Options
The state of the small card show
jdalymgd
Posts: 65
After reading all of the posts about The National, it made me realize how bad most local shows have become and why I look forward to going to the few regional or national card shows I get a chance to attend. Please forgive my rant but this has been building up for a while. I am sure I will feel better when I am finished 
I live in Michigan and the only somewhat decent show that is near me are the ones at Gibraltar trade Center at their Taylor and upscale Mt. Clemens location. These shows only a few years ago used to attract enough dealers to fill their entire show area and included dealers from Ohio or Illinois just enough to make so that you would not see the same things over and over again. There was always a good variety of vintage, graded, raw, or whatever set your sails you could say.
However, now they barely can fill half the show area even during the winter when one would usual think a show would be busier because most do not have things to do outside anymore. I was at Gibraltar this weekend and the problems with shows that will eventual kill most local shows are still the same.
1. Dealers the cards from the 1950's that you bought back in the 80's are not mint. Please do not try and price them as mint and use the line that they look just as good as those overpriced graded cards. They don't. If this is a business for you then with those you should do what most do and take a loss on inventory you can't move and sell them for want an ungraded EX-NM card would sell for. You might me surpirsed and not have any inventory left over to complaina bout dragging out on Sunday's. You might also surprise yourself and make a profit considering those are the cards you paid 10 cents on the dollar for from some for guy who did not know any better.
2. Dealers you might also want to talk to the folks that stop at your table and chat for a moment about cards or even current sports events. You might be surprised and make a few loyal customers for life. There are a couple dealers at the Gibraltar shows that still sell good quality graded and non graded cards I will by from everytime just because I get more than a grunt from them when I walk to their table and usually end up spending another 20 minutes chatting about cards with them.
3. If I am nice enough to ask to look at a card, please show the same coutesy and hand it to me instead of throwing it at me. If you do I won't buy it, and if it hits me and hurts me, I might throw it back at you and I would throw harder than you.
4. Please price your cards. I know you have a lot but if your going to do this on a regular basis once they are priced you'll never have to do it again!! Besides nobody wants to play the guessing game for an hour if they need 50 or 60 cards to complete sets. Heck that game show did not last on tv.
5. Chilli dogs and Nachos are great to eat at home watching a game! However, not on top of that showcase of cards I wanted to buy something out of for a lot of money.
Well I could go on but I will stop. If things like this keep happening at shows, mark my words, in 5 years there will be no more local shows and only the occasional player signing at a card shop in a mall.
How can the local card show be fixed? Can it be fixed? Where is Tom Cruise's kid? Somethings might never be able to be answered but I am sure everyone has their opinions to share.
I need to go pre-occupy myself until my order of a 1980 and 1982 Topps Baseball wax box and 1984 Donruss box get here from the BBC Exchange tomorrow or Tuesday or else I will have to order a box of 1979 Topps to tide me over.
Paul
I live in Michigan and the only somewhat decent show that is near me are the ones at Gibraltar trade Center at their Taylor and upscale Mt. Clemens location. These shows only a few years ago used to attract enough dealers to fill their entire show area and included dealers from Ohio or Illinois just enough to make so that you would not see the same things over and over again. There was always a good variety of vintage, graded, raw, or whatever set your sails you could say.
However, now they barely can fill half the show area even during the winter when one would usual think a show would be busier because most do not have things to do outside anymore. I was at Gibraltar this weekend and the problems with shows that will eventual kill most local shows are still the same.
1. Dealers the cards from the 1950's that you bought back in the 80's are not mint. Please do not try and price them as mint and use the line that they look just as good as those overpriced graded cards. They don't. If this is a business for you then with those you should do what most do and take a loss on inventory you can't move and sell them for want an ungraded EX-NM card would sell for. You might me surpirsed and not have any inventory left over to complaina bout dragging out on Sunday's. You might also surprise yourself and make a profit considering those are the cards you paid 10 cents on the dollar for from some for guy who did not know any better.
