Competition seems to be fierce on eBay for Toned coins.

ceeveeNJ

Just a rant...

For the last two weeks, I have been trying to get some toned Morgans off of eBay. I figured I'd play it safe and get PCGS/NGC slabbed coins in common years since I'm a newbie and on a budget. I've done some research and it seems that these coins often command 2x or 3x their normal value. Ok, I say to myself, I'll place a bid for 1.5x the coins value. Auction ends, I lose by a buck. Next time, I place a bid for 2x the coins value. Auction ends, I lose by a buck. Last night, I placed three different bids (on three different coins) for 1.5x - 3x the coins value. After each auction ended, I lost by a buck, a buck and $2.50.

Are Toned Morgans really that hot of a commodity? Geez!
Are there any other places were I won't continue to get sniped?

Just wondering...

An example of an auction I just lost... is this coin worth $200?
eBay Auction Link

ziggy29

This has been going on for a while. Why do you think so many shake and bakers are ruining perfectly good coins?

ceeveeNJ

Man... what a pain in the arse.
I wonder what the percentage of shaked n' baked coins are out there?

RVDavis

I was looking at a dealer's website the other night, a really highly regarded reputable dealer. There were two common date Morgans, same date and mint and same grade by the same TPG. One coin was something like $ 475, the other was over $ 2,000 just because of the toning. Yes, toners are very popular and seem to cmmand significant premiums.

kryptonitecomics

Their are no price guides for toned coins so you should bid what your comfortable paying and not any worry about whether the coin is worth say $50 bucks as a whie common date MS64. The toned coin market has never been hotter so if you are going after true rainbow toned coins then you will certainly have to place strong bids if you want to win. As for the percentage of shake and bake coins on Ebay......if we are talking raw coins...the percentages could be somewhat alarming.....if you are sticking with NGC and PCGS graded materials then your chances of buying an AT cins are very small......but not impossible.

My best advice is to educate yourself on what toning should look like on particular coin series and dates i.e. Bag, End Roll, or Album toning becuase that information along with buying Certified coins should allow you to buy solid legitimate coins. f you would like some additional help then you might want to check out the TCCS link in my signature becuase the TCCS is all about the collecting of toned cins as well as providing education around determining AT vs NT.

PM me the links to the auctions and I would be glad to give you a free assesment of the quality of the coins and personal valuation of the coins you lost out on. Good Luck!!!

BobaFett72

"if you are sticking with NGC and PCGS graded materials then your chances of buying an AT coins are very small......but not impossible"

I'm not quite sure that I agree with this statement, but with the plastic i guess you get peace of mind. But, it is possible to tone /alter a coin in a slab correct? and NGC seems to have more coins in plastic that look over the top. (they still look pretty, but I wouldnt pay extra for it) Just my humble opinion. Good posts!

braddick

Wonder coins are worth stretching for.
Remember, toned bargains on eBay are usually bargains for a reason.

Probably best to own one killer coin that you absolutely love rather than ten that are only mildly attractive, at best.

Just a thought.

kryptonitecomics

<< <i>"if you are sticking with NGC and PCGS graded materials then your chances of buying an AT coins are very small......but not impossible"

I'm not quite sure that I agree with this statement, but with the plastic i guess you get peace of mind. But, it is possible to tone /alter a coin in a slab correct? and NGC seems to have more coins in plastic that look over the top. (they still look pretty, but I wouldnt pay extra for it) Just my humble opinion. Good posts! >>




I think others would agree with you but in my personal experience.....there are not large quantities of AT'd coins in PCGS or NGC holders. Just because someone might personally think a coin doesn't look right is not proof that the toning is not legit. As for toning while inside the holders.....I would think that highly improbable on the new holders, somewhat possible on the older holders especially since none of the holders are airtite.........but I have never seen an example of a rainbow toned coin that was toned in the holder.....meaning someone taking a white coin and experimenting with trying to produce rainbow toning. I do think experiments have proven that some brown or blue toning can be generated on older holdered coins so maybe someone could post a link to those experiments.

fc

that is why you should be looking elsewhere for things
that interest you.

why follow the crowd going gaga over a bit of color?

ceeveeNJ

kryptonitecomics... I just lost another one by a couple of dollars... here is the link...

ebay Auction Link

BECOKA

<< <i>kryptonitecomics... I just lost another one by a couple of dollars... here is the link...

ebay Auction Link >>



Wow $200 for a $40 coin.

Russ

There's a pretty simple way to win. Bid higher.

Russ, NCNE

ceeveeNJ

Russ, you have the mastery of the obvious.
I'm not trying to be funny, I'm just trying to get a feel for the market and loking for opinions.

