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DSL STRIKES AGAIN!!!
mintyfresh
Posts: 46
Well I decided to take a chance with DSL on a card I have been after for a while. A 1975 Topps Mini Aaron #660 PSA 9. I got it in the mail fairly quickly, but I noticed right away there was a huge gap from the top edge of the card to the top of the holder. I turned the card over and sure enough it is miscut on the back. I measured the card the best I could given thats its still in the case and it's a full 1/16th short. When you place an ungraded mini on top of it you can see the difference right away. So anyway I email DSL and ask them why they didnt mention the miscut on the back of the card. No response. So I tell them I'm leaving negative feedback and I do. So anyways I go back to myebay under won items to look at the card again. The card isnt pictured anymore, in its place is a 1964 Beatles card! Can a seller go back after an item has been purchased an change the pic? Well thats my DSL experience. I won't buy from them again. Just for fun go check out the 75 Topps PSA 8's and 9's they're selling and look at all the diamond cuts, and OC's without qualifiers on the cards.
Always looking for High Grade Pete Rose @ Mint 1975 Topps
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Have ya got a front and back scan of the card? If the card is 1/16" short - that's not within the parameters set by PSA (no more than 1/32") - and if miscut on back - the card doesn't qualify for a 9 NQ.
If this is so - I would contact PSA about reviewing the card. If DSL wants to do the right thing, they should at least respond to your query?
How long did you wait for a response? You may have jumped the gun before they had a chance - they do a lot of selling and your email may have been on their "to do" list? Also, I noticed that they left you positive FB first which gave you leverage.
mike
<< <i>I can post a pic of the front and the back. I'm just curious if anybody else can do a search for the card to see if the pic shows up for them or if they get the beatles card also. Also I waited 2 days for a response. I dont really care how busy they are, if they have an unhappy customer they should be able to get back to them in 48 hours. If not I dont want to do business with then anyways. >>
I see the Beatles card also.
And since this isn't a 20$ card, I can see why you're upset. And 2 days isn't much time when you're talking about the kind of volume they do? But, I'm surprised that they didn't respond with your threat of a negative?
How did you pay? I would want to return the card - that's why I pay with a credit card - then I can "force" the card on them.
That's why I was surprised you negged them without any communication - that pretty much makes your negotiation with them a bit harder.
What is their return policy on graded - I've only bought a few cards from them.
mike
Collecting 1970s Topps baseball wax, rack and cello packs, as well as PCGS graded Half Cents, Large Cents, Two Cent pieces and Three Cent Silver pieces.
i feel your pain... i really do...
however, there are several points that need to be made here:
first and foremost, it seems to me that your real beef should be with psa for "mis-grading" that card!
if you really feel that it has been improperly graded (as many of us have at one time or another) and are a club member,
you can send the card to psa for a free "review." of course, you will have to foot the cost of shipping to & fro.
(and, they will almost assuredly return the card unchanged!)
i would review the standards for "9" and "miscut" before i went to the trouble, tho.
dsl does not purposely change their scans after auctions end... must have something to do with hosting them, but this is true of all their ended auctions.
with literally thousands of listings on ebay, i think that it's probably impossible to read & answer each & every email...
i have found that my phone calls, tho, have been extremely effective.
it appears to be a two-man operation & i think these guys are truly doing their best... always helpful & cooperative whenever i've contacted them.
i'm certain that a reasonable phone call could have prevented this outcome.
guess you could still try, but having already left them negative feedback, it would seem that bridge has been burned...
oh... one last point... i don't know a thing about the value of 1975 topps psa's, but i did notice that
the card you bought for $309 books for $700!
personally, i've always been quite fond of those kinds of purchases.
just my humble opinions...
I am surprised DSL left you feedback first. They never did that to me even though I have been on ebay a long time and have perfect feedback and never given anyone a neg.
BST: Tennessebanker, Downtown1974, LarkinCollector, nendee
I bought a lot of 77 PSA 9s from them one time, I took the 2 best looking cards and resubmitted them and they both came back as 10s. DSL is going to better than the vast majority of people selling things on ebay. You can be assured that you will get your product and that it won't be shipped to you in a cereal box. My guess is that they will offer you a refund on the card.