2. Dealers you might also want to talk to the folks that stop at your table and chat for a moment about cards or even current sports events. You might be surprised and make a few loyal customers for life. There are a couple dealers at the Gibraltar shows that still sell good quality graded and non graded cards I will by from everytime just because I get more than a grunt from them when I walk to their table and usually end up spending another 20 minutes chatting about cards with them.
3. If I am nice enough to ask to look at a card, please show the same coutesy and hand it to me instead of throwing it at me. If you do I won't buy it, and if it hits me and hurts me, I might throw it back at you and I would throw harder than you.
4. Please price your cards. I know you have a lot but if your going to do this on a regular basis once they are priced you'll never have to do it again!! Besides nobody wants to play the guessing game for an hour if they need 50 or 60 cards to complete sets. Heck that game show did not last on tv.
5. Chilli dogs and Nachos are great to eat at home watching a game! However, not on top of that showcase of cards I wanted to buy something out of for a lot of money.
Well I could go on but I will stop. If things like this keep happening at shows, mark my words, in 5 years there will be no more local shows and only the occasional player signing at a card shop in a mall.
How can the local card show be fixed? Can it be fixed? Where is Tom Cruise's kid? Somethings might never be able to be answered but I am sure everyone has their opinions to share.
I need to go pre-occupy myself until my order of a 1980 and 1982 Topps Baseball wax box and 1984 Donruss box get here from the BBC Exchange tomorrow or Tuesday or else I will have to order a box of 1979 Topps to tide me over.
Paul
0
Comments
People also get treated by how you look. Since I am younger than some collectors (28 in August), I get more of a hassle when I wear a Raiders shirt and a cap. lol If I go to a show from work with a tie on or at least a dress shirt, I get a lot better treatment. Maybe the guy thought you were a $1 common box window shopper. However, people should try to treat a potential buyer a little better. There might a reason that the guy still has that $500 card for sell???????????
My wife and I used to have a bit we would use with ignorant dealers. If I was looking at memorabilia, say gloves from the teens, and I asked if I could see one outside of the case, most dealers would proceed to tell me they were old (after they would finally acknowledge me after 7 "excuse me's") and than proceed to tell me they were worth a lot of money. My wife could tell that I was being frustrated, so she would walk over and say "Gee hon, those are just like the ones you have but they dont have the boxes to go with them like all of yours do...........
1)Stood in line for well over 1.5 hours...........just to get a ticket! Then another long line to get in.
2)When I got in, I had the thought of getting a few autographs before I started scouting the tables.............until i saw that it would be another 1.5 hour wait.............just to get the tickets to get the autographs!
3)Waaaayyyy too many dealers to see in the 1 day I had to shop. Yes, I had lists and knew exactly what I was looking for. It didn't matter, it still took me the better part of the rest of the show just to walk, very quickly, through every aisle and see which dealers might have something I was interested in. I FINALLY found a couple who had stuff I was looking for, but I was running out of time. I wound up spending a whopping $25, basically just to say I bought something. I got out of there as fast as I could, given the traffic.
I will never go back to another BIG show again.
Smaller shows, at least from my perspective, off buyers the chance to make "finds". By "finds" I mean that alot of small dealers or "weekend warrior-type" dealers really only know about mainstream cards and what is shown in newsstand price guides. That's it. Many times, I've found oddball items sitting in dealers boxes, behind their tables, because they didn't know a thing about them. And most of the time they are willing to just get rid of them because they don't want the hassle of carrying them around.
Also, at small shows, it is still likely to attract sellers who have dug up their cards from the 60's and want to get rid of them, so they rent a table (For almost next to nothing) and sell them. I've bought quite a few stacks of 60's material this way. Not always in the greatest shape, but sometimes.......
Another thing I like about small shows is that you are more likely to find sellers with stocks of common cards, which are the main thing I look for for building my sets.