Barndog

To some degree I see the attraction with toned Morgan dollars. The coin is large and the toning can be appreciated with the unaided eye. What I don't understand are the huge prices asked (and sometimes paid) for much smaller coins, like half dimes, three centers, and the like. In order for one to appreciate toning on such coins, the coin must be imaged and the image must be enlarged. I don't see the great appeal of having to appreciate your coin from an image.

ceeveeNJ

BECOKA... a $40 dollar coin? Isn't that a *little* low?

dizzlecc

Try a different source other than ebay. The BST board from time to time will have some stuff

Other than that, be patient.

Cladiator

colors (especially blues) + eBay usually = crazy money

DUIGUY

This toner did'nt even get bid # one !

RVDavis

<< <i>BECOKA... a $40 dollar coin? Isn't that a *little* low? >>



I just looked it up on the greysheet, an NGC MS 64 1885 should run around $ 40-$44

BAJJERFAN

<< <i>Wow $200 for a $40 coin. >>



Sheet is 55/60 for a raw 64 so add a couple bux for the slab and $200 is about 3 times sheet.

RVDavis

<< <i>

<< <i>Wow $200 for a $40 coin. >>



Sheet is 55/60 for a raw 64 so add a couple bux for the slab and $200 is about 3 times sheet. >>



If one takes the NGC average of the greysheet bid/ask at 78%, we get to $4-44. That's how I came to my number.

BAJJERFAN

Why would a NGC graded coin sell at a discount to a raw coin?

kryptonitecomics

<< <i>kryptonitecomics... I just lost another one by a couple of dollars... here is the link...

ebay Auction Link >>



Consider yourself lucky as I personally don't feel that coin is worth much of a premium at all. I like Hayden and I am glad his coin pulled top dollar but realistically even in this market I would be hard pressed to pay $75 for that coin. Obviously someone else thought more highly of it which is fine but the obverse isn't very attractive to me and actually hurts the value of the coin. The reverse has a nice even shade of Blue and that by itself would have presented a coin with much more eye appeal and a price of maybe $80-$100 for me.

There really are great deals to be had....even on Ebay. If you would like my help hunting down a nice one at the right price.....just send me a pm with what you want to spend and then I'll see what I can dig up on Ebay and or a few dealers I know. Do not give up hope......you'll get one you like soon enough!

coinbuf

One thing to keep in mind, toiners are very hot right now and thus are going for moon money. Its possible that by taking your time you can find a nice example without breaking the bank.

Chris

LincolnCentMan

When dealing with toners, there's really not an accurate way of finding a true market value... saying 2x, 3x, 4x or more of standard market vaule. You just have to pay based on how well you like it, or in the case of an auction, how well the top two bidders like it. It's easy to pay mulitples of average market on lower mint state examples. I just paid $90 for a common date MS62 morgan two days ago. I paid $350 for a toner that was a $40 average market MS64 (good while back.) However, once a coin goes to 65-66-67 grades, a lot of the price is in the grade for just "nice" looking toner. Even if it's a stunner, you'll be hard pressed to find anyone that'll pay 10X sheet for a MS66 morgan. Yes, they'll bring way more than a standard one. But it's all realitive.

To each there own, but here's how I price toners I buy. I look at how well I like it, and put a price on the likeability. The more I like it, the more I'll pay. I rarely go above $500. For me to go there, it has to be one of those coins that are what I call "Holy cow" coins. Luckily, I started buying them a few years back. The market has went through the roof since I started. I have many that are well over $500 in today's market.

David

ceeveeNJ

A few more questions...


dizzlecc, what is the BST forum? Got a link?

BAJJERFAN, why would you consider this coin to be raw?

BAJJERFAN

<< <i>BAJJERFAN, why would you consider this coin to be raw? >>



I don't consider it to be raw. I was quoting greysheet prices which are sposed to be for raw coins and for an 1885 in ms64 its $55/60. Some will add a 5-10% premium to sheet price if the coin is slabbed. I was wondering why the other poster discounted the 1885 to 78% of sheet price.

AlixTCat

<< <i>This toner did'nt even get bid # one !

>>



I'd bid on it. Where was it advertised? Were you starting it at a high price?
Put it up again and I'll bid on it. But you have to tell me and give a link to the auction.

Jonathan

TomB

You wouldn't bid on it at the price it had been offered at.

Toned coins are like anything else; you should know what you are doing before attempting to spend your money.

p8nt

There are some totally sweet deals to be had on Ebay if you know how to look for them. Spend some time getting familiar with the search function and learn a bit about how people list their toners. Also looking at the images and learning to interpret them will help you a lot. If I told you anymore, I'd be putting myself out of business

Example: "MS-64 Rainbow" and "MS64 Rainbow" will bring up completely different results.