Scott
1977 Topps Star Wars - "Space Swashbucklers"
<< <i>I can post a pic of the front and the back. >>
Please do......
1955 Bowman Raw complete with 90% Ex-NR or better
Now seeking 1949 Eureka Sportstamps...NM condition
Working on '78 Autographed set now 99.9% complete -
Working on '89 Topps autoed set now complete
I recently sent in 2 of the same card and I swear that the 6 went into an 8 and the 8 into the 6 holder. I am 100% convinced this be the case. I would say this probably happens alot more often then we think?
ON ITS WAY TO NEWPORT BEACH, CA 92658
Collecting:
Brett Favre Master Set
Favre Ticket Stubs
Favre TD Reciever Autos
Football HOF Player/etc. Auto Set
Football HOF Rc's
ON ITS WAY TO NEWPORT BEACH, CA 92658
Maybe you could send them both back with a note asking them to check out what you think may have happened. Looking at them I would agree with you 100%
matt
1994 Pro Line Live
TheDallasCowboyBackfieldProject
Those look switched to me.
I guess this illustrates one of the major flaws in buying graded for a sense of security.
And, I guess the rule about - "buy the card....." applies.
But, this is a rarity rather than the rule IMO.
mike
<< <i> My guess is that they will offer you a refund on the card.
Scott >>
Scott
That would have been my guess - but minty has already negged DSL - so I say that may be a tough road to hoe at this point.
mike
ON ITS WAY TO NEWPORT BEACH, CA 92658
Collecting 1970s Topps baseball wax, rack and cello packs, as well as PCGS graded Half Cents, Large Cents, Two Cent pieces and Three Cent Silver pieces.
<< <i>How do you paste in a picture of a card??? >>
Minty
Is the card hosted?
Go to your pic and select PROPERTIES - COPY the URL address
then, go REPLY - select the 4th icon from the left that looks like a pic frame.
ATTACH the URL address and Press OK.
Done
mike
ON ITS WAY TO NEWPORT BEACH, CA 92658
<< <i>9 minutes Mike , you slipping? What were you doing?
Waiting for my wife to get dressed!
We're heading out for a late lunch and shopping.
It's hotter'n'hell here!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!1
mike
ON ITS WAY TO NEWPORT BEACH, CA 92658
<< <i>Well I decided to take a chance with DSL on a card I have been after for a while. A 1975 Topps Mini Aaron #660 PSA 9. I got it in the mail fairly quickly, but I noticed right away there was a huge gap from the top edge of the card to the top of the holder. I turned the card over and sure enough it is miscut on the back. I measured the card the best I could given thats its still in the case and it's a full 1/16th short. When you place an ungraded mini on top of it you can see the difference right away. So anyway I email DSL and ask them why they didnt mention the miscut on the back of the card. No response. So I tell them I'm leaving negative feedback and I do. So anyways I go back to myebay under won items to look at the card again. The card isnt pictured anymore, in its place is a 1964 Beatles card! Can a seller go back after an item has been purchased an change the pic? Well thats my DSL experience. I won't buy from them again. Just for fun go check out the 75 Topps PSA 8's and 9's they're selling and look at all the diamond cuts, and OC's without qualifiers on the cards. >>
Is DSL truly to blame?
<< <i>Considering they send in multiple copies of each and every card do you think the chances of say an 8 go into a 10 and a 10 into a 9 or so on?
I recently sent in 2 of the same card and I swear that the 6 went into an 8 and the 8 into the 6 holder. I am 100% convinced this be the case. I would say this probably happens alot more often then we think? >>
With countless errors being swept under the rug as "mechanical errors," statistically speaking, you can bet that the other erros e.g. wrong grading, mixed slabs etc. are just as prevalent.
<< <i>The PSA 6 here is dead nuts centered and not a speck of white on the front or back, I thought for sure it was a 9 with a better than 50% chance at a 10. The PSA 8 is 55/45 with some white showing on the top right and some chipping on the back. I thought it was a 6 or 7 with a 10% chance at an 8.
