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Value of a Cleaned Coin

1Stock1Stock Posts: 62 ✭
in U.S. Coin Forum
Hello everyone. I'm new to the forum but have been reading the posts here for several months. Just got back into coin collecting recently and have focused my purchases on $10 liberty gold. My question is: If a coin has been cleaned, what would you say the
% decrease in value would be (generally speaking) compared to the value of the same coin that hasn't been cleaned? I realize that factors such as rarity, what kind of coin it is, degree of cleaning, etc would also factor in, but i'd like to get your opinions on the subject. For example, if you could purchase a problem free coin for $500.00, how much would you deduct for the same coin if it was cleaned? Thanks!

Ralph on the Island of Guam

Comments

  • critocrito Posts: 1,735 ✭
    Depends on the severity of the cleaning. A lightly cleaned coin might not decrease at all in value, especially if it's an old cleaning and in a series where original examples are difficult to find. A more modern and harshly cleaned coin might be reduced to scrap, losing all its numismatic value. image
  • Steve27Steve27 Posts: 13,274 ✭✭✭
    In addition to the amont of cleaning the rarity of the coin is also a major factor. If you have a lightly cleaned 1923 Peace dollar, it's worth little more than bullion; however, if it was a 1928 Peacxe dollar, it might lose only 10-20% of it's value.
    "It's far easier to fight for principles, than to live up to them." Adlai Stevenson
  • tpfnartpfnar Posts: 247

    A cleaned coin cannot grade higher than AU
  • Derek2100Derek2100 Posts: 248
    I value cleaned coins at zero when evaluating a collection or estate.
  • a039a039 Posts: 1,546 ✭
    Ralph, Welcome to the forum! image
  • PerryHallPerryHall Posts: 46,231 ✭✭✭✭✭


    << <i>I value cleaned coins at zero when evaluating a collection or estate. >>



    So a Carson City double eagle with a light cleaning is valued at zero? Very interesting.



    Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
    "Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value---zero."----Voltaire
    "Everything you say should be true, but not everything true should be said."----Voltaire

  • jayboxxjayboxx Posts: 1,613 ✭✭
    << I value cleaned coins at zero when evaluating a collection or estate. >>


    So a Carson City double eagle with a light cleaning is valued at zero? Very interesting.

    I agree, there has to be some scrap value there. image
  • LeianaLeiana Posts: 4,349 ✭
    Depends on the type of cleaning. image

    If I can tell it has been cleaned, and if that fact will bother me as long as I own the coin, then yes, I will be wanting to pay less for it.

    -Amanda
    image

    I'm a YN working on a type set!

    My Buffalo Nickel Website Home of the Quirky Buffaloes Collection!

    Proud member of the CUFYNA
  • ABC123ABC123 Posts: 2,627
    Beauty is in the eye of the Holder!!!
  • ziggy29ziggy29 Posts: 18,668 ✭✭✭
    I agree with the concept that it largely depends on the degree of the cleaning, how old the cleaning was (i.e. how much has it retoned over the cleaning), and how scarce the coin is.

    A very scarce date or rare die variety might not lose THAT much of its value with a modest cleaning. A very common coin, on the other hand, likely loses a LOT.
  • notwilightnotwilight Posts: 12,864 ✭✭✭


    << <i>A cleaned coin cannot grade higher than AU >>



    Assuming it doesn't grade BB.
  • mirabelamirabela Posts: 5,031 ✭✭✭✭✭
    It depends a great deal on the values of uncleaned coins in surrounding grades. Imagine, for instance, a cleaned AU 1928 Peace dollar. An uncleaned one might be worth $375, but you'll pay $300 or so for the same coin in uncleaned Fine -- so a cleaned AU might still be worth $250 or $300.

    On the other hand, imagine a cleaned choice AU 1896-O Morgan. That coin, if uncleaned, will be worth in the $200 - $250 range, maybe more if it's struck well and has good luster, but a choice XF is only worth maybe $30 tops. So, your cleaned AU is going to be worth a tiny fraction, 10-20%, of what it would have been worth if uncleaned.

