing to pay a maximum of $2000 for a given coin in an auction...

If there is no "buyer's premium", I will bid up to $2000 hammer and the seller can receive up to $2000, plus or minus whatever he is entitled to, based upon his commission agreement with the auction house.

But, what if there is a 15% "buyer's premium"? I will adjust my hammer price bid so that I pay $2000 total, INCLUDING the buyer's premium - in this case I adjust/lower my hammer bid price to $1740, to take the 15% buyer's premium into account. I use a formula of 87% of the maximum price I'm willing to pay, when there is a 15% "buyer's premium" involved - it works out almost exactly right.

In the above example, the seller will receive up to $1740 plus or minus the agreed upon commission and not the $2000 hammer price that he would, if there were no "buyer's premium" involved.

In each case above, I, the buyer am willing to pay up to $2000 and might end up doing so. However, when there is a "buyer's premium", I and most buyers simply reduce the amount of our hammer bids, resulting in lower hammer prices and thus, lower prices for the seller.

I realize there are exceptions, in the case of bidders who don't care about an extra 15% for given coins, for whatever reason. But, I am convinced and have seen, time and time again, that most serious bidders lower their hammer price bids, to take the "buyer's premium" into account. And, the result is lower hammer prices, which in turn means lower net prices for the sellers.

I am not claiming that sellers do worse than they otherwise would, when "buyer's premium's" are involved, only that these premiums usually come out of the sellers' pockets and not the buyers' pockets.>>

Help ~ Found Coins, Want to Sell ~ Advice?

Comments