Opinions on this 1834 Bust Half

MikeKing

I'll state the grade because what I'm looking for is your opinions on this particular bust half dollar.
I have it in possession, and have the opportunity to return it.
It's in a PCGS 64 holder.
The coin is basically a greyish brown patination. The luster is subdued. I expected more luster, and have seen more luster in other dates of lesser grade. It's funny, because I'll be upset about the apparent lack of luster, will put the slab down on my desk, and all of a sudden, I see obvious cartwheeling as I move away. In part, the plastic and glare off the plastic is impeding. So I'll call it 'subdued'.

The other issue I have with this coin are the two areas on the hair that I've circled. Is this 'cabinet friction'?, the toning is obviously different, and 'less so' in the areas I've circiled. The flatness is due to the metal flow, but wouldn't the toning be unchanged in these areas? Perhaps not, if you think that the metal is ? structurally 'different' there than elsewhere. I don't know.

I will say this about the coin. I've looked for an 1834 for quite awhile, in grades below 65. I haven't seen one that I liked. Even in MS grades, most of them look like the cheek has been grazed, and I don't understand it, AND I don't like it, whatever the reason.

This particular Bust is absolutely beautiful, and the modifications of the Bust profile by Kneass, really show well in this coin, I think.

My concerns are it's being somewhate lackluster. Was it overdipped at one time? Is this secondary toning on an overdipped Bust half, or is it secondary toning on a Bust half where the die wear wasn't enough to cause those lines that result in cartwheeling? Or is it an originally toned bust half that impedes the luster? Or is it an originally toned Bust half struck with a die that didn't have enough wear to form those lines responsible for cartwheeling?

The other issue is the two areas in the hair that I've circled.

Is the coin a true MS64? My tendancy is to think that it is, and it's actually quite a beautiful coin, if not gorgeous, but I'd like your opinions. I guess my question is, is it worth MS64 money?



the area below the left of the shield is a scuff on the plastic:

AU58WALKERS

BTT

coinguy1

Personally, I find the darker/stained areas on Liberty's face and bust, as well as other areas, to be distracting and unattractive. I think the circled areas might be the result of the typical stacking/cabinet friction so often seen on these coins. It is NOT an irreplaceable coin, and if you have to ask on such a piece, my advice is almost alway to pass.

coinpictures

I concur. It may technically be a 64, but I don't like it. Seems drab (but it may be lighting).

Leiana

I don't like the surfaces on the obverse in particular. They seem a bit lifeless.

You said you have been searching for this particular coin for a while, but if you are having misgivings about it, then it is not the one for you. If you keep it, you will always have misgivings when you look at it. At least, that is my experience.

-Amanda

Bear

The dark areas and lack of luster are turn offs

for me at the 64 price level.

291fifth

AU

elwood

If you like crusty then it is the coin for you.

It lacks the pizazz to get one really excited about an MS-64.

I personally would like to see the stars more well struck.

The couple small areas of friction don't bother me.

How accurate is the pic? I'm assuming it is much more lustrous in person?

Crazy4Coins

As others have already stated....and as I have learned myself, if you are unsure about it being the right coin for you...then its probably not. Everytime you look at it you'll think the same thing.

Personally I would not buy that coin for 64 money, but of course every one has different taste.

OKbustchaser

I don't care for it (at least from the pics)...I like this one better.

From Anaconda

dorkkarl

it's a ms-60 coin at best. ms-64 is flat-out insane

K S

vega1

<< <i> I don't care for it (at least from the pics)...I like this one better. >>



Fixed Link

stman

Looks like there is a couple areas of light friction on the reverse as well. From the sound of your description and what the image depicts..... it's a dark cheek, dead fish.

Here is what I do, ignore the holder, ignore any stories the seller might give (although they can be entertaining) and decide if the Price
is what I'm willing to pay. Knowing a "64" the asking price is usually in the 4K range.......... Back it goes immediately.

mozin

I don't care for this coin, don't like the toning, and don't agree with the lofty grade.

If you are only looking for an 1834 for a date set, I suggest you look for one with a strong strike from newer dies. No need to buy one where the stars are flat like this coin. 1834s are the most plentiful CBH date, so there is no reason to buy one that gives you any pause.

BobGreene

I agree with what others have said. I appears to have been overdipped at one point, and the result isn't pretty. I would grade it higher than AU58, and I'm being generous. My advise to you is to pass.

MikeKing

Thanks everyone for your great advice and critiques on this coin. FYI I will be returning it, and again, thank you, I appreciate your help.
Michael

roadrunner

Very typical for a MS64 1834 and probably accurately graded. It's not AU. But all the distractions as mentioned are reality.
1834's don't come all that well struck and you have the slightly different hair styling that gives the impression
of flatness and wear. Check out the cap fold as well - flat. There is slight friction on the nostril, wingtips,
and eagle's brow - again very typical. The "black cheek" affect is a distraction to many. I've seen NGC 66's
with a darker and more obvious cheek. See the last ANR sale for a pair of 1834 MS66's.

I feel your pain. Finding a well struck, orig, nice luster, no rub CBH in any grade is a chore. Finding all the
attributes you seek will be very hard in an 1834. I just finished a 3 year search for a decent MS65 and I had
to "settle" just a bit on my piece. The best chance of scoring the kind of coin you want is a fresh old holder
coin from the 1980's in a 62 to 64 holder....and pray a dealer doesn't beat you to it.

roadrunner

dorkkarl

btw, this coin is NOT "crusty"

curious, what was the asking price on this piece?

K S

Barndog

The one thing I like about the coin, if the pic is accurate, is the color. The greyish brown (I call it "dusky") color is my favorite and I would love to have more half dimes with the color. It is truly striking, especially when compared against "regular" silver-grey toned coins.

JRocco

Hey Mike,
I could live with the skin on this one. In fact, her nice full cheek and great nose/lips/eyes make a great statement. What I don't like is that rub. Rub is rub. I am sure this is cabinet and/or stacking friction, but....
For 64 money I would pass on the coin. There are nicer 64's out there and a few to choose from. So unless this one came to me with a give away price- I would pass.

GoldenEyeNumismatics

coin was struck from a die that had relatively little use by that time. It has stupendous detail

MikeKing

I do have to agree that this strike (at least the central device), the cheek, nose etc... are exceptional. The toning on the face and neck doesn't bother me, in fact, it accentuates Kneass' design, I think. Like Brian said, it's so difficult to find an 1834 with all the attributes I would like. Common date, yes, difficult to find 'intact', if you know what I mean. If this coin wasn't so lackluster, I'd likely have kept it, despite the cabinet friction.

RickMilauskas

I'm no expert and have been asking opinions on bust halves myself.

I rather like the toning as opposed to the usual gray or the dipped white look.

For a 64 though it has too much "rub" of friction for me. As others have stated, you can find a nicer 64 if you keep looking.