I've found most small time dealers to be more friendly and down to earth than the big guys2. They are, at least to me, willing to stand and chat ,without being under pressure to buy from them.
I'll support small local shows until they just dry up and blow away, or until I do, whichever comes first.
Cataloging all those pesky, unlisted 1963 Topps football color variations Updated 2/13/05
<< <i> If I am nice enough to ask to look at a card, please show the same coutesy and hand it to me instead of throwing it at me. If you do I won't buy it, and if it hits me and hurts me, I might throw it back at you and I would throw harder than you. >>
jdaly
Nothing would make me more disappointed than that!
Had that happen to me at a shop in San Antonio. Walked away from the counter and have never returned.
<< <i>Another thing I like about small shows is that you are more likely to find sellers with stocks of common cards, which are the main thing I look for for building my sets. >>
I totally agree Bowdown...
This is one of the assets of a good shop or a small show. Drop off the wantlist and return to inspect your cards and pay the tariff.
Small shows are good for the neighborhood but I fear due to reasons that were mentioned, they are dinosuaurs - totally replaced by Ebay.
Big shows, will hopefully remain vital and are a great way to see the bigger dealers and meet people.
mike
<< <i>You know this kinda crap even went on at national this year. wed and thurs day dealers had no problem showing me money cards. friday when i took my wife and son and they tagged along to watch me wheel and deal some of the same delaers acted as if i were ther family man out on a museum outing . One dealer i asked to see a 52 mantle i wanted to buy one he didn't even open the case just rudly said that ones 7000 and didn't even look at me when he said it. So I pulled the 10g from my wifes purse and started counting. what do you knownow he wanted to show me all 3 he had. I kindly looked at my son and told him never buy from guys like this no matter how good there price is. >>
80sJunkie
So you didn't buy the card from him afterall?
If so. GOOD FOR YOU! The guy probably lost a good sale!
I would definitely pass on guys like that - afterall - there will always be another and if on ebay - cheaper!
mike
They are some of the best to deal with.
Paul
<< <i>1. Dealers the cards from the 1950's that you bought back in the 80's are not mint. >>
This is one of the bigger problems i have with card shows. A lof of them still have that 80's mentality. They dont believe in grading and everything they sell is at beckett prices (i.e. mint prices). If they do sell graded, its about 10-15% above SMR and, depending on the card and grade, about 20-25% above ebay prices.
<< <i>2. Dealers you might also want to talk to the folks that stop at your table and chat for a moment about cards or even current sports events. >>
A lot of these guys are really not businessmen. Some of them do this as a side job. As posters mentioned above, the way you look and approach a table effects the way a dealer treats you. A lot of the dealers are there to make money...not make friends.
<< <i>4. Please price your cards. >>
Basic negotiating practice. Let the buyer price it first to gain negotiating leverage.
If they are not interested in puchasing material just say we aren't buying today or we aren't interested in these type of items.Talk about discouraging anyone interested in getting in this hobby/ business.Typical quotes I hear repeatedly at shows -
I have a ton of those already that I can't sell.I can buy them by the pound !
I am having a really bad show and I'm can't spend a lot on purchases but let's see what you have. (Meanwhile he has an 8' long buying sign is on his table facing)
They're not worth a lot due to the condition.(T206 tobacco cards).I might be able to sell them as fillers,what do you need for them.
All my cards are near - mint.I can grade them myself.You are buying the card not the holder.Meanwhile I notice what appears to be a size difference between his raw cards and
some graded cards the same dealer is selling for a much higher price even though he doesn't believe in graded cards.
This is one I heard at the National,can you believe someone would say this."I don't believe in card grading,I would pay the same price if I were buying a graded card or a raw
one.In fact if I get graded cards I crack them out of the holders and sell them raw and get the same price.I don't know about other people's experiences but I have got burned
so many times on card trimming I now feel buying a raw card is like running through a mine field.I just got 8 more trimmed cards off E-BAY Tuesday.