    Make sense? It's totally situational.
    mirabela
  • jmj3esqjmj3esq Posts: 5,421 ✭
    << A cleaned coin cannot grade higher than AU >>

    I have seen many ANACS slabs that noted cleaning but still give a net graded of MS60 details.
  • RedTigerRedTiger Posts: 5,608 ✭
    Heritage and Teletrade auction archives have a good number of ANACS problem slabs listed. A new collector could use this as a reference as to what people are willing to pay vs. coins without the problem. Often it is a full grade lower and then some in value. Depends on the collector, the dealer, the coin what price level is acceptable. There are many collectors that will not have them, but in an auction it is the price that the top two bidders are willing to pay that sets the level.

    /edit to add: I see the original poster is talking about $10 gold eagles. Melt value plus a small smidge is about what common ones that have been cleaned will usually go for. There are plenty of certified coins available for a very small amount more. If they are rare date eagles, each coin has to evaluated individually, and it depends on finding the right seller, or right buyer/bidders as far as getting the best price either way.
    Investment blog: gold, stocks and more
  • MFHMFH Posts: 11,720 ✭✭✭✭


    << <i>I agree with the concept that it largely depends on the degree of the cleaning, how old the cleaning was (i.e. how much has it retoned over the cleaning), and how scarce the coin is.

    A very scarce date or rare die variety might not lose THAT much of its value with a modest cleaning. A very common coin, on the other hand, likely loses a LOT. >>



    image


    Ralph..........image
    Mike Hayes
    ~~~~~~~~~~~~
    Coin collecting is not a hobby, it's an obsession !

    New Barber Purchases
  • 123cents123cents Posts: 7,178 ✭✭✭
    Welcome to the forum Ralph.
    image
  • PerryHallPerryHall Posts: 46,231 ✭✭✭✭✭


    << <i><< A cleaned coin cannot grade higher than AU >>

    I have seen many ANACS slabs that noted cleaning but still give a net graded of MS60 details. >>



    I've seen them too. They were very lightly cleaned coins that would make it into PCGS or NGC slabs.



    Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
    "Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value---zero."----Voltaire
    "Everything you say should be true, but not everything true should be said."----Voltaire

  • ziggy29ziggy29 Posts: 18,668 ✭✭✭


    << <i>I've seen them too. They were very lightly cleaned coins that would make it into PCGS or NGC slabs. >>

    Yes. It's well known and established that they WILL slab some lightly cleaned coins, essentially "net graded" downward. That's especially true for the really old types and for some of the scarce classics.
  • RichieURichRichieURich Posts: 8,467 ✭✭✭✭✭
    image 1Stock!

    An authorized PCGS dealer, and a contributor to the Red Book.

  • TonedbuffTonedbuff Posts: 1,190
    Let's see... when buying a coin, cleaning reduces the value from zero to twenty percent...

    When selling or trading it reduces the value by 80%

    I don't buy cleaned coins any more... image
  • TwoSides2aCoinTwoSides2aCoin Posts: 44,364 ✭✭✭✭✭
    cleaned coins are like skeletons in the closet.


    but that's just my opinion image

    Hi Stock...


    Joe
  • delowaydeloway Posts: 30 ✭


    << <i>

    << <i>I've seen them too. They were very lightly cleaned coins that would make it into PCGS or NGC slabs. >>

    Yes. It's well known and established that they WILL slab some lightly cleaned coins, essentially "net graded" downward. That's especially true for the really old types and for some of the scarce classics. >>



    Excuse me for being ignorant, but what does the term "net graded" mean. Thanks.
  • RedTigerRedTiger Posts: 5,608 ✭


    << <i>

    << <i>

    << <i>I've seen them too. They were very lightly cleaned coins that would make it into PCGS or NGC slabs. >>

    Yes. It's well known and established that they WILL slab some lightly cleaned coins, essentially "net graded" downward. That's especially true for the really old types and for some of the scarce classics. >>



    Excuse me for being ignorant, but what does the term "net graded" mean. Thanks. >>



    Instead of a body bag for cleaning, a coin that might make MS63 on its merits, it might get net graded 62 or 61 because it has been lightly dipped.