They must have gotten the flips mixed on those to cards, corners on the PSA 6 are solid!
buyer before they receive FB first. Had DSL not left you positive FB, you
probably wouldn't have been so quick to leave a neg."
//////////////////////////////////////////////////////////
Sadly, this kind of "failure to communicate," has caused the
reluctance of most sellers to "go first."
My experiences with DSL:
They are one of the best companies that I have ever dealt with.
They sometimes ship even b4 they get paid, if the customer is
an old timer. (Or, maybe they just get confused and ship too early.)
Their email cup runneth over with nonsense. They have a phone,
and ANY "problem" is resolved quickly.
The instant card problem has to do with a complaint with a grader,
not with a seller. While DSL would no doubt have refunded to
avoid a controversy, they are not necessarily "obligated" to. PSA
will also make any legitimate complaint right.
Being too quick on the negative trigger is not the best route to
get concrete satisfaction. When folks are mean to me, I tend to
not to want to help them......... even when they are right.
I am not scolding the OP, just offering my outside view. I have
often felt frustrated with sellers, but have always found that -
unless the seller is a scamster - patience and a really polite
presentation ALWAYS works.
As a good seller, I deserve the opportunity to correct a mistake
and/or otherwise remedy a problem. If I am not given that chance,
an element of equity is missing in the transcation.
The sad thing is that DSL is essentially a "pushover" because they
simply do not have the time to argue with customers. Now, I do not
know how to unring this bell. Maybe something like:
"I am sorry that I probably acted in haste, but it was my first
transaction with you; I panicked and got impatient. What can we do
to get the NEG removed and get me satisfied with the transaction, too?"
Only a 50/50 at this point.
storm
I have bought alot of cards fro DSL and 4SC and only had 1 shipping problem--And thank God 4SC sent the card to CAREW4ME.
Lucky for us, CHARACTER is not a fantasy stat!!
<< <i>"I am sorry that I probably acted in haste, but it was my first
transaction with you; I panicked and got impatient. What can we do
to get the NEG removed and get me satisfied with the transaction, too?" >>
I'd call them and say something exactly like that. It's really the only shot the OP has left at getting some satisfaction from this.
let me beat the dead horse here.
1) It is PSA who graded it. That is why we use a third party so we are not taking opinions of sellers on the quality of cards. Take it up with PSA. If it were a raw card and they mislead you that is a different story.
2) I have talked to Shane at DSL before and he was gracious and we worked things out.
3) When you negative somebody, you have gone nuclear. Although with all of their volume your negative is a blip on the screen.
2.) you question why they didn;t list the miscut?
they don;t on any cards with few exceptions. they have them graded , use a stock listing and sell it. they don;t describe cards , if they did , they could not do the volume.
good luck , hopfully psa makes it right
i think that is the problem in this world, people rely on email instead of having conversations.
it happens in offices all across the country each day, someone gets peeved at someone else at sends out an email ranting at them. or maybe he wasn't ranting but the receiver took it that way and now and an email jihad has started.
just from my standpoint if it is important to you and i presume this was pick up the phone. maybe they we on vacation or at the national. a lot of these big dealers on ebay still run a skeleton staff and don't have a staff of 20 people in customer service.
say what you want about dsl. i can get 50 cards shipped for $8. i can pay them once a month if i want and never get anything other than a "smooth transaction" from them. they still continue to put up some of the nicest stuff from the 60's, 70's and 80's up on ebay.
I did a quick search of the posts you have started in this board and over half of them have issues with DSL.
The other half has issues with PSA and their grading.
All of us have not agreed with PSA at one point or another...but after a while you see an overgraded card ...just dont buy it.
You will enjoy the hobby a lot more if you see the positive side more often.
No one is putting a gun to your head and forcing you to buy low end cards.
Groucho Marx
Very true, I've had nothing but positive experiences with DSL and agree with you 100%
Also, what happened to posting a scan of this "miscut" PSA 9 card. I'm sure everyone would be interested in seeing the evidence here.