I got this one on a 1962 GAI 9 HANK AARON from a dealer mentioned previously in this board.Of course no purchase offer was made on the item even though his bright red &
white sign indicated a high end purchaser."What do you have to get for this card,it does look very nice."I replied the SMR is I believe around $4000.00 dollars.He replied "Wow
that high"Like he didn't have a copy right under his table."It may be listed that high but percieved value is nowhere near that.I recommend you list it in a auction such as
Goodwin or Mile High." I guess he was expecting me to say I'll take $500.00 for it because I actually need the money for a habit or I'm down on my luck or homeless or
whatever.I understand everyone needs to make a buck but most of these so called buyers should put banners that indicate pawn shop.When was the last time anyone
actually saw one of these so called buyers actually buying anything from the general public that attends these shows?Most of the dealing goes on before thw show floors
open.Let's get real.
The worst one was when a 11 year old boy went up to a dealer with a paper bag filled with cards.Probably new cards that were purchased recently with some kind of ridiculous
Beckett insert pricing that made the kid think he was going to get hundreds of dollars for them.Once again the 8' banner hung proudly above the dealer's table indicating
BUYING.The boy asked the dealer in a meek voice how much he could get for his bag full of cards.Now keep in mind this is the future of the hobby represented by this child.The
dealer said "Cards in a paper bag,what am I supposed to do with that.Those cards aren't worth the paper they're printed on.Not interested."The boy walked away with
slumped shoulders and looked like he had just lost his best friend.I wonder if he'll be buying sportcards years from now?Even if this child did in fact have worthless cards there
is an appropriate way to either educate the customer or at least give a few words of encouragement without having to purchase the items.This dealer didn't have time for
either apparently.Talking to his buddy in the booth about where they were going partying that night was more important.
Anyway I agree with all the horror stories about the card shows unfortunately it is much more preferrable to buy in person as opposed to E_BAY as for as raw items are
concerned for obvious reasons.I sell approx. $2000.00 a week on E-BAY in graded material mostly from PSA and have to replenish my inventory somehow.I am also a sales
manager for a multi-million dollar company and if my sales people treated customers like I see some customers treated at these shows they would be gone.
There are still a few good people around and that's who I try to seek out and spend my money with.Thanks for the info on the Michigan shows as I was looking to attend one
of them in the near future.You just saved me a lot of wasted money.I believe the Philly show is by far the best as far as regionals go.Good luck.
Dont let the negative posts about the national keep you away from one. For every jerk dealer there is another one that will work with you. Besides the national is really a celebration of the hobby not a swap meet or clearence sale. Think of it as a chance to get off the keyboard and see the stuff we want up close and personal. I only attend large shows, about 2 a year due to the fact I go there with a large want list.
I will agree with you on one point. At last years national I was seriously searching for a raw 1966 Topps Mantle. Most of the guys wouldnt take one out of the case to let me see it up close or even quote me a price for that matter. Another guy said he was trying to sell it as a set. Its almost like they just want to show it off and thats ok but put it aside from the sale items. I think the local card shows are pretty much dead. At least where I live. I have one dealer in town who would put on a show every few months back in the late 80's. Why would he put one on now, he is the only show in town.
My Sandberg topps basic set
My Sandberg Topps Master set
Sorry just had to vent....
At least I found a way to spend around $3,500.00 on inventory since I found hopefully a lot of nice high end Callahan card from some great dealers such as McAvoy Sportscards.A little pricey but I hope PSA will be nice to me.Also a 1939 Ted Williams Exhibit card in an unopened pack purchased from Baseball Card Exchange that could make the hair stand up on the back of your neck.It has to be at least a PSA 9.I hope.Can't wait for Cleveland next year.Will be going to Chicago in a bit to try that show again.I skipped the last one since I wasn't too impressed with the one I attended before the National last year.More about autographs than sportscards.