    The other use of the term is old ANACS slabs where problem coins are given a details grade plus a net grade. Usually the net grade is a bit optimistic as far as value. Examples might be UNC details, net AU for cleaning, VG details net AG for corrosion.

    Investment blog: gold, stocks and more
  • delowaydeloway Posts: 30 ✭


    << <i>

    << <i>

    << <i>

    << <i>I've seen them too. They were very lightly cleaned coins that would make it into PCGS or NGC slabs. >>

    Yes. It's well known and established that they WILL slab some lightly cleaned coins, essentially "net graded" downward. That's especially true for the really old types and for some of the scarce classics. >>



    Excuse me for being ignorant, but what does the term "net graded" mean. Thanks. >>



    Instead of a body bag for cleaning, a coin that might make MS63 on its merits, it might get net graded 62 or 61 because it has been lightly dipped.

    The other use of the term is old ANACS slabs where problem coins are given a details grade plus a net grade. Usually the net grade is a bit optimistic as far as value. Examples might be UNC details, net AU for cleaning, VG details net AG for corrosion. >>



    Thanks RedTiger.
  • lkeneficlkenefic Posts: 8,160 ✭✭✭✭✭


    << <i>Excuse me for being ignorant, but what does the term "net graded" mean. Thanks. >>



    Net grading takes damage or cleaning into consideration when assigning a grade. Typically, PCGS and NGC will not "net-grade" most coins...they will simply return them to you as problem coins...aka Body Bag. ANACS on the other hand will note AU50 details but Net-graded to XF40 due to cleaning [or whatever reason...corrosion, rim hits...etc]

    Leo
    Collecting: Dansco 7070; Middle Date Large Cents (VF-AU); Box of 20;

    Successful BST transactions with: SilverEagles92; Ahrensdad; Smitty; GregHansen; Lablade; Mercury10c; copperflopper; whatsup; KISHU1; scrapman1077, crispy, canadanz, smallchange, robkool, Mission16, ranshdow, ibzman350, Fallguy, Collectorcoins, SurfinxHI, jwitten, Walkerguy21D, dsessom.
  • delowaydeloway Posts: 30 ✭


    << <i>

    << <i>Excuse me for being ignorant, but what does the term "net graded" mean. Thanks. >>



    Net grading takes damage or cleaning into consideration when assigning a grade. Typically, PCGS and NGC will not "net-grade" most coins...they will simply return them to you as problem coins...aka Body Bag. ANACS on the other hand will note AU50 details but Net-graded to XF40 due to cleaning [or whatever reason...corrosion, rim hits...etc]

    Leo >>



    Thanks Leo.
  • ERER Posts: 7,345 ✭


    << <i>I value cleaned coins at zero when evaluating a collection or estate. >>


    Cool, I'll be happy to accept any zero-valued cleaned coins you have.
  • Cam40Cam40 Posts: 8,146 ✭
    conversely market grading rewards points for rarity or market desirability
    the actual grade or technical grade would be a point or more less than the market grade.

  • Cam40Cam40 Posts: 8,146 ✭
    when buying a coin, cleaning reduces the value from zero to twenty percent...
    When selling or trading it reduces the value by 80%

    image
  • mozinmozin Posts: 8,755 ✭✭✭
    My suggestion is forget all this talk about how much cleaning lowers the value of $10 Libs. Don't buy cleaned coins, simple as that.
    I collect Capped Bust series by variety in PCGS AU/MS grades.
  • PerryHallPerryHall Posts: 46,231 ✭✭✭✭✭


    << <i>My suggestion is forget all this talk about how much cleaning lowers the value of $10 Libs. Don't buy cleaned coins, simple as that. >>



    I bought one once at below melt. Did I do something dumb?




    Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
    "Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value---zero."----Voltaire
    "Everything you say should be true, but not everything true should be said."----Voltaire

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