Collecting 1970s Topps baseball wax, rack and cello packs, as well as PCGS graded Half Cents, Large Cents, Two Cent pieces and Three Cent Silver pieces.
<< <i>
Also, what happened to posting a scan of this "miscut" PSA 9 card. I'm sure everyone would be interested in seeing the evidence here. >>
.....agrees...I am interested in seeing what all the commotion is about.
1955 Bowman Raw complete with 90% Ex-NR or better
Now seeking 1949 Eureka Sportstamps...NM condition
Working on '78 Autographed set now 99.9% complete -
Working on '89 Topps autoed set now complete
Have you ever considered that by lowering yourself to a personal attack, you're repelling people who would otherwise be inclined to help you?
Some questions. . .
- Did you request a scan of the back before placing your bid?
- At any time, did you ask DSL to accept a return on the card?
- Do I understand correctly that you negged them after sending them one e-mail and getting no response within 48 hours?
- Have you contacted anyone at PSA about your concerns with the card you received?
If you are having problems getting scans of the card posted, I'll be glad to post them if you want to send them to me in an e-mail.
For what it's worth, I've bought quite a few cards from DSL. . .many overgraded. . .many undergraded. In the building of three graded sets, one thing I did learn is that if you're going to pony up for a high-grade key card, either 1) hold the card in your hand prior to handing over cash or 2) make sure the eBay seller posts a scan to your satisfaction AND has a fair return policy.
Mike
"I GUESS YOU CANT BE CRITICAL OF ANY CARDS GRADED BY PSA HERE. I GUESS THEY DONT LIKE FEEDBACK ABOUT HOW TO IMPROVE THEIR PRODUCT. "VEE AHR PSA AND VEE DONT NEED YOU FEEDBACK." "NOW REPEATS AFTER ME"
PSA GOOD....I LOVE PSA...PSA GOOD...I LOVE PSA...PSA GOOD...I LOVE PSA...PSA GOOD...I LOVE PSA "
"Is it just me? Am I a magnet for crap PSA cards? I just got my 1975 topps mini Mike Schmidt PSA 8 NQ in the mail today. And wouldn't you know it on the top border of the card is about a 1/32 of an inch of yellow from the card above it on the sheet when they cut it. I know...I know "you should have looked at the scan closer and all that. But you could not tell from the scan that the card was miscut. WHAT THE HELL IS THE DEAL. THE BACKGROUND OF THE CARD IS GREEN AND IT HAS A YELLOW STRIPE ON THE TOP!! CAN A QUALIFIER BE ANY PLAINER? YOU GUYS DEBATE WHETHER A 71 BANKS HAS PSA 8 CORNERS OR NOT, AND MY CARD HAS A FREAKIN YELLOW STRIPE ACROSS THE TOP!!! I buy from all 4 major companies PSA, SGC, BGS, and GAI. If this trend continues I might have to join the PSA doomsayers. "
"Just got in yet another PSA Gem Mint 10 with 60-40 centering. I got the card off of ebay (1990 Leaf Thomas) and the seller didn't have a pic. Why does PSA allow a card to be slabbed Gem Mint that isnt centered? It makes no sense. Gem mint should mean just that, a gem of a card, as flawless as humanly possible. Obviously there are cards out there with the same qualities as mine that are centered, but both have the same designation. Has anyone seen the criteria for a 10 Perfect from GAI? "
"I'm seeing a lot of PSA 10 cards on e-bay that are noticeably off center, sometimes as much as 60-40. Should an off center card be given the gem mint grade? I always thought gem mint meant near perfection. Let me know if you guys are seeing the same thing, and what you think about it. "
Mintyfresh ...these are your own words ...some of go as far 2003 etc...maybe you should just collect BGS or GAI. Better yet ..you should star your own grading service!
Its a hobby ...its supposed to be fun.
If you dont like a card, dont buy it.
BTW.. sometimes I wish I lived with my parents!...lol... no morgate, kid, wife! ...I would have an amazing card collection.
Groucho Marx
The same is also true of 1970 Topps as well.
Mike
subtly funny and right on!
<< <i>amjones310 = blocked bidder. >>
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